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Author Topic:   12 NOBLE GASES-COMPLETE CYCLE OF ALL
sunshaker
Member (Idle past 623 days)
Posts: 49
From: England
Joined: 10-25-2012


Message 1 of 16 (683650)
12-12-2012 11:56 AM


Sorry for the link but i have proplems posting this without loseing its structure
http://www.astralpulse.com/...s/12_noble_gases-t39064.0.html
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jar
Member
Posts: 30997
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 4.2


Message 2 of 16 (683659)
12-12-2012 12:22 PM


Funny.

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

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Theodoric
Member
Posts: 6318
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.3


Message 3 of 16 (683663)
12-12-2012 12:44 PM
Reply to: Message 2 by jar
12-12-2012 12:22 PM


pitiful

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.


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sunshaker
Member (Idle past 623 days)
Posts: 49
From: England
Joined: 10-25-2012


Message 4 of 16 (683668)
12-12-2012 1:10 PM
Reply to: Message 3 by Theodoric
12-12-2012 12:44 PM


pitiful?
I thought facts don't lie,
Show me where this fails.
The numbers speak for themselves.
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Replies to this message:
 Message 5 by Dr Adequate, posted 12-12-2012 2:09 PM sunshaker has responded

  
Dr Adequate
Member
Posts: 16097
Joined: 07-20-2006


(1)
Message 5 of 16 (683676)
12-12-2012 2:09 PM
Reply to: Message 4 by sunshaker
12-12-2012 1:10 PM


The numbers speak for themselves.

They do, do they? Let me listen to them for a moment.

OK, 19 says you're an idiot, 35 says that you're wrong, and all the even numbers less than or equal to 498 say that you don't know what you're talking about.

I must go, I have 2,395,673 on the other line. Something about how you're completely ignorant of chemistry.


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sunshaker
Member (Idle past 623 days)
Posts: 49
From: England
Joined: 10-25-2012


Message 6 of 16 (683682)
12-12-2012 2:26 PM
Reply to: Message 5 by Dr Adequate
12-12-2012 2:09 PM


Parden dr inadequate,
perhaps some of us know better than others, who are unable to think without insults.
what and where and why do you not agree with?
Or perhaps it is just to far passed your "intellect" to understand.
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Panda
Member (Idle past 1885 days)
Posts: 2688
From: UK
Joined: 10-04-2010


Message 7 of 16 (683684)
12-12-2012 2:32 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by sunshaker
12-12-2012 11:56 AM


Incorrect
sunshaker writes:

HELIUM      2
NEON 2,8
ARGON 2,8,8
KRYPTON 2,8,18,8
XENON 2,8,18,8,8
RADON 2,8,18,32,18,8
UNUNOCTIUM 2,8,18,32,32,18,8
8 2,8,18,32,32,18,18,8
9 2,8,18,18,32,32,18,18,8
10 2,8,8,18,18,32,32,18,18,8
11 2,8,8,18,18,32,32,18,18,8,8
12 2,8,8,18,18,32,32,18,18,8,8,2

XENON is wrong.
It is 2, 8, 18, 18, 8

Where did the extra '18' come from in '8', '9', '10', '11' and '12'?

Where did the extra '8's come from in '9', '10', '11' and '12'?

And your extrapolation is wrong.
To extend the pattern as you are trying to do, it would look like:

RADON       2,8,18,32,18,8
UNUNOCTIUM 2,8,18,32,32,18,8
8 2,8,18,32,32,32,18,8
9 2,8,18,32,32,32,32,18,8
10 2,8,18,32,32,32,32,32,18,8
11 2,8,18,32,32,32,32,32,32,18,8
12 2,8,18,32,32,32,32,32,32,32,18,8
So, using your logic, there is no limit to the number of possible nobel gases.
13          2,8,18,32,32,32,32,32,32,32,32,18,8
14 2,8,18,32,32,32,32,32,32,32,32,32,18,8
15 2,8,18,32,32,32,32,32,32,32,32,32,32,18,8
16 2,8,18,32,32,32,32,32,32,32,32,32,32,32,18,8

But your extrapolation is based solely on Radon and Ununoctium.
It could just as easily be:
RADON       2,8,18,32,18,8
UNUNOCTIUM 2,8,18,32,32,18,8
8 2,8,18,32,50,32,18,8
9 2,8,18,32,50,50,32,18,8
10 2,8,18,32,50,72,50,32,18,8

Edited by Panda, : No reason given.

Edited by Panda, : No reason given.


