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EvC Forum Side Orders Coffee House Gun Control Again

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Author Topic:   Gun Control Again
mram10
Member (Idle past 1756 days)
Posts: 84
Joined: 08-07-2012


Message 2760 of 5179 (733335)
07-16-2014 11:48 AM
Reply to: Message 2759 by New Cat's Eye
07-16-2014 10:52 AM


Why are we arguing gun control, when alcohol related deaths are much more frequent?
Why are we blaming an inanimate object for the problems PEOPLE are causing?
As for criminals, why should we give them another chance to rape/kill or steal from someone else that cannot protect themselves?
This message is a reply to:
 Message 2759 by New Cat's Eye, posted 07-16-2014 10:52 AM New Cat's Eye has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 2761 by New Cat's Eye, posted 07-16-2014 12:17 PM mram10 has acknowledged this reply
 Message 2762 by ringo, posted 07-16-2014 12:32 PM mram10 has responded
 Message 2763 by Straggler, posted 07-16-2014 12:59 PM mram10 has acknowledged this reply
 Message 2765 by Dr Adequate, posted 07-17-2014 12:24 AM mram10 has responded

  
mram10
Member (Idle past 1756 days)
Posts: 84
Joined: 08-07-2012


Message 2764 of 5179 (733396)
07-17-2014 12:09 AM
Reply to: Message 2762 by ringo
07-16-2014 12:32 PM


We already have numerous gun laws, thus gun control. Why do we need more. Those committing crimes are breaking numerous laws already, so what will more laws bring?

As for america being second to last, where are you finding this info?? I have been around the world in numerous jobs in differing lives(jobs) and can name numerous countries that have mass killing daily.

Also, murder rates are not gun centric. Love to see a breakdown of each type.

Vehicles can be used just like guns to kill people. Should we get rid of cars? No, because they are useful and being used wrong, just like guns. With the average response time in my city of over 10 min (detroit was much worse), I would prefer to have the chance to defend myself from a criminal. If you do not want that, then please give me your guns

Does anyone even know the true meaning of the 2nd??? Jefferson said it best, when he made it clear it is to defend the people from tyranny by the gov't. If you believe it isn't possible, then I cannot help you.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 2762 by ringo, posted 07-16-2014 12:32 PM ringo has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 2766 by NoNukes, posted 07-17-2014 12:29 AM mram10 has acknowledged this reply
 Message 2768 by Minnemooseus, posted 07-17-2014 12:49 AM mram10 has acknowledged this reply
 Message 2776 by ringo, posted 07-17-2014 12:12 PM mram10 has acknowledged this reply

  
mram10
Member (Idle past 1756 days)
Posts: 84
Joined: 08-07-2012


Message 2767 of 5179 (733404)
07-17-2014 12:39 AM
Reply to: Message 2765 by Dr Adequate
07-17-2014 12:24 AM


I have never blacked out due to shooting too much
I have never woke up next to a perfect stranger due to a gun in my hand
I have never been in a traffic accident due to my gun on the seat
Alcohol changes your mind set and makes you unaware of your decisions, thus putting those around you in danger.
Guns do not. Please argue this intelligibly
This message is a reply to:
 Message 2765 by Dr Adequate, posted 07-17-2014 12:24 AM Dr Adequate has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 2769 by Dr Adequate, posted 07-17-2014 1:13 AM mram10 has acknowledged this reply

  
mram10
Member (Idle past 1756 days)
Posts: 84
Joined: 08-07-2012


Message 2796 of 5179 (733521)
07-17-2014 9:32 PM
Reply to: Message 2795 by Percy
07-17-2014 9:04 PM


I will keep my guns to protect my family and you guys are welcome to waive your right to them. You are also free to waive anti-biotics, healthy living and anything else that is considered a safety measure.

For those that want to wait for the police, set a timer to 10 minutes, best case and picture yourself in your home with a couple perps with knives etc. They can do a lot of damage in 1 minute, let alone 10.

