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Author Topic:   No One Sees God
Stile
Member (Idle past 265 days)
Posts: 4295
From: Ontario, Canada
Joined: 12-02-2004


Message 10 of 18 (719102)
02-11-2014 11:52 AM
Reply to: Message 9 by Spiritual Anarchist
02-10-2014 9:01 PM


Re: Commonality
Spiritual Anarchist writes:
My goals is to get people to question their assumptions and understand that we are all delusional if we think we are in any way capable of reasoning our way to truth or getting to truth based on faith in dead religions.
A very noble goal.
You seem to speak a lot about what "Christians" and what "Atheists" believe.
It should be noted that there are many Christians and Atheists that do not believe as you say they do... and that they do accept your goal already. Not everyone is a fundamentalist (Christian or Atheist).
Once everything is completely absurd and you can not take any thought seriously you will be left with the bare essence of your soul.
Maybe.
Maybe not.
Maybe this is something that only works for you.
Maybe this is another delusion that you have simply fooled yourself into believing.
Of course if you give up delusional thinking and everyone around you is delusional you will become like me and have to choose between not being able to really talk to anyone or ...you will have to dip a toe in the poisoned water in order to socialize and risk falling back in and drowning... every time you open your mouth to speak/write (communicate) with other people.
How do you know that what you describe here isn't just yourself rationalizing the strangeness of your own delusion?
It is, afterall, rather easy to say "give up delusional thinking."
It's another to objectively know that you actually have done this.
How do you tell the difference?
Is it possible to tell the difference?
Not everyone who is "not able to really talk to anyone" is in some sort of delusion-invincible state. In fact, many of them are in some of the deepest of delusions themselves.
If you have, however, found some inner-peace for yourself. Do continue. Such a thing can be difficult to achieve and there would have to be a very high priority reason to abandon it.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 9 by Spiritual Anarchist, posted 02-10-2014 9:01 PM Spiritual Anarchist has not replied

  
Stile
Member (Idle past 265 days)
Posts: 4295
From: Ontario, Canada
Joined: 12-02-2004


Message 13 of 18 (719836)
02-18-2014 3:43 PM
Reply to: Message 11 by Spiritual Anarchist
02-16-2014 3:50 PM


Re: In Response
Spiritual Anarchist writes:
I am saying that the bare essence of your soul can only be felt completely when you let go of your ego.
I understand what you're saying.
My point is that there's no reason to believe that what you say is actually true.
People can say a lot of things.
So far you have said a lot of things.
How much of it can you show to be valid?
Perhaps you made a mistake. Maybe what you thought was "the bare essence of your soul" was just a delusional feeling.
How can you tell you didn't make a mistake?
I am not describing a belief I got to through reasoning or some kind of emotional epiphany but an actual experience through observation.
This does nothing to show that what you say is actually true.
What experiences? What observations?
Did you record these observations?
Can other people replicate your methods and observations and results?
If no one else is capable of replicating your results... how can you tell the difference between you finding "the bare essence of your soul" and you just finding another delusion?
Isn't that what a delusion is? Something that only you see?
If you're the only one who sees "the bare essence of your soul"... how do you know this isn't a delusion itself?
But thinking is not the key to understanding "I Am" . Awareness is the key.
Maybe it is.
Maybe it isn't.
Again... you're just making claims. Can you support any of the claims you make?
Can you explain how "awareness" is different from "thinking"?
As for sharing inner peace my heart longs to do this. But it is "inner" peace so can not be easily shared directly. All I can do is "be" peace and hope like Thich Naht Hanh I inspire others to pursue the same.
Exactly.
quote:
Nhat Hanh is active in the peace movement, promoting non-violent solutions to conflict[4] and he is also refraining from animal product consumption as means of non-violence towards non-human animals.
This guy does stuff. Things that are different from people without his version of "inner peace."
What do you do?
At a minimum... you could use your intellect to imagine scenarios. Scenarios where you do something differently because of your inner-peace then what you see most other people doing.
Then you could explain (in these certain scenarios) how acting your way provides different results that are "better" than what other people seem to get.
Does understanding the essence of your soul allow you to act differently than other people?
-if so... then you should be able to explain scenarios where this can be identified
Does being "aware" instead of "thinking" allow you to act differently than other people?
-if so... then you should be able to explain scenarios where this can be identified
Does having your "inner peace" allow you to act differently than other people?
-if so... then you should be able to explain scenarios where this can be identified
If all the things you talk about do not allow you to act different from other people, even in imaginary scenarios... then I might suggest that you are actually under a delusion and that there is no real benefit to all the claims you make.
If you are not under a delusion, and there actually is a difference... then once you identify it people can make up their own minds to see if it's something beneficial for them or not (like Nhat Hanh does).

This message is a reply to:
 Message 11 by Spiritual Anarchist, posted 02-16-2014 3:50 PM Spiritual Anarchist has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 14 by Spiritual Anarchist, posted 02-23-2014 11:36 PM Stile has replied

  
Stile
Member (Idle past 265 days)
Posts: 4295
From: Ontario, Canada
Joined: 12-02-2004


Message 16 of 18 (720502)
02-24-2014 12:57 PM
Reply to: Message 14 by Spiritual Anarchist
02-23-2014 11:36 PM


Re: In Response
Perhaps I should go to the topic Book Nook The Righteous Mind" and get out all my ideas there and come back to this post later to see if anyone addresses Michael Novak or his book here. Because that is the OP of this thread. Not a class on Metaphysics versus Buddhist teachings on Delusional thinking.
Very true. And almost entirely my fault. I'll stop posting to this thread with off-topic-ness now. Sorry for intruding.
I did put a response together to your last post, though. And it's posted here. I've hidden it (because it is off-topic.). If you'd like to see it, use the "Peek" button in the bottom-right of my post, it will allow you to read everything I wrote.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 14 by Spiritual Anarchist, posted 02-23-2014 11:36 PM Spiritual Anarchist has not replied

  
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