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EvC Forum Side Orders Coffee House Gun Control Again

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Author Topic:   Gun Control Again
Heathen
Member (Idle past 1397 days)
Posts: 1067
From: Brizzle
Joined: 09-20-2005


Message 235 of 5179 (684323)
12-17-2012 6:50 AM
Reply to: Message 76 by jar
12-15-2012 8:35 AM


Re: guns versus mentality
but that does not imply that I will not need to be armed
by that logic you should carry around an RPG, and maybe a tactical nuke... and some ricin,
Y'know.. just in case

This message is a reply to:
 Message 76 by jar, posted 12-15-2012 8:35 AM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 251 by jar, posted 12-17-2012 10:52 AM Heathen has replied

Heathen
Member (Idle past 1397 days)
Posts: 1067
From: Brizzle
Joined: 09-20-2005


Message 376 of 5179 (684609)
12-18-2012 4:36 AM
Reply to: Message 251 by jar
12-17-2012 10:52 AM


Re: guns versus mentality
the logic of you being armed escapes me.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 251 by jar, posted 12-17-2012 10:52 AM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 395 by jar, posted 12-18-2012 9:00 AM Heathen has replied

Heathen
Member (Idle past 1397 days)
Posts: 1067
From: Brizzle
Joined: 09-20-2005


Message 396 of 5179 (684634)
12-18-2012 9:14 AM
Reply to: Message 395 by jar
12-18-2012 9:00 AM


Re: guns versus mentality
it will be a rather boring discussion
why would you change the habit of a lifetime?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 395 by jar, posted 12-18-2012 9:00 AM jar has seen this message but not replied

Heathen
Member (Idle past 1397 days)
Posts: 1067
From: Brizzle
Joined: 09-20-2005


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Message 593 of 5179 (685033)
12-20-2012 8:33 AM
Reply to: Message 585 by Faith
12-19-2012 11:30 PM


Re: Lose your gun rights, expect loss of all your other freedoms
other kinds of crimes are treated as trivial although they victimize innocent people and can ruin their lives.
Is there a crime more serious than murder?
The guy killing someone in the defence of his house is as bad as the guy breaking in.
Yes. But the guy killing in defence of himself or his family is not.
Do you feel that the penalty for burglary is death issued through summary justice? Do you think there could be any scope for error in this situation?
Ezekiel McCarthy killed nephew mistaken for burglar - BBC News
To prevent the murders we've been seeing more and more of the solution is NOT gun bans and gun control.
where have we seen this?
The solution is to have some kind of security in place to stop such things from happening, whether that means allowing the arming of personnel or hiring security guards.
So.. Armed guards? armed teachers? armed janitors? armed children maybe?
What kind of world do you want to live in? one where everyone walks around armed to the teeth teetering on the edge of a gunfight? you can watch westerns to get your fix of that.
The crazies are choosing the locations where guns are not allowed because they can get away with their murders there but everybody irrationally screams MORE GUN CONTROl anyway.
So where do the crazies buy their guns?
... the second party could be a provocateur and the intention was to provoke the murderous rampage by the first and then disappear, and the ultimate objective is to kill the second amendment, to disarm the country and set us up for government or other tyranny. Yes, I suspect a conspiracy, could be wrong, could just be lone crazies, but I suspect it, largely because of this illogical but predictable cry for gun control after every such incident.
So... You think that gun control proponents are provoking/instigating mass shootings of elementary school children, in order to further the gun control cause. Are you serious? your paranoia is reaching crisis levels. You sure the catholic church doesn't have a hand in it somehow?
And now it looks like they are going to do it to us, they've got the momentum they wanted from this evil murderous rampage, they've got people crying for gun control over the most hideous nightmarish murder imaginable so they've got the excuse they've been looking for and they're now going to take some of our guns away from us.
If you have any compassion or respect for human life you must understand that taking guns out of circulation is the way to prevent death by gunshot. why is that not obvious to you? what kind of twisted mental blinkers to you need to engage for that not to be screamingly obvious.
But crime would GO DOWN if citizen gun owners' rights were defended instead of restricted to the point that guns aren't available or usable when needed.
So in order to prevent burglaries you think it's ok to sacrifice the odd 20 schoolchildren here and there? is your TV or jewellery really that important to you?
What did Jesus have to say about that?