Guns don't kill people, people do I question the sanity of any fool that says otherwise.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 2795 by Percy, posted 07-17-2014 9:04 PM Percy has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 2797 by Coragyps, posted 07-17-2014 9:35 PM mram10 has acknowledged this reply
 Message 2798 by Minnemooseus, posted 07-17-2014 9:52 PM mram10 has responded
 Message 2804 by vimesey, posted 07-18-2014 4:02 AM mram10 has acknowledged this reply
 Message 2808 by Percy, posted 07-18-2014 9:29 AM mram10 has responded

  
mram10
Member (Idle past 1756 days)
Posts: 84
Joined: 08-07-2012


Message 2799 of 5179 (733531)
07-17-2014 10:07 PM
Reply to: Message 2798 by Minnemooseus
07-17-2014 9:52 PM


Re: So, you like people having weapons of mass destruction?
Your arguments are illogical. You have shown yourself to be a person that regurgitates talking points and lacks the ability to think reasonably.

You are blaming an inanimate object???? Stabbings? Do you get out much? Stabbings and beatings are very frequent. Continue to drink the kool-aid though. Check the FBI stats for murders and assaults by weapon type. Look at the states that have the most, then look at their gun laws.

Again, feel free to exercise your right to be unarmed. As for me, I want the criminal to fear me and those who I am responsible to protect. Also, I am the one who will shoot an intruder, because he is there with evil intentions.

IT IS NOT THE GUNS. IT IS THE PEOPLE.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 2798 by Minnemooseus, posted 07-17-2014 9:52 PM Minnemooseus has acknowledged this reply

Replies to this message:
 Message 2800 by Coragyps, posted 07-17-2014 10:28 PM mram10 has responded
 Message 2811 by ringo, posted 07-18-2014 11:54 AM mram10 has responded

  
mram10
Member (Idle past 1756 days)
Posts: 84
Joined: 08-07-2012


Message 2801 of 5179 (733538)
07-17-2014 11:20 PM
Reply to: Message 2800 by Coragyps
07-17-2014 10:28 PM


Re: So, you like people having weapons of mass destruction?
Coragyps,
Very gentlemanly of you to defend moose
As for my arguments, please read above so I don't have to spell it out again. If enough criminals get killed by law abiding citizens protecting themselves, they will start to question their illegal and wicked ways.
Your arguments are ridiculous, but I expected it, so luckily it wasn't a surprise

Please feel free to disarm yourself. You have my utmost support. Many criminals can be talked into changing their ways.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 2800 by Coragyps, posted 07-17-2014 10:28 PM Coragyps has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 2803 by Dr Adequate, posted 07-18-2014 3:45 AM mram10 has responded
 Message 2812 by ringo, posted 07-18-2014 11:57 AM mram10 has acknowledged this reply

  
mram10
Member (Idle past 1756 days)
Posts: 84
Joined: 08-07-2012


Message 2821 of 5179 (733619)
07-19-2014 12:18 PM
Reply to: Message 2803 by Dr Adequate
07-18-2014 3:45 AM


Re: So, you like people having weapons of mass destruction?
If enough criminals get killed by law abiding citizens protecting themselves, they will start to question their illegal and wicked ways.

You'd be astonished how little time dead people spend on introspection.

It seems that all 12000 of your posts contributed about this much to the conversations So, when you cannot add to the debate intelligently, you make these type of comments. When criminals are threatened, they will not commit the crimes. I am starting to question if you are one.....


This message is a reply to:
 Message 2803 by Dr Adequate, posted 07-18-2014 3:45 AM Dr Adequate has not yet responded

  
mram10
Member (Idle past 1756 days)
Posts: 84
Joined: 08-07-2012


Message 2822 of 5179 (733621)
07-19-2014 12:25 PM
Reply to: Message 2807 by Theodoric
07-18-2014 8:58 AM


Re: It doesn't add up
Well according to the opinions presented here, in most part, I should live in the state with the highest homicide rate.
Why do the gun nuts always use strawman arguments?

The highest homicide rate in Canada is in Nunavut, 15/100,000. Is it the guns? No I think it's because the place is filled with Nunavut Indians and they think different than White Europeans.
Oh yeah of course the obligatory racism.

Looks like you cannot debate his points logically, so you revert to the standard "gun nut" and "racism" terms Love it! Now, let's try to use logical arguments.

Quick question: If i brought up the fact that black on black crime is higher than other demographics, would that be racist? What if I were referring to a valid study? Still racist? What if I were black? And, what exactly is a "gun nut"?

