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Author Topic:   The fossile record conclusively disproves evolution
edge
Member (Idle past 1731 days)
Posts: 4696
From: Colorado, USA
Joined: 01-09-2002


(1)
Message 111 of 342 (718055)
02-04-2014 1:32 AM
Reply to: Message 99 by Faith
02-03-2014 10:55 PM


Re: Nothing can ever disprove evolution
There's so much that disproves evolution, where to start? Well, start with the fact that you DON'T have the transitionals Darwin said you'd have to have. You have a few paltry wannabe transitionals, but nothing like the great number and variety Darwin knew were required.
Well, how many do you need?
Darwin said they were 'required'? I don't recall that notion.
The mere appearance of created things disproves it, so clearly the result of a Creative Intelligence, not mindless physical and chemical accidents. But you deny that too, pretend an Intelligence is not needed. Invent scenarios, Interpretations, call them Fact, say This happened, That happened, as if it really did. Silly Putty.
I hope you realize that you just wasted a paragraph.
Then there's the Flood, which so nicely accounts for the strata and the fossils but you can just assert it doesn't and make up Likely Stories out of bits and pieces of known fact but mostly sheer imagination, say you've disproved the Flood. Yes, just say it, that's all you have to do, name it and it's true. Silly Putty.
Well, then, just prove those theories wrong. Making unsupported assertions isn't going to cut it. All this is just complaining.
Darwin declared that what was known to have genetic causes, i.e. microevolution or the well known variation within Species, which is the ONLY known "descent with modification" was capable of producing new Species. Simply declared it, no evidence, no proof, just rename things and there you have it. And ever since that's all that's happened, the renaming of everything. Silly Putty. Mental transformation. Word Magic.
More whining. Please give us something other than assertions.
It's all a mass delusion. Fascinating. Amazing.
And your post is all assertion. But not fascinating or amazing.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 99 by Faith, posted 02-03-2014 10:55 PM Faith has not replied

  
edge
Member (Idle past 1731 days)
Posts: 4696
From: Colorado, USA
Joined: 01-09-2002


Message 113 of 342 (718058)
02-04-2014 1:37 AM
Reply to: Message 107 by Eliyahu
02-04-2014 12:26 AM


Re: Nothing can ever disprove evolution
No it would not, because then the precambrium suddenly isn't the precambrium anymore.
Actually, it never was the precambrium. It was, and is, the 'Precambrian'.
Perhaps if we reword that notion, you will understand: "what if we found a Precambrian rabbit?"

This message is a reply to:
 Message 107 by Eliyahu, posted 02-04-2014 12:26 AM Eliyahu has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 115 by Eliyahu, posted 02-04-2014 1:42 AM edge has replied

  
edge
Member (Idle past 1731 days)
Posts: 4696
From: Colorado, USA
Joined: 01-09-2002


Message 116 of 342 (718061)
02-04-2014 1:43 AM
Reply to: Message 112 by Eliyahu
02-04-2014 1:37 AM


Re: The fossile record conclusively disproves evolution
So what you are saying is: Gould, Eldredge, and all other evolutionists cited in my quotes they are wrong when they say that the fossil record shows STASIS, and not evolution.
Actually, what CS is saying is that you are wrong when you think that this is all that Gould and Eldredge said. What they are saying is that the fossil record does not show gradualism alone.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 112 by Eliyahu, posted 02-04-2014 1:37 AM Eliyahu has not replied

  
edge
Member (Idle past 1731 days)
Posts: 4696
From: Colorado, USA
Joined: 01-09-2002


Message 117 of 342 (718062)
02-04-2014 1:45 AM
Reply to: Message 115 by Eliyahu
02-04-2014 1:42 AM


Re: Nothing can ever disprove evolution
So for instance, if you found a dog with in its belly a dino, then ET is disproved?
I cannot fathom what you are saying here.
Please try again.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 115 by Eliyahu, posted 02-04-2014 1:42 AM Eliyahu has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 138 by Eliyahu, posted 02-05-2014 2:04 AM edge has replied

  
edge
Member (Idle past 1731 days)
Posts: 4696
From: Colorado, USA
Joined: 01-09-2002


(1)
Message 140 of 342 (718150)
02-05-2014 4:50 AM
Reply to: Message 138 by Eliyahu
02-05-2014 2:04 AM


Re: Nothing can ever disprove evolution
Well, the concept is simple enough: A dog with a dino in it's belly. Like he had just eaten it.
Would that disprove the ET according to you?
Do you have one? That would be evidence.
"In spite of these examples, it remains true, as every paleontologist knows, that most new species, genera, and families, and that nearly all new categories above the level of families, appear in the record suddenly and are not led up to by known, gradual, completely continuous transitional sequences."
Simpson, George Gaylord, The Major Features of Evolution, 1953, p. 360
Simpson George Gaylord is anevolutionist and professor paleontologie in Columbia and Harvard.
And so, Simpson made an argument against gradualism... shocking....
Are you admitting here that you cannot find evidence against evolution?
You could have just said so.
Edited by edge, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 138 by Eliyahu, posted 02-05-2014 2:04 AM Eliyahu has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 142 by Eliyahu, posted 02-05-2014 7:21 AM edge has not replied

  
edge
Member (Idle past 1731 days)
Posts: 4696
From: Colorado, USA
Joined: 01-09-2002


