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DevilsAdvocate
Member (Idle past 3207 days)
Posts: 1548
Joined: 06-05-2008


Message 301 of 397 (721367)
03-06-2014 10:15 PM
Reply to: Message 300 by Dr Adequate
03-06-2014 9:52 PM


Re: Most Christians disagree with Faith
Nice chart Dr. Adequate! I like. Of course this only shows the larger denominations and not all the small sects and church divisions. i.e. there are different divisions of Baptists (Southern Baptist, Independent Baptist, Free Will, etc) and Methodists (United Methodist, Free Methodist, etc). Great work though. Mind if I use it elsewhere, aka study on church history, etc.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 300 by Dr Adequate, posted 03-06-2014 9:52 PM Dr Adequate has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 304 by Dr Adequate, posted 03-06-2014 10:27 PM DevilsAdvocate has not replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1550 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 302 of 397 (721368)
03-06-2014 10:16 PM
Reply to: Message 299 by DevilsAdvocate
03-06-2014 9:01 PM


Re: Most Christians disagree with Faith
Bible believing churches are the standard, those who take the Bible as inerrant and believe all of it (not of course the parts of the OT intended only for the Israelites), and those that follow basic Reformation Protestantism, which recovered the Bible based truth after a millennium of the apostasy of the RCC. These days you have to spend some time investigating the beliefs of any given congregation because we are apparently in the period of the Great Apostasy when the RCC is only the spearhead of a whole gaggle of apostate churches. There are a few mainstream churches that are still Bible believing, but not PC USA, not Methodist, not Anglican or Episcopalian, not Evangelical Lutheran, certainly not the RCC, or Eastern Orthodox which holds too many doctrines similar to the RCC. I'd look first at churches that call themselves Reformed, at independent churches, community churches, Bible churches and so on, but all those aren't necessarily reliable either. Again the standard is Bible inerrancy and Protestant theology. I identify at the moment with Reformed Baptist. Basically the denomination of the late great English preacher Charles Spurgeon. But denominational names aren't always reliable either.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 299 by DevilsAdvocate, posted 03-06-2014 9:01 PM DevilsAdvocate has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 303 by DevilsAdvocate, posted 03-06-2014 10:27 PM Faith has replied
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DevilsAdvocate
Member (Idle past 3207 days)
Posts: 1548
Joined: 06-05-2008


Message 303 of 397 (721370)
03-06-2014 10:27 PM
Reply to: Message 302 by Faith
03-06-2014 10:16 PM


Re: Most Christians disagree with Faith
Bible believing churches are the standard, those who take the Bible as inerrant and believe all of it (not of course the parts of the OT intended only for the Israelites), and those that follow basic Reformation Protestantism, which recovered the Bible based truth after a millennium of the apostasy of the RCC.
This includes most Protestant denominations.
There are a few mainstream churches that are still Bible believing, but not PC USA, not Methodist, not Anglican or Episcopalian, not Evangelical Lutheran, certainly not the RCC, or Eastern Orthodox which holds too many doctrines similar to the RCC.
I attend the United Methodist Church at preset. In the past I have attended Independent, Southern Baptist and non-denominational Christian Churches and Churches of Christ. Guess what Faith. They all believe the Bible is inerrant and believe all of the Bible.
You know what the difference is between them. How the interpret and apply the Bible.
That is the difference.
For example, I don't agree with you on Calvinism, specifically unconditional election. I interpret scripture differently in this area than you. I still believe in the inerrancy of the Scripture. I just don't come to the same conclusions you do about it.
Does that make me less of a Christian because of it? No. And you. No. We hold differing but contrary beliefs based on the same Scripture.
However, you believe anyone who disagrees with you or your brand of Christianity are apostate and damned to hell. Pretty pitiful.

