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EvC Forum Side Orders Coffee House Gun Control Again

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Author Topic:   Gun Control Again
caffeine
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Posts: 1699
From: Prague, Czech Republic
Joined: 10-22-2008
Member Rating: 2.7


Message 2323 of 5179 (717572)
01-29-2014 9:31 AM
Reply to: Message 2318 by Theodoric
01-28-2014 11:32 AM


Re: No one is attacking you
Killed does not equal(is there a way to make that symbol?) homicide. If you wanted to make that clarification you need to actually say that.

I've been grappling with this one a bit, but I'm at something of a loss. Which people kiled by firearms were not homicides? Whether you're shot on purpose or by accident, by yourself or by somebody else, it's all homicide. I suppose you could have been killed when a gun fell on your head, being dislodged in an earthquake perhaps; or maybe some animal could accidentally pull the trigger. In searching I did find two examples of dogs accidentally setting off guns and shooting their owners, but neither died.


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caffeine
Member
Posts: 1699
From: Prague, Czech Republic
Joined: 10-22-2008
Member Rating: 2.7


Message 2333 of 5179 (717745)
01-31-2014 8:04 AM
Reply to: Message 2330 by ramoss
01-29-2014 2:23 PM


The meaning of words
In legalize, the term homicide is means the deliberate taking of anothers life.. .i.e. murder.

While it appears I was incorrect that suicide is legally classed as homicide, homicide is not equivalent to murder in legalese. Involuntary manslaughter is a type of homicide. Killing someone by accident isn't equivalent to manslaughter, either. For it to be manslaughter it has to be done as part of a criminal act, or be criminally negligent. Self-defence, or blameless accidents, are classed as justifiable homicides.


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caffeine
Member
Posts: 1699
From: Prague, Czech Republic
Joined: 10-22-2008
Member Rating: 2.7


Message 4525 of 5179 (775266)
12-30-2015 4:54 PM
Reply to: Message 4522 by Percy
12-30-2015 2:01 PM


Suicides
Having a gun in a farmhouse in a rural place in Missouri does elevate the risk for suicide, but probably has limited or no effect on street or community violence. The availability of guns increases the chance of lethal outcomes. The vast majority of people who attempt suicide by means other than a gun go on to survive.

This is an issue which I feel is addressed relatively little in gun control debates, which is surprising considering that the number of people who intentionally shoot themselves annually in the US is about double the number intentionally shot by other people, according to CDC stats. A small majority of US suicides are done with guns.

I can't help but feel that having a gun in your home dramatically increases the risk of someone with suicidal inclinations going ahead with the act, whereas if they didn't have such an easily available and potentially painless option available they'd still be alive the following day when the feeling had passed.

I do find it hard to justify gun control on this basis philosophically, however. More deaths are caused annually in the US by drugs than guns, after all, and I have always argued against drug prohibition on the grounds that the state has no right to limit my freedom to protect me from my own decisions. Wouldn't the same logic apply to guns?

I'm also unconvinced by the gun-suicide link - even though it seems so intuitively obvious. The US certainly has a high suicide rate, but there are other developed countries, such as Belgium, where an even higher proportion manage to kill themselves despite strict gun laws (The UK's suicide rate, incidentally, is identical the the rate of suicide by means other than firearms in the US, but I suspect this is fortuitous coincidence).

There's no conclusion to this post, I'm just thinking aloud (or whatever the equivalent term would be for typing).


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