(1)
Message 153 of 342 (718206)
02-05-2014 1:26 PM
Reply to: Message 152 by Eliyahu
02-05-2014 12:36 PM


Re: The fossile record conclusively disproves evolution
Unless you believe in "hopefull monsters", evolution is gradual.
According to whom?
Or are you just a couple of centuries out of date?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 152 by Eliyahu, posted 02-05-2014 12:36 PM Eliyahu has not replied

  
edge
Member (Idle past 1731 days)
Posts: 4696
From: Colorado, USA
Joined: 01-09-2002


Message 155 of 342 (718208)
02-05-2014 1:31 PM
Reply to: Message 154 by Eliyahu
02-05-2014 1:27 PM


Re: The fossile record conclusively disproves evolution
The fossil records is in agreement with creation, and totally disproves evolution.
So, creationism tell us why there are no human fossils in the Cambrian System?
News to me.
And that is delightfull for me. As Dawkins confirms:
"It is as though they [fossils] were just planted there, without any evolutionary history. Needless to say this appearance of sudden planting has delighted creationists. .... Both schools of thought (Punctuationists and Gradualists) despise so-called scientific creationists equally, and both agree that the major gaps are real, that they are true imperfections in the fossil record. The only alternative explanation of the sudden appearance of so many complex animal types in the Cambrian era is divine creation and (we) both reject this alternative."
Richard Dawkins, The Blind Watchmaker London: W.W. Norton & Company, 1987, p. 229.
Do you actually read the material that you post?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 154 by Eliyahu, posted 02-05-2014 1:27 PM Eliyahu has not replied

  
edge
Member (Idle past 1731 days)
Posts: 4696
From: Colorado, USA
Joined: 01-09-2002


Message 156 of 342 (718209)
02-05-2014 1:34 PM
Reply to: Message 154 by Eliyahu
02-05-2014 1:27 PM


Re: The fossile record conclusively disproves evolution
If Bigfoot should have left some proof that he had walked through you garden, for instance, you should have seen his footsteps in the snow, and there are no footsteps in the snow, then you know, then that is proof, that Bigfoot didn't walk through you garden.
If evolution really happened, it should have left traces in the fossil record. There are now hudreds of millions fossiles in musea all over the world, and guess what: No evolution.
That is strong proof of no evolution.
Are you a Poe?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 154 by Eliyahu, posted 02-05-2014 1:27 PM Eliyahu has not replied

  
edge
Member (Idle past 1731 days)
Posts: 4696
From: Colorado, USA
Joined: 01-09-2002


Message 185 of 342 (718501)
02-07-2014 2:39 AM
Reply to: Message 184 by Eliyahu
02-07-2014 1:18 AM


Re: Nothing can ever disprove evolution
Here's the first one:
"But just in proportion as this process of extermination has acted on an enormous scale, so must the number of intermediate varieties, which have formerly existed on the earth, be truly enormous. Why then is not every geological formation and every stratum full of such intermediate links? Geology assuredly does not reveal any such finely-graduated organic chain; and this, perhaps, is the most obvious and serious objection which can be urged against my theory. The explanation lies, as I believe, in the extreme imperfection of the geological record."
Charles Darwin, Origin of Species
This is a "warning not to use the fossil record"?
Please explain your logic.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 184 by Eliyahu, posted 02-07-2014 1:18 AM Eliyahu has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 186 by Eliyahu, posted 02-07-2014 2:45 AM edge has replied

  
edge
Member (Idle past 1731 days)
Posts: 4696
From: Colorado, USA
Joined: 01-09-2002


(2)
Message 187 of 342 (718503)
02-07-2014 2:59 AM
Reply to: Message 184 by Eliyahu
02-07-2014 1:18 AM


Re: Nothing can ever disprove evolution
To prevent whining about "taking out of context", I give you the whole chapter of the master himself, our Charles, who devoted a whole chapter of his book to the imperfections of the fossil record. "Imperfections", because it didn't agree with his theory, therefore in his eyes it was imperfect.
Actually, no. Just because a record is incomplete does not mean that it does not support the theory.
I have a feeling that there are multitudes of defense attorneys out there looking for you.
For those who don't feel like reading so much, the juicy parts are in yellow:
CHAPTER X. ON THE IMPERFECTION OF THE GEOLOGICAL RECORD.
(extensive c&p text snipped)
As everybody can see, it is one long litany about how the fossil record goes against his theory.
Actually, no, I don't see that. All I see is a statement that the fossil record is incomplete.
In the days of Darwin it was already known that the fossil record goes agains the evolution theory.
Actually, no. Darwin did not reject his own theory. Why do you think that is?
Perhaps he had an explanation for the imperfection of the fossil record?
Nah, couldn't be!
But, if you'd care to, you could also join us in the 21st century and discuss the modern evidence.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 184 by Eliyahu, posted 02-07-2014 1:18 AM Eliyahu has not replied

  
edge
Member (Idle past 1731 days)
Posts: 4696
From: Colorado, USA
Joined: 01-09-2002