"It is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring." - Carl Sagan, The Demon-Haunted World
"In coming to understand anything we are rejecting the facts as they are for us in favour of the facts as they are. - C.S. Lewis, An Experiment in Criticism

This message is a reply to:
 Message 302 by Faith, posted 03-06-2014 10:16 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 306 by Faith, posted 03-06-2014 10:32 PM DevilsAdvocate has replied

  
Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 390 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


Message 304 of 397 (721371)
03-06-2014 10:27 PM
Reply to: Message 301 by DevilsAdvocate
03-06-2014 10:15 PM


Re: Most Christians disagree with Faith
Sure, pass it around.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 301 by DevilsAdvocate, posted 03-06-2014 10:15 PM DevilsAdvocate has not replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1550 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 305 of 397 (721372)
03-06-2014 10:29 PM
Reply to: Message 300 by Dr Adequate
03-06-2014 9:52 PM


Re: Most Christians disagree with Faith
Such a chart unfortunately doesn't show the changes in some of the denominations. Presbyterian used to be strongly Bible believing, but has gone through splits because of the inroads of Bible-compromising liberalism. Same with the Methodists who were Bible believers in the beginning. Lutherans too, and Missouri Synod is still pretty reliably Bible believing. The Anglicans and Episcopalians are "Catholic Light" these days and getting deeper into it, though they too have had their orthodox history and some really great preachers, such as J C Ryle and Martyn Lloyd-Jones were Anglicans. The Westminster Confession is still a benchmark of Bible believing Christianity. Congregationalists were also once orthodox. I think that was Jonathan Edwards' denomination. The Waldensians were a solid bunch of Bible believers who hid away from the RCC in their own Alpine communities for centuries up until the Reformation, although they got persecuted and murdered by the RCC from time to time. '
As I look over your chart it's really only that branch in the upper middle that came off the Reformation that held to the true faith and most of them have apostasized too. Universalism and Unitarianism, which you rightly identify as spinning off Congregationalism, are certainly not Christian because they deny the Trinity, meaning the Deity of Christ.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 300 by Dr Adequate, posted 03-06-2014 9:52 PM Dr Adequate has not replied

Replies to this message:
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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1550 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 306 of 397 (721373)
03-06-2014 10:32 PM
Reply to: Message 303 by DevilsAdvocate
03-06-2014 10:27 PM


Re: Most Christians disagree with Faith
If you believe in evolution you do not believe all the Bible, DA, and I thought you said you believe in evolution. You also think it's Christian love not to call homosexuality sin. This is a repudiation of the truth of the Bible and of Jesus Christ. I don't require Christians to be Calvinists but I do require them to believe the entire Bible without compromising it with evolution or "gay rights" or other man made doctrines. And what I believe in this regard is completely in line with all the Bible believers down the millennia.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 303 by DevilsAdvocate, posted 03-06-2014 10:27 PM DevilsAdvocate has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 308 by DevilsAdvocate, posted 03-06-2014 10:38 PM Faith has replied
 Message 310 by DevilsAdvocate, posted 03-06-2014 10:42 PM Faith has not replied
 Message 340 by Taq, posted 03-07-2014 2:45 AM Faith has not replied

  
DevilsAdvocate
Member (Idle past 3207 days)
Posts: 1548
Joined: 06-05-2008


(3)
Message 307 of 397 (721374)
03-06-2014 10:35 PM
Reply to: Message 305 by Faith
03-06-2014 10:29 PM


Re: Most Christians disagree with Faith
Same with the Methodists who were Bible believers in the beginning.
We still are. Stop with your self-righteous bigotry. I am sick of your holier than though Pharisee type of attitude. You are no more righteous than any one else.
People are repulsed by you and you are giving Christianity a black eye.
In effect, your attitude and behavior turns people away from Christ instead of towards him.

