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Author
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Topic: Bill Nye vs. Ken Ham
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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1465 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: 10-06-2001
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Message 661 of 824 (749572)
02-05-2015 7:57 PM
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Reply to: Message 660 by JonF
02-05-2015 7:46 PM
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Americans United for Separate of Church and State is also mentioned as complaining but no link is offered.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 660 by JonF, posted 02-05-2015 7:46 PM | | JonF has not replied |
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Faith
Suspended Member (Idle past 1465 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: 10-06-2001
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Message 662 of 824 (749573)
02-05-2015 8:11 PM
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Reply to: Message 647 by subbie
02-05-2015 4:07 PM
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Perhaps it comes a shock to you, but a lot of Christians have negative opinions of anyone who doesn't share their religion. (I don't mean to single out Christians, people of all different religious beliefs do that. It's just that the topic of this particular conversation happens to be Christian.) And, if you like, I'm sure I can find specific quotes from Ken Ham showing that he in fact has a negative opinion about non-Christians. But Christianity does not teach isolating ourselves from unbelievers in general, so there has to be a good reason for Ham to want only Christians working for the theme park. He may be wrong in thinking he needs them, and I don't know if he is or not, but he has a good enough reason from his point of view even if not from yours. Edited by Faith, : No reason given. Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 647 by subbie, posted 02-05-2015 4:07 PM | | subbie has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 663 by jar, posted 02-05-2015 8:28 PM | | Faith has not replied | | | Message 665 by subbie, posted 02-05-2015 8:59 PM | | Faith has replied |
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jar
Member (Idle past 414 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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Message 663 of 824 (749574)
02-05-2015 8:28 PM
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Reply to: Message 662 by Faith
02-05-2015 8:11 PM
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Faith writes: But Christianity does not teach isolating ourselves from unbelievers in general, so there has to be a good reason for Ham to want only Christians working for the theme park. Of course he does not want to hire just Christians but only Christians willing to pretend the Ark theme park is anything more than a joke. His reason is typical of all the avoidance issues, the brand of Christianity he markets cannot stand up to rational or honest examination.
Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 662 by Faith, posted 02-05-2015 8:11 PM | | Faith has not replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 668 by Jon, posted 02-05-2015 9:15 PM | | jar has not replied |
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JonF
Member (Idle past 188 days) Posts: 6174 Joined: 06-23-2003
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Message 664 of 824 (749575)
02-05-2015 8:43 PM
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He's filed the suit. Federal, no less. Going for the whole banana.
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subbie
Member (Idle past 1275 days) Posts: 3509 Joined: 02-26-2006
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Message 665 of 824 (749576)
02-05-2015 8:59 PM
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Reply to: Message 662 by Faith
02-05-2015 8:11 PM
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Faith writes: But Christianity does not teach isolating ourselves from unbelievers in general, so there has to be a good reason for Ham to want only Christians working for the theme park. Here's another shock for you; not everybody uses the same flavor Christianity as you.
Ridicule is the only weapon which can be used against unintelligible propositions. -- Thomas Jefferson We see monsters where science shows us windmills. -- Phat It has always struck me as odd that fundies devote so much time and effort into trying to find a naturalistic explanation for their mythical flood, while looking for magical explanations for things that actually happened. -- Dr. Adequate Howling about evidence is a conversation stopper, and it never stops to think if the claim could possibly be true -- foreveryoung
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 662 by Faith, posted 02-05-2015 8:11 PM | | Faith has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 666 by Jon, posted 02-05-2015 9:05 PM | | subbie has seen this message but not replied | | | Message 667 by Faith, posted 02-05-2015 9:09 PM | | subbie has seen this message but not replied |
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Jon
Inactive Member
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Message 666 of 824 (749577)
02-05-2015 9:05 PM
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Reply to: Message 665 by subbie
02-05-2015 8:59 PM
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Sinners, Tax Collectors, Whores, and Republicans
Given the kind of folks Jesus hung with, I think it's safe to say that Christianity, devoid of crazy, is probably a pretty inclusive group. Edited by Jon, : No reason given.
Love your enemies!
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 665 by subbie, posted 02-05-2015 8:59 PM | | subbie has seen this message but not replied |
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Faith
Suspended Member (Idle past 1465 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: 10-06-2001
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Message 667 of 824 (749578)
02-05-2015 9:09 PM
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Reply to: Message 665 by subbie
02-05-2015 8:59 PM
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Here's another shock for you; not everybody uses the same flavor Christianity as you. Ham's Christianity is standard Bible-inerrancy Christianity which does not want us to isolate ourselves:
1 Corinthians 5:9-11
I wrote unto you in an epistle not to company with fornicators:
Yet not altogether with the fornicators of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or with idolaters; for then must ye needs go out of the world. But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 665 by subbie, posted 02-05-2015 8:59 PM | | subbie has seen this message but not replied |
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Jon
Inactive Member
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Message 668 of 824 (749579)
02-05-2015 9:15 PM
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Reply to: Message 663 by jar
02-05-2015 8:28 PM
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Of course he does not want to hire just Christians but only Christians willing to pretend the Ark theme park is anything more than a joke. Nothing wrong with a business that prefers to hire people who believe in their productin this case, literally.
Love your enemies!