(2)
Message 188 of 342 (718504)
02-07-2014 3:05 AM
Reply to: Message 186 by Eliyahu
02-07-2014 2:45 AM


Re: Nothing can ever disprove evolution
OK, it is not literally a warning.
Then why did you say so? Your language, like your logic, is imprecise.
Look above to the updated post, and see how Darwin time and again, has to say that the fossil record is imperfect, because it does not conform to his theory.
No, it only says that the reason for a perceived lack of transitionals is because the record is imperfect. That would be called an 'explanation'. YECs should follow suit and give us some explanations.
I have a feeling that, if there is a way to read something wrong, you will find it.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 186 by Eliyahu, posted 02-07-2014 2:45 AM Eliyahu has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 189 by Eliyahu, posted 02-07-2014 5:04 AM edge has replied

  
edge
Member (Idle past 1731 days)
Posts: 4696
From: Colorado, USA
Joined: 01-09-2002


(1)
Message 192 of 342 (718519)
02-07-2014 9:53 AM
Reply to: Message 189 by Eliyahu
02-07-2014 5:04 AM


Re: The fossile record conclusively disproves evolution
So Darwin already saw that the fossil record did NOT support his theory, put posed serious problems for it.
No, he presented the fact that the fossil record is incomplete.
Wow, you really are hooked on religious myth aren't you?
He goes as far as to say that "Those who believe that the geological record is in any degree perfect, will undoubtedly at once reject my theory."
So, you believe that the fossil record is perfect?
You did read that part of the statement and agree to it, correct?
In that case, you are one of a very few select people.
And therefore Darwin says that the fossil record is not perfect.
You truly are confused.
Darwin cannot say anything.
And if he did say it was not perfect, so what? That's pretty common knowledge.
Do you have a point?
"... One hundred and twenty years of paleontological research later, it has become abundantly clear that the fossil record will not confirm this part of Darwin's predictions."(emphasis added) Eldredge, N. and Tattersall, I., The Myths of Human Evolution, 1982, p. 45-46
Okay, did you read the bolded part above?
Do you understand what it means?
Do you need some remedial help in understanding the English language?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 189 by Eliyahu, posted 02-07-2014 5:04 AM Eliyahu has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 201 by Eliyahu, posted 02-09-2014 12:09 AM edge has replied

  
edge
Member (Idle past 1731 days)
Posts: 4696
From: Colorado, USA
Joined: 01-09-2002


(2)
Message 193 of 342 (718520)
02-07-2014 9:58 AM
Reply to: Message 191 by Eliyahu
02-07-2014 9:34 AM


Re: The fossile record conclusively disproves evolution
Before 500 million years ago, there was no life to speak of.
Well, at least you are consistently wrong...
One cell life forms started according to the evo's 3.5 billion years ago, but it only really took of 500 million years ago.
Hunh? Please try this sentence again.
And then, suddenly, with a bang, there were all the major type of animals.
You mean like zebras and trout and dogs?
Please reference.
Really new concepts did not pop up in 500 million years.
What do you mean 'really new'?
Okay, find us a giraffe in Cambrian strata.
Oh, your misquotes actually prove you are wrong. Do you realize that quote mining is a form of stealing as well as lying?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 191 by Eliyahu, posted 02-07-2014 9:34 AM Eliyahu has not replied

  
edge
Member (Idle past 1731 days)
Posts: 4696
From: Colorado, USA
Joined: 01-09-2002


Message 208 of 342 (718839)
02-09-2014 3:33 AM
Reply to: Message 201 by Eliyahu
02-09-2014 12:09 AM


Re: The fossile record conclusively disproves evolution
Meaning that the fossil record, as is, does NOT agree with Darwin.
You do understand the difference between being incomplete and being in disagreement, don't you?
What I believe is irrelevant.
For once, we agree.
Thank you for admitting that you cannot answer my question.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 201 by Eliyahu, posted 02-09-2014 12:09 AM Eliyahu has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 210 by Eliyahu, posted 02-09-2014 6:36 AM edge has replied

  
edge
Member (Idle past 1731 days)
Posts: 4696
From: Colorado, USA
Joined: 01-09-2002


Message 209 of 342 (718840)
02-09-2014 3:47 AM
Reply to: Message 206 by Eliyahu
02-09-2014 2:13 AM


Re: The fossile record conclusively disproves evolution
Then please explain why Darwin said ten or more times that the fossil record is incomplete.
If it agreed extremely strongly with him, then why keep on saying that it is imperfect??
You remain confused.
All that we know about the fossil record supports evolution.
The things we don't know, we don't know.
Okay, so you want to base your argument on what we don't know. I prefer to go with what we do know.
I know. It's difficult, isn't it?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 206 by Eliyahu, posted 02-09-2014 2:13 AM Eliyahu has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 211 by Eliyahu, posted 02-09-2014 6:53 AM edge has replied

  
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