"It is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring." - Carl Sagan, The Demon-Haunted World
"In coming to understand anything we are rejecting the facts as they are for us in favour of the facts as they are. - C.S. Lewis, An Experiment in Criticism

This message is a reply to:
 Message 305 by Faith, posted 03-06-2014 10:29 PM Faith has not replied

  
DevilsAdvocate
Member (Idle past 3207 days)
Posts: 1548
Joined: 06-05-2008


(2)
Message 308 of 397 (721375)
03-06-2014 10:38 PM
Reply to: Message 306 by Faith
03-06-2014 10:32 PM


Re: Most Christians disagree with Faith
If you believe in evolution you do not believe all the Bible, DA,
Says you. The Bible doesn't mention evolution, good or bad. Neither does it mention TV, automobiles, genetics, geology, the list goes on and on.
Faith, you do not speak for God. Don't pretend you do.
You also think it's Christian love not to call homosexuality sin.
I never said homosexuality is not a sin. Go look at my posts. I even said in one of my posts that the Bible called it a sin.
My point was that whether it is a sin or not we should not treat this sin any different than any other one.
I don't require Christians to be Calvinists but I do require them to believe the entire Bible without compromising it with evolution or "gay rights" or other man made doctrines
I don't care what you require. You do not speak for God or the Bible. They speak for themselves.
And what I believe in this regard is completely in line with all the Bible believers down the millennia.
No, it doesn't. Again, the Bible is mute on evolution.

"It is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring." - Carl Sagan, The Demon-Haunted World
"In coming to understand anything we are rejecting the facts as they are for us in favour of the facts as they are. - C.S. Lewis, An Experiment in Criticism

This message is a reply to:
 Message 306 by Faith, posted 03-06-2014 10:32 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 309 by Faith, posted 03-06-2014 10:41 PM DevilsAdvocate has replied
 Message 313 by Faith, posted 03-06-2014 10:45 PM DevilsAdvocate has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1550 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 309 of 397 (721377)
03-06-2014 10:41 PM
Reply to: Message 308 by DevilsAdvocate
03-06-2014 10:38 PM


Re: Most Christians disagree with Faith
Not only "says me" but says all the Bible believers I know and read and follow, thousands of them DA. You are in the liberal apostate minority on this as well as other issues. Well maybe it's getting to be a majority these days, in keeping with Biblical prophecy. Wrong side of the Bible in any case.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 308 by DevilsAdvocate, posted 03-06-2014 10:38 PM DevilsAdvocate has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 312 by DevilsAdvocate, posted 03-06-2014 10:44 PM Faith has replied
 Message 371 by ramoss, posted 03-07-2014 6:43 PM Faith has replied

  
DevilsAdvocate
Member (Idle past 3207 days)
Posts: 1548
Joined: 06-05-2008


Message 310 of 397 (721378)
03-06-2014 10:42 PM
Reply to: Message 306 by Faith
03-06-2014 10:32 PM


Re: Most Christians disagree with Faith
I do not go through you Faith, or your denomination, or my denomination to get to God. I go directly to him. Your "beliefs" or convictions have no bearing on me. I care less about your interpretation of the Bible. You do not speak for God or the Bible. Your feigned self-righteous, egotistical, holier-than-thou bigoted attitude draws people away from God not towards him.

"It is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring." - Carl Sagan, The Demon-Haunted World
"In coming to understand anything we are rejecting the facts as they are for us in favour of the facts as they are. - C.S. Lewis, An Experiment in Criticism

This message is a reply to:
 Message 306 by Faith, posted 03-06-2014 10:32 PM Faith has not replied

  
Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 390 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


Message 311 of 397 (721379)
03-06-2014 10:42 PM
Reply to: Message 302 by Faith
03-06-2014 10:16 PM


Re: Most Christians disagree with Faith
Bible believing churches are the standard, those who take the Bible as inerrant and believe all of it ...
... apart from the bit where Jesus says "This is my body, this is my blood", and "Very truly I tell you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you have no life in you." Believing those bits you leave up to those apostate Catholics.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 302 by Faith, posted 03-06-2014 10:16 PM Faith has not replied