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 Message 585 by Faith, posted 12-19-2012 11:30 PM Faith has not replied

Heathen
Member (Idle past 1397 days)
Posts: 1067
From: Brizzle
Joined: 09-20-2005


Message 596 of 5179 (685037)
12-20-2012 8:48 AM
Reply to: Message 595 by Faith
12-20-2012 8:44 AM


Lanza Was a law abiding citizen right up until the moment he started shooting

This message is a reply to:
 Message 595 by Faith, posted 12-20-2012 8:44 AM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 597 by Faith, posted 12-20-2012 8:50 AM Heathen has replied

Heathen
Member (Idle past 1397 days)
Posts: 1067
From: Brizzle
Joined: 09-20-2005


Message 599 of 5179 (685040)
12-20-2012 8:59 AM
Reply to: Message 597 by Faith
12-20-2012 8:50 AM


the point is that tightening gun availability for criminals would not have prevented Connecticut, or aurora or most of the other mass shootings, as the perpetrators were not criminals.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 597 by Faith, posted 12-20-2012 8:50 AM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 603 by Faith, posted 12-20-2012 10:16 AM Heathen has replied

Heathen
Member (Idle past 1397 days)
Posts: 1067
From: Brizzle
Joined: 09-20-2005


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Message 606 of 5179 (685057)
12-20-2012 10:27 AM
Reply to: Message 603 by Faith
12-20-2012 10:16 AM


I was not addressing the Connecticut situation or similar occurrences at that time which I'd addressed before as being best dealt with by installing solme sort of security measures, whether arming personnel or hiring guards. It's practical.
So having a gunfight at the schoolgates between a guard and a nutball is a better option that the guns not being present at all?
The problem is that criminals manage to get hold of weapons no matter what laws are in place and since by definition they ignore laws anyway we need COUNTERFORCE to deal with them.
But these shooters were NOT CRIMINALS, they were by all accounts quite mild mannered law abiding people. In Lanza's case the guns he used were his mothers, legally held weapons. He picked them up without challenge or difficulty. COUNTEFORCE will only lead to an escalation. Bigger guns, better, more deadly weaponry to ensure the counterforce is countered.
I do beliieve that these mass murderers would very likely not have risked it in any situation where they knew there could be guns aimed at them.
I DO believe that these mild mannered, otherwise law abiding citizens would not have killed people if guns were not freely available to them. Given that they invariably shoot themselves or attempt to do so, suggests that the threat of death would not act as a deterrent, and would more likely lead to a more elaborate plan to disable the guard and THEN proceed to mass murder.
Edited by Heathen, : No reason given.
Edited by Heathen, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 603 by Faith, posted 12-20-2012 10:16 AM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 607 by Faith, posted 12-20-2012 10:47 AM Heathen has not replied

Heathen
Member (Idle past 1397 days)
Posts: 1067
From: Brizzle
Joined: 09-20-2005


(1)
Message 1359 of 5179 (688353)
01-22-2013 2:38 AM
Reply to: Message 1358 by Faith
01-21-2013 11:21 PM


Re: The Un-American Mind
Meanwhile it can't hurt to argue for the Second Amendment, because if that falls, then I would KNOW that God isn't going to have mercy on us, it's all over for sure.
Eh?
SO god's mercy for mankind hinges on the 2nd amendment of the US constitution?
What utter, utter bollocks! Do you simply spit this crap out as it pops into your brain? you should try reading it over and filtering it as you are making yourself seem completely insane.
I'm becoming more and more convinced that you're nothing more than a troll because what you write cannot come from a mind that is balanced or healthy.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1358 by Faith, posted 01-21-2013 11:21 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1361 by Faith, posted 01-22-2013 3:33 AM Heathen has replied

Heathen
Member (Idle past 1397 days)
Posts: 1067
From: Brizzle
Joined: 09-20-2005


(1)
Message 1367 of 5179 (688366)
01-22-2013 6:32 AM
Reply to: Message 1361 by Faith
01-22-2013 3:33 AM


Re: God's judgments on America, gun control a sign
But if the Second Amendment really goes under I'll consider that to be the sign He isn't going to have mercy on us at all
what basis have you got for this assumption? do you think god wants everyone armed to the teeth? why?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1361 by Faith, posted 01-22-2013 3:33 AM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1368 by vimesey, posted 01-22-2013 6:54 AM Heathen has not replied
 Message 1370 by Straggler, posted 01-22-2013 7:56 AM Heathen has not replied
 Message 1376 by Faith, posted 01-22-2013 12:54 PM Heathen has replied