Edited by mram10, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 2807 by Theodoric, posted 07-18-2014 8:58 AM Theodoric has not yet responded

  
mram10
Member (Idle past 1756 days)
Posts: 84
Joined: 08-07-2012


Message 2823 of 5179 (733622)
07-19-2014 12:30 PM
Reply to: Message 2806 by Straggler
07-18-2014 7:45 AM


Re: It doesn't add up
Straggler,
I would argue the validity of that study, based on my experience with those that own numerous guns. Also, they need to include the demographics of those committing the crimes, as well as numerous other variables. Number of inanimate objects (guns) would not make any sense in controlling the human mind

I'm sure Harvard is not biased. Should I bring NRA studies to the table also? I am guessing you would make the same argument.

Edited by mram10, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 2806 by Straggler, posted 07-18-2014 7:45 AM Straggler has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 2838 by Straggler, posted 07-20-2014 1:33 PM mram10 has responded
 Message 2845 by Straggler, posted 07-21-2014 11:54 AM mram10 has not yet responded
 Message 2846 by Dr Adequate, posted 07-21-2014 7:09 PM mram10 has not yet responded

  
mram10
Member (Idle past 1756 days)
Posts: 84
Joined: 08-07-2012


Message 2824 of 5179 (733623)
07-19-2014 12:35 PM
Reply to: Message 2808 by Percy
07-18-2014 9:29 AM


I will keep my guns to protect my family...

The most likely use of a gun kept in a family setting is against a family member or friend. Owning a gun puts a family at greater, not lesser, risk.

How would you reduce gun deaths in this country?

--Percy

Where is your evidence?? As a scientist, I don't just throw out blanket irrational statements as fact

I am sure it is easier to jump on the left wing bandwagon to feel like one of the "cool kids", but you risk looking foolish when you make unfounded and false comments just to push your agenda.

Edited by mram10, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 2808 by Percy, posted 07-18-2014 9:29 AM Percy has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 2828 by NoNukes, posted 07-19-2014 1:08 PM mram10 has responded
 Message 2831 by Percy, posted 07-19-2014 7:12 PM mram10 has acknowledged this reply

  
mram10
Member (Idle past 1756 days)
Posts: 84
Joined: 08-07-2012


Message 2825 of 5179 (733624)
07-19-2014 12:39 PM
Reply to: Message 2811 by ringo
07-18-2014 11:54 AM


Re: So, you like people having weapons of mass destruction?
IT IS NOT THE GUNS. IT IS THE PEOPLE.

It's the people who have guns. Some of them shouldn't.

That is a great idea. Maybe we should make laws stating felons shouldn't have them. Wait a minute ....

Let me guess, you are against the death penalty. Is that true?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 2811 by ringo, posted 07-18-2014 11:54 AM ringo has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 2826 by ringo, posted 07-19-2014 12:49 PM mram10 has responded

  
mram10
Member (Idle past 1756 days)
Posts: 84
Joined: 08-07-2012


Message 2827 of 5179 (733631)
07-19-2014 12:57 PM
Reply to: Message 2826 by ringo
07-19-2014 12:49 PM


Re: So, you like people having weapons of mass destruction?
mram10 writes:

Maybe we should make laws stating felons shouldn't have them.

Felons aren't the only problem. The guy who has never committed a felony until he shoots his wife in a jealous rage is also a problem.

The real root problem is that Americans tend to think they can "protect themselves" with guns.

How many "jealous rage" murders have we had?? I didn't know it was legal. Maybe we should start by taking the guns of those that choose to use alcohol, drugs (illegal and legal), etc.

As for your "root" problem, I would argue it is the moral condition of people. The steel, rubber, plastic and wood do not soak through your skin and cause you to go on a rampage.

Weird that "Americans" think that a gun can increase your self defense ability This is a ridiculous statement. Speaking of drugs ..... nevermind

mram10 writes:

Let me guess, you are against the death penalty. Is that true?

I'd be happy to discuss the death penalty in a topic about the death penalty. Feel free to start one.

Oh, let's do I will get right on that.

Edited by mram10, : No reason given.

Edited by mram10, : No reason given.

