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Author Topic:   Who Made God?
Thugpreacha
Member
Posts: 12566
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.2


Message 571 of 642 (856181)
06-28-2019 10:07 AM
Reply to: Message 569 by ringo
06-26-2019 12:20 PM


Re: Take A Side
This is a discussion forum. Discuss something.
OK. So the title of this thread is Who Made God? So lets discuss the "god" known as money. Do we keep chasing this fale idol? Do we stop loving and desiring it?
Or do we simply give it all away in the form of spare change? And who then do we trust to help us retire? The government?

Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. ~RC Sproul
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith

You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo

Subjectivism may very well undermine Christianity.
In the same way that "allowing people to choose what they want to be when they grow up" undermines communism.
~Stile


This message is a reply to:
 Message 569 by ringo, posted 06-26-2019 12:20 PM ringo has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 572 by ringo, posted 06-28-2019 11:40 AM Thugpreacha has not yet responded

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 16806
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 3.4


(2)
Message 572 of 642 (856191)
06-28-2019 11:40 AM
Reply to: Message 571 by Thugpreacha
06-28-2019 10:07 AM


Re: Take A Side
Phat writes:

So lets discuss the "god" known as money. Do we keep chasing this fale idol?


Why do people chase any false idol, like Jesus?

Phat writes:

Do we stop loving and desiring it?


If we realize it's a false idol, why wouldn't we stop loving it and desiring it?

Phat writes:

Or do we simply give it all away in the form of spare change?


That's what your false idol Jesus told you to do.

Phat writes:

And who then do we trust to help us retire? The government?


The government is a representative of society. Yes, your false idol Jesus told you to take care of your society and your society will take care of you. If your government is not standing up for your society properly, it's time to do something about your government.

All that are in Hell, choose it. -- CS Lewis
That's just egregiously stupid. -- ringo

This message is a reply to:
 Message 571 by Thugpreacha, posted 06-28-2019 10:07 AM Thugpreacha has not yet responded

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 6393
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.9


Message 573 of 642 (856219)
06-28-2019 3:48 PM
Reply to: Message 570 by Thugpreacha
06-28-2019 10:04 AM


Re: Take A Side
So arbitrator is right out? Pick a word and defend it. Or not.

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 570 by Thugpreacha, posted 06-28-2019 10:04 AM Thugpreacha has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 575 by Thugpreacha, posted 06-30-2019 2:31 PM Theodoric has responded

    
Thugpreacha
Member
Posts: 12566
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.2


Message 574 of 642 (856392)
06-30-2019 2:23 PM
Reply to: Message 492 by AZPaul3
06-20-2019 3:31 PM


Re: The Evidence Is The Believers Themselves
AZPaul3 writes:

t is not just the evil and bloodshed portrayed in your gospel. More it is the evil and bloodshed you christian practitioners plague upon the species.

Your gospel is full of oppression, repression, murder, slaughter and war against innocents. The larger problem is your adherents seek to visit the same on the whole of the population of this planet.

Christian is evil.

You really need to stop listening to the demons in your head. The message is simple. Jesus is Gods character. He lives today. He wants to take you to the next level. Surrender to no religion or no other person or persons but surrender to Him and let Him cleanse you and equip you. Nothing evil about it.

Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. ~RC Sproul
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith

You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo

Subjectivism may very well undermine Christianity.
In the same way that "allowing people to choose what they want to be when they grow up" undermines communism.
~Stile


This message is a reply to:
 Message 492 by AZPaul3, posted 06-20-2019 3:31 PM AZPaul3 has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 577 by AZPaul3, posted 06-30-2019 3:25 PM Thugpreacha has responded

  
Thugpreacha
Member
Posts: 12566
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.2


Message 575 of 642 (856394)
06-30-2019 2:31 PM
Reply to: Message 573 by Theodoric
06-28-2019 3:48 PM


Re: Take A Side
Theodoric writes:

Pick a word and defend it. Or not.

OK, I'm sorry if I switched tracks...I get impulsive at times, but for your sake I will stick with our train of thought. Here we go...

TOPIC: WHO MADE GOD?