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 663 by jar, posted 02-05-2015 8:28 PM | | jar has not replied |
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Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 305 days) Posts: 16113 Joined: 07-20-2006
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Message 669 of 824 (749582)
02-05-2015 9:58 PM
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Reply to: Message 667 by Faith
02-05-2015 9:09 PM
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I wrote unto you in an epistle not to company with fornicators:
Yet not altogether with the fornicators of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or with idolaters; for then must ye needs go out of the world. But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat. And it came to pass, that, as Jesus sat at meat in his house, many publicans and sinners sat also together with Jesus and his disciples: for there were many, and they followed him. And when the scribes and Pharisees saw him eat with publicans and sinners, they said unto his disciples, How is it that he eateth and drinketh with publicans and sinners? When Jesus heard it, he saith unto them, They that are whole have no need of the physician, but they that are sick: I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance. Sometimes I almost think it would have been better if, when God was writing his Word, he'd been consistent instead of contradicting himself all the time. But since he did, I guess you can pick and choose which bits to follow.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 667 by Faith, posted 02-05-2015 9:09 PM | | Faith has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 670 by Faith, posted 02-05-2015 10:05 PM | | Dr Adequate has replied | | | Message 671 by subbie, posted 02-05-2015 10:21 PM | | Dr Adequate has not replied |
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Faith
Suspended Member (Idle past 1465 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: 10-06-2001
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I wrote unto you in an epistle not to company with fornicators: Yet not altogether with the fornicators of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or with idolaters; for then must ye needs go out of the world. But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat. And it came to pass, that, as Jesus sat at meat in his house, many publicans and sinners sat also together with Jesus and his disciples: for there were many, and they followed him. And when the scribes and Pharisees saw him eat with publicans and sinners, they said unto his disciples, How is it that he eateth and drinketh with publicans and sinners? When Jesus heard it, he saith unto them, They that are whole have no need of the physician, but they that are sick: I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance. Sometimes I almost think it would have been better if, when God was writing his Word, he'd been consistent instead of contradicting himself all the time. But since he did, I guess you can pick and choose which bits to follow.
Another case where a Christian does not find a contradiction but an unbeliever does. What Paul is teaching is that we avoid BELIEVERS ("called a brother") who are guilty of those sins, yet not to completely avoid the sinners OF THIS WORLD -- "for then must ye needs go out of the world." However, we are also warned not to spend a lot of time with sinners of the world either, because their sins can rub off on us. Jesus, however, as the passage says, came as the Physician to sinners, "to call sinners to repentance" and insofar as that is also our mission we certainly can't "altogether "avoid the company of sinners either. Edited by Faith, : No reason given. Edited by Faith, : No reason given. Edited by Faith, : No reason given. Edited by Faith, : No reason given. Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
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subbie
Member (Idle past 1275 days) Posts: 3509 Joined: 02-26-2006
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You''re on a fool's errand. There is no contradiction that a True Believer can't rationalize away.
Ridicule is the only weapon which can be used against unintelligible propositions. -- Thomas Jefferson We see monsters where science shows us windmills. -- Phat It has always struck me as odd that fundies devote so much time and effort into trying to find a naturalistic explanation for their mythical flood, while looking for magical explanations for things that actually happened. -- Dr. Adequate Howling about evidence is a conversation stopper, and it never stops to think if the claim could possibly be true -- foreveryoung
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 672 by Faith, posted 02-05-2015 10:26 PM | | subbie has seen this message but not replied |
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Faith
Suspended Member (Idle past 1465 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: 10-06-2001
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Message 672 of 824 (749588)
02-05-2015 10:26 PM
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Reply to: Message 671 by subbie
02-05-2015 10:21 PM
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Oh come on. Pleez review what I said, it does resolve the "contradiction."
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 671 by subbie, posted 02-05-2015 10:21 PM | | subbie has seen this message but not replied |
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Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 305 days) Posts: 16113 Joined: 07-20-2006
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Message 673 of 824 (749592)
02-06-2015 1:02 AM
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Reply to: Message 670 by Faith
02-05-2015 10:05 PM
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Another case where a Christian does not find a contradiction but an unbeliever does. Yeah, I see your point, Christians suck. Wait, that wasn't your point?
What Paul is teaching is that we avoid BELIEVERS ("called a brother") who are guilty of those sins ... And the people who actually, LITERALLY followed Jesus, the people who, according to the Bible, he actually asked to have lunch with him ... they weren't believers? What were they, autograph hunters? "I'm a big fan of your dad, can you ask him to sign my copy of the Old Testament"?
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 670 by Faith, posted 02-05-2015 10:05 PM | | Faith has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 674 by Faith, posted 02-06-2015 1:07 AM | | Dr Adequate has replied |
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Faith
Suspended Member (Idle past 1465 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: 10-06-2001
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As the quoted verses say, they were sinners in need of the Physician.
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Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 305 days) Posts: 16113 Joined: 07-20-2006
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Message 675 of 824 (749595)
02-06-2015 1:16 AM
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Reply to: Message 674 by Faith
02-06-2015 1:07 AM
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As the quoted verses say, they were sinners in need of the Physician. Were they believers? It's a pretty strange position you're taking anyway ... apparently, according to you, it's OK to hang with sinners so long as they're also atheists, but not otherwise. Well, trying to make sense of the Bible will lead you down some strange roads.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 674 by Faith, posted 02-06-2015 1:07 AM | | Faith has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 677 by Faith, posted 02-06-2015 3:30 AM | | Dr Adequate has not replied |
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