"There is no great invention, from fire to flying, which has not been hailed as an insult to some god." J. B. S. Haldane

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 Message 10 by sunshaker, posted 12-12-2012 5:25 PM Panda has responded

sunshaker
Member (Idle past 623 days)
Posts: 49
From: England
Joined: 10-25-2012


Message 8 of 16 (683688)
12-12-2012 2:49 PM
Reply to: Message 7 by Panda
12-12-2012 2:32 PM


Re: Incorrect
Yes i missed putting a 1 in xenon thank you for pointing it out.
No you cannot continue passed 12.
Where do you get your 50s 72s from,?
12 completes, you cannot just make numbers up.
THESE NUMBERS ARE NOT MADE UP, THEY ARE PART OF THE SEQUENCE.
The sequence ends at 12.
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Panda
Member (Idle past 1885 days)
Posts: 2688
From: UK
Joined: 10-04-2010


Message 9 of 16 (683690)
12-12-2012 2:58 PM
Reply to: Message 8 by sunshaker
12-12-2012 2:49 PM


Re: Incorrect
sunshaker writes:

No you cannot continue passed 12.


Why not?

sunshaker writes:

Where do you get your 50s 72s from,?


The same place the 32s came from.
It is a simple incremental progression.

sunshaker writes:

12 completes, you cannot just make numbers up.


But you did:
quote:
Where did the extra '18' come from in '8', '9', '10', '11' and '12'?
Where did the extra '8's come from in '9', '10', '11' and '12'?

sunshaker writes:

THESE NUMBERS ARE NOT MADE UP, THEY ARE PART OF THE SEQUENCE.


Then where did your extra numbers come from?

Your sequence is faulty.
I showed that in some detail.

sunshaker writes:

The sequence ends at 12.


Yes, your faulty sequence ends at 12.
But other valid sequences continue passed 12.

"There is no great invention, from fire to flying, which has not been hailed as an insult to some god." J. B. S. Haldane

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sunshaker
Member (Idle past 623 days)
Posts: 49
From: England
Joined: 10-25-2012


Message 10 of 16 (683719)
12-12-2012 5:25 PM
Reply to: Message 7 by Panda
12-12-2012 2:32 PM


Re: Incorrect
If you also notice that these elements holds all together,
Two electrons at each a point of a triangle that contains all.
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Coragyps
Member
Posts: 5393
From: Snyder, Texas, USA
Joined: 11-12-2002
Member Rating: 3.5


Message 11 of 16 (683721)
12-12-2012 5:29 PM
Reply to: Message 10 by sunshaker
12-12-2012 5:25 PM


Re: Incorrect
Questions for you, sunshaker:

how many electrons fill an s suborbital?
How many in a p?
A d?
An f?
a g?

Hint: the answers add to a number larger than 32.

You are talking nonsense.


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Replies to this message:
 Message 13 by foreveryoung, posted 12-12-2012 5:53 PM Coragyps has responded

  
Panda
Member (Idle past 1885 days)
Posts: 2688
From: UK
Joined: 10-04-2010


(1)
Message 12 of 16 (683722)
12-12-2012 5:31 PM
Reply to: Message 10 by sunshaker
12-12-2012 5:25 PM


Re: Incorrect
sunshaker writes:

If you also notice that these elements holds all together,
Two electrons at each a point of a triangle that contains all.


Since you are unable to answer any questions or justify your claims, I see little point in continuing.

I second Theodoric's response: pitiful.

Edited by Panda, : No reason given.


"There is no great invention, from fire to flying, which has not been hailed as an insult to some god." J. B. S. Haldane

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foreveryoung
Member
Posts: 920
Joined: 12-26-2011


(1)
Message 13 of 16 (683726)
12-12-2012 5:53 PM
Reply to: Message 11 by Coragyps
12-12-2012 5:29 PM


Re: Incorrect
I don't think he knows anything about suborbitals or the quantum mechanics reasoning behind the number of electrons in each orbital.

Edited by foreveryoung, : No reason given.


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 Message 11 by Coragyps, posted 12-12-2012 5:29 PM Coragyps has responded

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kofh2u
Member (Idle past 1993 days)
Posts: 1162
From: phila., PA
Joined: 04-05-2004


Message 14 of 16 (683731)
12-12-2012 6:39 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by sunshaker
12-12-2012 11:56 AM


12 noble gases

I like the idea but it violated that Quantum Rule that allows 2n^2 electrons per orbit.

When you assume we could discover an 8Th shell, the total number of electrons in that shell would be 2(8)^2 = 128 electrons.

Your scheme shows that orbit eight is holding only 18 electrons before a 9th, 10th, 11th, and 12th shell opens.

And, if you had a point, the more than seven (7) Noble Gases could exist, the Electron Configuration Code which addresses each electron in an Atom whould apparently open a 7d sub-orbital before and eigth shell appeared.

Edited by kofh2u, : No reason given.


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Coragyps
Member
Posts: 5393
From: Snyder, Texas, USA
Joined: 11-12-2002
Member Rating: 3.5


Message 15 of 16 (683734)
12-12-2012 7:40 PM
Reply to: Message 13 by foreveryoung
12-12-2012 5:53 PM


Re: Incorrect
i will bet a big bottle of bad vodka that you are correct about that......
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