  
DevilsAdvocate
Member (Idle past 3207 days)
Posts: 1548
Joined: 06-05-2008


Message 312 of 397 (721381)
03-06-2014 10:44 PM
Reply to: Message 309 by Faith
03-06-2014 10:41 PM


Re: Most Christians disagree with Faith
Not only "says me" but says all the Bible believers I know and read and follow, thousands of them DA.
There are many more who disagree with you Faith. You are in a vacuum, a bubble of self-righteousness of your own making. Thinking you speak for God when you don't.
You are in the liberal apostate minority on this as well as other issues. Well maybe it's getting to be a majority these days, in keeping with Biblical prophecy. Wrong side of the Bible in any case.
You know nothing about me Faith or my background. You have NO clue who I am, yet you judge me.
Edited by DevilsAdvocate, : No reason given.

"It is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring." - Carl Sagan, The Demon-Haunted World
"In coming to understand anything we are rejecting the facts as they are for us in favour of the facts as they are. - C.S. Lewis, An Experiment in Criticism

This message is a reply to:
 Message 309 by Faith, posted 03-06-2014 10:41 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 314 by Faith, posted 03-06-2014 10:45 PM DevilsAdvocate has replied
 Message 317 by Faith, posted 03-06-2014 10:54 PM DevilsAdvocate has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1550 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 313 of 397 (721383)
03-06-2014 10:45 PM
Reply to: Message 308 by DevilsAdvocate
03-06-2014 10:38 PM


Re: Most Christians disagree with Faith
You don't know how to read the Bible if you think it's silent on evolution. We understand from the New Testament that "death entered by one man," meaning Adam, and if death did not exist until the disobedience of Adam then there is no evolution because it is built on death.
abe: and if death had not come by Adam's sin then there was no need for Jesus Christ to come, who came to save us from that sin and the death that is its consequence. If you truly believe the Bible and the sacrifice of Christ for sin, you are missing a key ingredient by believing in evolution.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 308 by DevilsAdvocate, posted 03-06-2014 10:38 PM DevilsAdvocate has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 315 by DevilsAdvocate, posted 03-06-2014 10:50 PM Faith has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1550 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 314 of 397 (721384)
03-06-2014 10:45 PM
Reply to: Message 312 by DevilsAdvocate
03-06-2014 10:44 PM


Re: Most Christians disagree with Faith
I judge you only by what you've written publically on EvC forum.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 312 by DevilsAdvocate, posted 03-06-2014 10:44 PM DevilsAdvocate has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 316 by DevilsAdvocate, posted 03-06-2014 10:51 PM Faith has replied

  
DevilsAdvocate
Member (Idle past 3207 days)
Posts: 1548
Joined: 06-05-2008


Message 315 of 397 (721386)
03-06-2014 10:50 PM
Reply to: Message 313 by Faith
03-06-2014 10:45 PM


Re: Most Christians disagree with Faith
You don't know how to read the Bible if you think it's silent on evolution.
You have no clue about me or my experience with the Bible. I grew up reading the Bible. My grandfather was a Christian church minister, my father and all my uncles were ordained ministers. I attended a Christian college. I know the Bible inside and out and have studied it near 40 years. You, Faith, no nothing about me or my knowledge of the Bible.
You make accusations with no evidence. You judge people without knowing them. You throw insults out and use unChristlike behavior on this forum. Your posts ebb with disdain, hatred, bigotry, and hypocrisy. Everything Christ was not.
We understand from the New Testament that "death entered by one man," meaning Adam, and if death did not exist until the disobedience of Adam then there is no evolution because it is built on death.
Spiritual death entered through one man, Adam.

"It is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring." - Carl Sagan, The Demon-Haunted World
"In coming to understand anything we are rejecting the facts as they are for us in favour of the facts as they are. - C.S. Lewis, An Experiment in Criticism

This message is a reply to:
 Message 313 by Faith, posted 03-06-2014 10:45 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 323 by Faith, posted 03-06-2014 11:11 PM DevilsAdvocate has replied

  
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