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Author Topic:   Who Made God?
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1472 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 485 of 868 (855552)
06-20-2019 1:19 PM
Reply to: Message 481 by Tanypteryx
06-20-2019 12:08 PM


Re: The Evidence Is The Believers Themselves
...there is no convincing evidence that you are not deluded.
I believe the scientific view is that you can't make a judgment based on an absence of evidence.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 481 by Tanypteryx, posted 06-20-2019 12:08 PM Tanypteryx has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 486 by AZPaul3, posted 06-20-2019 1:37 PM Faith has replied
 Message 499 by Tanypteryx, posted 06-20-2019 5:53 PM Faith has not replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1472 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 487 of 868 (855566)
06-20-2019 1:44 PM
Reply to: Message 486 by AZPaul3
06-20-2019 1:37 PM


Re: The Evidence Is The Believers Themselves
OK, but in the case of religious belief, you do have the evidence of millions of fellow human beings who believe in some version or other of religious or supernatural phenomena. When I was an unbeliever I couldn't bring myself to assume they were deluded so I had to count their belief as evidence though it wasn't enough to make me a believer against my own personal lack of evidence. But that still seems to me to be the rational thing to do, as opposed to dismissing huge numbers of human beings as deluded.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 486 by AZPaul3, posted 06-20-2019 1:37 PM AZPaul3 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 488 by AZPaul3, posted 06-20-2019 1:53 PM Faith has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1472 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 489 of 868 (855574)
06-20-2019 2:31 PM
Reply to: Message 488 by AZPaul3
06-20-2019 1:53 PM


Re: The Evidence Is The Believers Themselves
Yeah I can't answer that so kill me already. I have to depend on knowing that Christianity is the truth and has been the greatest force for good on the planet ever, and if you don't get it so what. And actually you are wrong, anyone who really thinks about it knows Christianity is the truth, all the rest is satanic bias.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 488 by AZPaul3, posted 06-20-2019 1:53 PM AZPaul3 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 490 by AZPaul3, posted 06-20-2019 2:44 PM Faith has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1472 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 491 of 868 (855578)
06-20-2019 3:11 PM
Reply to: Message 490 by AZPaul3
06-20-2019 2:44 PM


Re: The Evidence Is The Believers Themselves
Where do you get that crap? Have you bothered to read the gospels?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 490 by AZPaul3, posted 06-20-2019 2:44 PM AZPaul3 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 492 by AZPaul3, posted 06-20-2019 3:31 PM Faith has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1472 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 493 of 868 (855581)
06-20-2019 3:45 PM
Reply to: Message 492 by AZPaul3
06-20-2019 3:31 PM


Re: The Evidence Is The Believers Themselves
You are not talking about the gospels in which there is no bloodshed or any such thing unless you mean the cross which God inflicted on Himself and not on anyone else and which is salvation for all those innocents you are trying to make out as victims. Your evll talk doesn't deserve any more attention from me.
If you really think I'm defending such an evll doctrine, you should be advocating my death. Go ahead, that's the inevitable direction such talk has to go.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 492 by AZPaul3, posted 06-20-2019 3:31 PM AZPaul3 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 494 by Theodoric, posted 06-20-2019 4:02 PM Faith has replied
 Message 496 by Theodoric, posted 06-20-2019 4:25 PM Faith has not replied
 Message 503 by AZPaul3, posted 06-20-2019 8:57 PM Faith has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1472 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 495 of 868 (855585)
06-20-2019 4:07 PM
Reply to: Message 494 by Theodoric
06-20-2019 4:02 PM


Re: The Evidence Is The Believers Themselves
You are accusing me of defending something evll. I think it's the most beautiful thing that ever happened to the human race. And you accuse me regularly of all kinds of evll things anyway, all of you do. So please, send a hit man and kill me. Please. I'm sure you can arrange that.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 494 by Theodoric, posted 06-20-2019 4:02 PM Theodoric has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 497 by Theodoric, posted 06-20-2019 4:26 PM Faith has not replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1472 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 504 of 868 (855621)
06-20-2019 9:11 PM
Reply to: Message 503 by AZPaul3
06-20-2019 8:57 PM


Re: The Evidence Is The Believers Themselves
That is of course a slanderous lye but then that's what your side of the political divide is particularly good at.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 503 by AZPaul3, posted 06-20-2019 8:57 PM AZPaul3 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 518 by AZPaul3, posted 06-22-2019 6:20 AM Faith has not replied
 Message 519 by AZPaul3, posted 06-22-2019 6:23 AM Faith has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1472 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 520 of 868 (855701)
06-22-2019 7:00 AM
Reply to: Message 519 by AZPaul3
06-22-2019 6:23 AM