Heathen
Member (Idle past 1397 days)
Posts: 1067
From: Brizzle
Joined: 09-20-2005


(1)
Message 1409 of 5179 (688502)
01-23-2013 2:05 AM
Reply to: Message 1376 by Faith
01-22-2013 12:54 PM


Re: God's judgments on America, gun control a sign
So you don't entertain that the constitution maybe, just maybe out of date and incorrect on this issue? on any issues?
Do you see the constitution as infallible? unchanging? inerrant truth?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1376 by Faith, posted 01-22-2013 12:54 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1411 by Faith, posted 01-23-2013 3:26 AM Heathen has replied
 Message 1424 by ICANT, posted 01-24-2013 12:06 AM Heathen has replied

Heathen
Member (Idle past 1397 days)
Posts: 1067
From: Brizzle
Joined: 09-20-2005


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(1)
Message 1413 of 5179 (688507)
01-23-2013 7:55 AM
Reply to: Message 1411 by Faith
01-23-2013 3:26 AM


Re: Constitution
Are there any currently existing amendments to the constitution that you disagree with?
Any that you may have thought were a "vicious propaganda campaign" against the previous incarnation of the constitution?
there is now building up a similar propaganda campaign to denigrate the Constitution, as "antiquated," even as "evil."
Is this not the very reason that the current "Amendments" exist? That previously the constitution was not considered effective or relevant in certain areas?
this process of amendments should surely continue to best serve and suit the society the constitution is suppose to serve.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1411 by Faith, posted 01-23-2013 3:26 AM Faith has not replied

Heathen
Member (Idle past 1397 days)
Posts: 1067
From: Brizzle
Joined: 09-20-2005


(1)
(1)
Message 1414 of 5179 (688508)
01-23-2013 8:16 AM
Reply to: Message 1411 by Faith
01-23-2013 3:26 AM


Re: Constitution
merely somebody's agenda put into a form that can sway opinion, using belittling judgmental terms.
seems to me to be an accurate description of organised religion..

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1411 by Faith, posted 01-23-2013 3:26 AM Faith has not replied

Heathen
Member (Idle past 1397 days)
Posts: 1067
From: Brizzle
Joined: 09-20-2005


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(1)
Message 1429 of 5179 (688641)
01-24-2013 1:51 AM
Reply to: Message 1424 by ICANT
01-24-2013 12:06 AM


Re: God's judgments on America, gun control a sign
What would make the constitution out of date concerning the second amendment?
the notion that an armed civilian militia could somehow stop the force of the US army under the control of the "Tyrannical" goverment
Whether the constitution is infallible or not makes no difference it is the law of the land
It makes a huge difference if that constitution is out dated and out moded, then the law is not working to the benefit of the citizens.
The constitution is unchanging.
But the constitution can be changed
er... right...

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1424 by ICANT, posted 01-24-2013 12:06 AM ICANT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1435 by ICANT, posted 01-24-2013 1:06 PM Heathen has not replied

Heathen
Member (Idle past 1397 days)
Posts: 1067
From: Brizzle
Joined: 09-20-2005


(1)
Message 1485 of 5179 (688754)
01-25-2013 4:03 AM
Reply to: Message 1438 by ICANT
01-24-2013 1:45 PM


Re: God's judgments on America, gun control a sign
I was replying to the statement "er... right...". Which was concerning how the constitution could be changed
No, the "err...Right" comment was relating to your contradictory statements re: unchanging but can be changed.
the mechanism for amending the constitution does not concern me, my point was that it can, is, and should be changed where necessary.
The Idea that the second amendment is some holy text that shall never be removed is barmy. If and when it no longer applies to the society it is supposed to serve it should be changed.
i.e. there is NO GOOD REASON for US citizens to have assault rifles.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1438 by ICANT, posted 01-24-2013 1:45 PM ICANT has not replied

Heathen
Member (Idle past 1397 days)
Posts: 1067
From: Brizzle
Joined: 09-20-2005


(8)
(1)
Message 1563 of 5179 (689391)
01-30-2013 9:55 AM
Reply to: Message 1561 by ICANT
01-29-2013 11:48 PM


Re: Here you go
From what I read that was not a justified shoot and the homeowner will go to jail.
So an innocent man is dead, a family has lost a son, brother, possibly a father and the silly old man will go to jail.
but don't worry, cos your right to own and hold a gun is safe. That's what's important here right?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1561 by ICANT, posted 01-29-2013 11:48 PM ICANT has seen this message but not replied

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