Edited by mram10, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 2826 by ringo, posted 07-19-2014 12:49 PM ringo has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 2829 by ringo, posted 07-19-2014 1:08 PM mram10 has acknowledged this reply

  
mram10
Member (Idle past 1756 days)
Posts: 84
Joined: 08-07-2012


Message 2832 of 5179 (733659)
07-19-2014 7:57 PM
Reply to: Message 2828 by NoNukes
07-19-2014 1:08 PM


NoNukes writes:
You are gaining a reputation here as being a blowhard with nothing much to say. Your disdain for the posters who disagree with you is also quite clear. It is also misplaced. Everyone here is just as smart as you.

The opinions of those that disregard everything said that doesn't agree with their view, and loves to make snide comments about "creationists" is "misplaced".

Take a look at my past questions and the response it got from biased people on here, that simply made rude comments with no scientific answers. If you agree they are in the right acting like this, then your opinion doesn't matter to me


This message is a reply to:
 Message 2828 by NoNukes, posted 07-19-2014 1:08 PM NoNukes has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 2833 by Dr Adequate, posted 07-19-2014 8:33 PM mram10 has acknowledged this reply
 Message 2834 by NoNukes, posted 07-20-2014 12:44 AM mram10 has responded

  
mram10
Member (Idle past 1756 days)
Posts: 84
Joined: 08-07-2012


Message 2835 of 5179 (733688)
07-20-2014 12:09 PM
Reply to: Message 2834 by NoNukes
07-20-2014 12:44 AM


NoNukes,
The most likely use of a gun kept in a family setting is against a family member or friend. Owning a gun puts a family at greater, not lesser, risk.

How would you reduce gun deaths in this country?

--Percy

You consider that hard? "Most likely", based on what? How would I reduce gun deaths? Let's start by changing people's hearts, mind set, etc. Logically, you cannot blame a gun for what a person decides to do with it.

Also, stop being dishonest. I never called anyone a "non-scientist" before engaging them. That came after rude and off topic comments by those.

Either way, let's get back on topic. Gun control (or any other control) will not work while people with wicked intentions wish to act on them. It is like the knife laws out there. Will allowing people to carry 4" or less knives stop crime by wicked people? No.

Also, It is funny when some posters choose to give the benefit of the doubt to the criminal. You cannot mind read and do not know the intentions of someone breaking into your house. If you choose to give them the benefit of the doubt, enjoy yourself

As for thinking you are idiots, I think those attacking me are biased and afraid of anyone bringing questions to the table that do not agree with their ideas. I have learned a lot on this site, so intelligence is here. I am just no the type to sit by and have someone attack me after a simple question, without acknowledging their attack.

Edited by mram10, : No reason given.

Edited by mram10, : No reason given.

Edited by mram10, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 2834 by NoNukes, posted 07-20-2014 12:44 AM NoNukes has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 2836 by NoNukes, posted 07-20-2014 12:47 PM mram10 has responded
 Message 2837 by Coragyps, posted 07-20-2014 1:05 PM mram10 has acknowledged this reply

  
mram10
Member (Idle past 1756 days)
Posts: 84
Joined: 08-07-2012


Message 2839 of 5179 (733705)
07-20-2014 2:30 PM
Reply to: Message 2838 by Straggler
07-20-2014 1:33 PM


Re: It doesn't add up
The pro- gun lobby go through predictable cycles. First they deny correlation. Then they say "correlation is not causation"(or words to that effect). Then they start citing causal relationships which dont stand up to evidential scrutiny (e.g. homicidal people seek out guns thus explaining the correlation between guns and homicides)

Where are you at in that cycle? Denying evidence or proclaiming evidence of correlation as on your side...?

For some strange reason, I am on the side of people make choices You could give me a big red nuke button and I would not push it because, wait for it ....... it is wrong! Maybe that is the downfall of less evolved people that were taught to "love God and love your neighbor as yourself" growing up

What does pro-gun lobby have to do with me? I don't get a check for supporting gun laws. I have a logical test I follow

Is my family safer with my ability to defend them, with or without a gun?
Is trusting the police to respond before damage is done to my family logical?
Will this gun change me in a way that causes me to be a danger to those around me?

Maybe animals that choose not to control their urges have a problem with weapons, but I don't. Maybe I am just more highly evolved


This message is a reply to:
 Message 2838 by Straggler, posted 07-20-2014 1:33 PM Straggler has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 2841 by Percy, posted 07-20-2014 3:22 PM mram10 has not yet responded
 Message 2842 by Straggler, posted 07-20-2014 3:32 PM mram10 has not yet responded

  
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