Tangle writes:

I'm an atheist because I can find no evidence at all - and I do mean none - for a god.


GDR writes:

There is nothing that you will accept as evidence for a god.


ENTER Theodoric, Stage Left:
Theodoric,responding to GDR writes:

He probably would accept the same as I would, namely evidence.
Please provide some so we can consider whether in fact it is evidence or not.


I might interject at this point that the only evidence we have is the believers themselves. Either these people(myself included) were (and are) touched and inspired by the Holy Spirit or we are batshit crazy and delusional. Willfully or otherwise. One problem here is that we are in a spiritual war between good and evil and evil makes sure that we sound as stupid as possible. Hence why some of our nuttier members are the poster children for Christian belief.

Tangle writes:

If there is a god out there he's not the sort you think - he's the non-interventionist kind that pouffed this lot into existence 14bn years ago then found a new toy to play with.

That assumes that God would need to be entertained. No, Tangle He is very much intervening with all of us. Do you want evidence? I am the evidence. I bug you incessantly.
Theodoric writes:

If research does not support the claims it would be stupid to believe the stories. That would define delusion.

The problem here is that you want to believe the research (and more tellingly the integrity of the researchers) in order to corroborate your preexisting world view.
Theodoric,to Faith writes:

I reject your concept of a god totally and completely. If your god existed I would tell him to fuck himself for all of the misery he has caused.

I would love to see such an encounter. I'm quite sure that God would eventually win Theodoric over to His side unless Theodoric prefers to Deify his own intelligence and preserve his free will eternally apart from what he sees as an autocratic God (and religion)
Theo writes:

Now go to church if you want to preach.

You waundered in the door by joining this topic. I'll go easy on you, however. You may think im pompous and arrogant but if so, you can pray for me while you are here in church. I need all the help I can get!!
Theodoric writes:

I think a lot of us atheists have similar stories of our experiences with theists and particularly fundies. We see it here at EVC all the time. Phat does not see it but he is no different than all the other fundies.
Not only are fundies math challenged, but evidently their beliefs strip away self-awareness.

I'll try and keep up. I never claimed to be perfect. My claim essentially is that God is. Anyone who believes that Jesus is a myth has cut themselves off from encountering a human mediator.
Pressie writes:

To quote Judge Judy: "If it doesn't make any sense, it likely is not true."

In general I agree, Pressie. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. When I got saved in 1993, that was extraordinary evidence for me.

AZPaul3 writes:

A prolonged and comprehensive absence of evidence is pretty hard evidence itself. Remember that in science a null result is evidence.

For me, a null result has never been the experience in my life. I live anything but null.
AZPaul3 writes:

You do know that Christianity is a minority religious cult, right? More than half the population of this planet, billions of your fellow human beings, think your cult is a poisonous and evil creed standing against the light and power of (insert other god here).

And as I have recently pointed out in another thread, God uses and has used a minority against a majority. It is a Biblical Theme.
Now...lets get to this argument regarding the word Arbitrator.
Arbitrator: an independent person or body officially appointed to settle a dispute.
adjudicator arbiter judge umpire referee assistant referee linesman line judge mediator conciliator intervenor intercessor go-between negotiator peacemaker
Jesus is the mediator. he arbitrator.
Theodoric writes:

But that is not how you attempted to use it. You said it meant creator too.

Right. Jesus is the Creator. Through Him all things were created.

jar writes:

Are you saying that the duty of a Christian is to just give in to a despot and tyrant just because the tyrant is more powerful?

No, I say that I would oppose such an evil creation. As a Christian I believe I have the duty to Fight the GOOD fight, to run the race. I would almost certainly lose but as a Christian that is still my duty.

So jar...do you believe that Jesus is a despot and/or a tyrant?
ringo,replying to me writes:

Your claims of his existence mean nothing.

You of course have a right to your belief. As I have a right to say you are wrong.

Theodoric writes:

Pick a word and defend it. Or not.

Have i defended arbitrator adequately or not?

Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. ~RC Sproul
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith

You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo

Subjectivism may very well undermine Christianity.
In the same way that "allowing people to choose what they want to be when they grow up" undermines communism.
~Stile


This message is a reply to:
 Message 573 by Theodoric, posted 06-28-2019 3:48 PM Theodoric has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 576 by ringo, posted 06-30-2019 2:42 PM Thugpreacha has responded
 Message 580 by Tangle, posted 06-30-2019 4:00 PM Thugpreacha has responded
 Message 611 by Theodoric, posted 07-01-2019 9:20 PM Thugpreacha has not yet responded

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 16806
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 3.4


Message 576 of 642 (856395)
06-30-2019 2:42 PM
Reply to: Message 575 by Thugpreacha
06-30-2019 2:31 PM


Re: Take A Sidse
Phat writes:

ringo writes:

Your claims of his existence mean nothing.


You of course have a right to your belief.

It isn't a belief. It's a fact that claims alone have no value. Claims have to have something to back them up.

Phat writes:

As I have a right to say you are wrong.


But all you're doing is saying it. That's another claim with no value. Why don't you actually think about it and explain how I'm wrong?

All that are in Hell, choose it. -- CS Lewis
That's just egregiously stupid. -- ringo

This message is a reply to:
 Message 575 by Thugpreacha, posted 06-30-2019 2:31 PM Thugpreacha has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 579 by Thugpreacha, posted 06-30-2019 3:58 PM ringo has responded

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 4259
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 3.7


(1)
Message 577 of 642 (856401)
06-30-2019 3:25 PM
Reply to: Message 574 by Thugpreacha
06-30-2019 2:23 PM


Re: The Evidence Is The Believers Themselves
You really need to stop listening to the demons in your head.

Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?
-- A rather accurate religious meme.

Christians grew some of the most evil fruits in all of human experience. Christians today continue to try to force their evil fruits down the throats of society.

The only demons are the christians brainwashed into perpetrating your creeds evil.

Christian is evil.


Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 574 by Thugpreacha, posted 06-30-2019 2:23 PM Thugpreacha has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 578 by Thugpreacha, posted 06-30-2019 3:53 PM AZPaul3 has responded

  
Thugpreacha
Member
Posts: 12566
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.2


Message 578 of 642 (856405)
06-30-2019 3:53 PM
Reply to: Message 577 by AZPaul3
06-30-2019 3:25 PM


Re: The Evidence Is The Believers Themselves
Although your argument has merit and I could argue it from both sides, I will only say for now that while most of them(us) are causing more harm than good, I will defend the minority. Lets get specific. name a few examples of specific people doing specific harm. You can even pick on those of us here at EvC.

Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. ~RC Sproul
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith

You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo

Subjectivism may very well undermine Christianity.
In the same way that "allowing people to choose what they want to be when they grow up" undermines communism.
~Stile


This message is a reply to:
 Message 577 by AZPaul3, posted 06-30-2019 3:25 PM AZPaul3 has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 583 by AZPaul3, posted 06-30-2019 7:23 PM Thugpreacha has responded

  
Thugpreacha
Member
Posts: 12566
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.2


Message 579 of 642 (856409)
06-30-2019 3:58 PM
Reply to: Message 576 by ringo
06-30-2019 2:42 PM


Re: Take A Sidse
It's a fact that claims alone have no value. Claims have to have something to back them up.
You have a point. I think what I meant when I asserted that you were wrong is that you are wrong in ...*thinks*...in ...in....well i'm still thinking. Often times I simply shoot these posts back to you in order to carry on the argument. I even had one prepared for you but in retrospect it was simply another attempt by me to articulate why I am right. What I'm starting to realize is that me being right does not automatically make you wrong. Of course I think in these terms due to the classical way that arguments proceed.

Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. ~RC Sproul
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith

You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo

Subjectivism may very well undermine Christianity.
In the same way that "allowing people to choose what they want to be when they grow up" undermines communism.
~Stile


This message is a reply to:
 Message 576 by ringo, posted 06-30-2019 2:42 PM ringo has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 594 by ringo, posted 07-01-2019 9:40 AM Thugpreacha has acknowledged this reply

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 6950
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 5.1


Message 580 of 642 (856410)
06-30-2019 4:00 PM
Reply to: Message 575 by Thugpreacha
06-30-2019 2:31 PM


Re: Take A Side
Phat writes:

That assumes that God would need to be entertained.