Re: The Evidence Is The Believers Themselves
So I'm this evll person who is madly in love with an evll doctrine. Wow. I don't even know what you are talking about, and I doubt even you know.
ABE: It seems to be the mind set of the day though. Trump is totally innocent, hasn't done any of the things he's accused of, but your side of the political divide makes him out to be worse than the worst murderous despot in history. It's hard to fathom. Not liking him I get, he blunders a lot, but that's not evll. He has the true American perspective, the America I love, good America, America that does no intentional harm and is a sacrificial helper of other nations.
And Christianity is what brought civilized behavior to the world.
It is painful to hear goodness vilified.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 519 by AZPaul3, posted 06-22-2019 6:23 AM AZPaul3 has seen this message but not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 521 by PaulK, posted 06-22-2019 7:46 AM Faith has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1472 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 522 of 868 (855707)
06-22-2019 7:52 AM
Reply to: Message 521 by PaulK
06-22-2019 7:46 AM


Re: The Evidence Is The Believers Themselves
As an accuser and killer of souls, you outdo many of your political persuasion although the ideological group as a whole is good at it. It seems to be their ONLY activity lately.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 521 by PaulK, posted 06-22-2019 7:46 AM PaulK has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 523 by PaulK, posted 06-22-2019 8:01 AM Faith has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1472 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 524 of 868 (855716)
06-22-2019 10:43 AM
Reply to: Message 523 by PaulK
06-22-2019 8:01 AM


Re: The Evidence Is The Believers Themselves
And that is proof of what *I* said.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 523 by PaulK, posted 06-22-2019 8:01 AM PaulK has not replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1472 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 535 of 868 (855767)
06-22-2019 9:35 PM
Reply to: Message 534 by Dredge
06-22-2019 9:31 PM


Very true, dredge, and it's hard to believe that no matter how obvious that fact is he insists he's a Christian anyway.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 534 by Dredge, posted 06-22-2019 9:31 PM Dredge has not replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1472 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 542 of 868 (855831)
06-23-2019 4:08 PM
Reply to: Message 541 by ringo
06-23-2019 2:24 PM


Re: The Evidence Is The Believers Themselves
You can't use Hebrews 11 as your sole definition of evidence. Remember that the KJV was wrtiiten several centuries ago when our ideas about scientific evidence and even judicial evidence were very different. The NIV, for example, uses the word "assurance" instead. The ASV, the ESV and the RSV use "conviction".
Don't assume too much about the word choices for the more modern translations. Not only are the Greek texts corrupt but there is a legal requirement that to justify publishing a new translation requires that it have a certain number of differences from those already published. So most of the changes are nothing more than synonyms for terms in other versions, with little or no actual translational justification.
The KJV wasn't "written," it was a translation.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 541 by ringo, posted 06-23-2019 2:24 PM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 543 by Theodoric, posted 06-23-2019 4:12 PM Faith has replied
 Message 548 by ringo, posted 06-24-2019 11:50 AM Faith has not replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1472 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 544 of 868 (855833)
06-23-2019 4:47 PM
Reply to: Message 543 by Theodoric
06-23-2019 4:12 PM


Re: The Evidence Is The Believers Themselves
Showing that is not easy. Dean John William Burgon went to great lengths to show the corruptions of the Greek texts as well as the bad translation of the "New Revised Edition" put out in 1881 as a supposed updating of the KJV which was really a wholesale retranslation based on bad texts and bad translation.
He wrote a number of books on the subject. The main one was "The Revision Revised" which covered the corruptions and the translational choices.
He also wrote one specifically on the corruptions of the Greek texts.
I also have a blog on all this, The Great Bible Hoax of 1881. I've collected a list of books on the subject, many of them by Burgon, in the right margin.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 543 by Theodoric, posted 06-23-2019 4:12 PM Theodoric has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 545 by LamarkNewAge, posted 06-23-2019 8:14 PM Faith has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1472 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 546 of 868 (855842)
06-23-2019 9:04 PM
Reply to: Message 545 by LamarkNewAge
06-23-2019 8:14 PM


Re: Martin Luther said entire "Biblical" books were uninspired.
Luther wasn't wrog about much but he was wrong to reject books we now regard as canonical.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 545 by LamarkNewAge, posted 06-23-2019 8:14 PM LamarkNewAge has not replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1472 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 584 of 868 (856447)
06-30-2019 9:26 PM
Reply to: Message 583 by AZPaul3
06-30-2019 7:23 PM


Re: The Evidence Is The Believers Themselves
How can you be so adorable and such a snake at the same time?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 583 by AZPaul3, posted 06-30-2019 7:23 PM AZPaul3 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 585 by AZPaul3, posted 07-01-2019 12:00 AM Faith has replied

  
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