Why wouldn't he? If you can make shit up about him so can I.

No, Tangle He is very much intervening with all of us.

So you're actually agreeing with me, he does entertain himselfwith us.

Do you want evidence? I am the evidence. I bug you incessantly.

So do my kids. So what. You're evidence of delusion that's all.


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 575 by Thugpreacha, posted 06-30-2019 2:31 PM Thugpreacha has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 581 by Thugpreacha, posted 06-30-2019 4:04 PM Tangle has not yet responded

  
Thugpreacha
Member
Posts: 12566
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.2


Message 581 of 642 (856412)
06-30-2019 4:04 PM
Reply to: Message 580 by Tangle
06-30-2019 4:00 PM


Re: Take A Side

Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. ~RC Sproul
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith

You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo

Subjectivism may very well undermine Christianity.
In the same way that "allowing people to choose what they want to be when they grow up" undermines communism.
~Stile


This message is a reply to:
 Message 580 by Tangle, posted 06-30-2019 4:00 PM Tangle has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 582 by jar, posted 06-30-2019 4:17 PM Thugpreacha has acknowledged this reply
 Message 591 by Faith, posted 07-01-2019 7:56 AM Thugpreacha has responded

  
jar
Member
Posts: 31062
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 3.7


(1)
Message 582 of 642 (856419)
06-30-2019 4:17 PM
Reply to: Message 581 by Thugpreacha
06-30-2019 4:04 PM


Re: Take A Side
You do understand Phat that there are a whole universe of folk that don't have a clue what that picture is supposed to say; it's a mute and certainly not worth a thousand words.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios     My Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 581 by Thugpreacha, posted 06-30-2019 4:04 PM Thugpreacha has acknowledged this reply

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 4259
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 3.7


Message 583 of 642 (856439)
06-30-2019 7:23 PM
Reply to: Message 578 by Thugpreacha
06-30-2019 3:53 PM


Re: The Evidence Is The Believers Themselves
name a few examples of specific people doing specific harm.

I'll give you one.

Mandate of God: White Supremacy

Add killing abortion doctors and gay folks all over the world and the beat goes on.

Is this necessary? Specifics are all over the internet and I'm being lazy.

Here at EvC most of us pretty much already know where each other stands. No need to go there.

I should probably add this to my tagline.

Christian is still evil.


Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 578 by Thugpreacha, posted 06-30-2019 3:53 PM Thugpreacha has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 584 by Faith, posted 06-30-2019 9:26 PM AZPaul3 has responded
 Message 586 by Thugpreacha, posted 07-01-2019 3:20 AM AZPaul3 has acknowledged this reply
 Message 592 by Faith, posted 07-01-2019 7:59 AM AZPaul3 has responded

  
Faith
Member
Posts: 32133
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 584 of 642 (856447)
06-30-2019 9:26 PM
Reply to: Message 583 by AZPaul3
06-30-2019 7:23 PM


Re: The Evidence Is The Believers Themselves
How can you be so adorable and such a snake at the same time?
This message is a reply to:
 Message 583 by AZPaul3, posted 06-30-2019 7:23 PM AZPaul3 has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 585 by AZPaul3, posted 07-01-2019 12:00 AM Faith has responded

    
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 4259
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 3.7


Message 585 of 642 (856458)
07-01-2019 12:00 AM
Reply to: Message 584 by Faith
06-30-2019 9:26 PM


Re: The Evidence Is The Believers Themselves
I don't know. I haven't seen my horoscope in a while and I've lost track of which persona I'm supposed to be.

You do know personality ebbs and flows with the gravitational field lines of the solar system. I may be on the wrong side of some cycle or other.


Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 584 by Faith, posted 06-30-2019 9:26 PM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 590 by Faith, posted 07-01-2019 7:35 AM AZPaul3 has acknowledged this reply

  
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