EvC Forum: Homosexuality and Evo, Creo, and ID

First studies show no linkage from the xq28 alleles:

Male homosexuality: absence of linkage to microsatellite markers at Xq28 - PubMed

quote:
Several lines of evidence have implicated genetic factors in homosexuality. The most compelling observation has been the report of genetic linkage of male homosexuality to microsatellite markers on the X chromosome. This observation warranted further study and confirmation. Sharing of alleles at position Xq28 was studied in 52 gay male sibling pairs from Canadian families. Four markers at Xq28 were analyzed (DXS1113, BGN, Factor 8, and DXS1108). Allele and haplotype sharing for these markers was not increased over expectation. These results do not support an X-linked gene underlying male homosexuality.

Older Siblings are more likely to become homosexual (not a genetic trait):

Birth order and sibling sex ratio of children and adolescents referred to a gender identity service - PubMed

quote:
In adult male samples, homosexuality is associated with a preponderance of older brothers (i.e., the fraternal birth order effect). In several studies comparing gender dysphoric youth, who are likely to be homosexual in adulthood, to clinical or non-clinical control groups, the findings have been consistent with the fraternal birth order effect in males; however, less is known about unique sibship characteristics of gender dysphoric females. The current study investigated birth order and sibling sex ratio in a large sample of children and adolescents referred to the same Gender Identity Service (N = 768). Probands were classified as heterosexual males, homosexual males, or homosexual females based on clinical diagnostic information. Groups differed significantly in age and sibship size, and homosexual females were significantly more likely to be only children. Subsequent analyses controlled for age and for sibship size. Compared to heterosexual males, homosexual males had a significant preponderance of older brothers and homosexual females had a significant preponderance of older sisters. Similarly, the older sibling sex ratio of homosexual males showed a significant excess of brothers whereas that of homosexual females showed a significant excess of sisters. Like previous studies of gender dysphoric youth and adults, these findings were consistent with the fraternal birth order effect. In addition, the greater frequency of only children and elevated numbers of older sisters among the homosexual female group adds to a small literature on sibship characteristics of potential relevance to the development of gender identity and sexual orientation in females.

Here they suggest that the birth month combined with a birth defect could cause female homosexuality:

quote:
Based on pre-mid-20th-century data, the same photoperiod-related birth seasonality previously observed in schizophrenia was also recently found in neural-tube defects and in extreme left-handedness among professional baseball players. This led to a hypothesis implicating maternal melatonin and other mediators of sunlight actions capable of affecting 4th-embryonic-week developments including neural-tube closure and left-right differentiation of the brain. Here, new studies of baseball players suggest that the same sunlight actions could also affect testosterone-dependent male-female differentiation in the 4-month-old fetus. Independently of hand-preferences, baseball players (n=6829), and particularly the stronger hitters among them, showed a unique birth seasonality with an excess around early-November and an equally significant deficit 6 months later around early-May. In two smaller studies, north-American and other northern-hemisphere born lesbians showed the same strong-hitter birth seasonality while gay men showed the opposite seasonality. The sexual dimorphism-critical 4th-fetal-month testosterone surge coincides with the summer-solstice in early-November births and the winter-solstice in early-May births. These coincidences are discussed and a "melatonin mechanism" is proposed based on evidence that in seasonal breeders maternal melatonin imparts "photoperiodic history" to the newborn by direct inhibition of fetal testicular testosterone synthesis. The present effects could represent a vestige of this same phenomenon in man.

This article proposes making a new definition of 'mental disorder' and is deemed a failure if it somehow includes homosexuality, despite homosexuality being removed from the 'mental disorder' list for political rather than scientific reasons. This is known as the "Suppressed Correlative" Fallacy. Rather than carefully defining what a 'mental disorder' is and seeing what falls under that category, they instead use a faulty test to see if they've arrived at the definition. Excluding the ability to define homosexuality as a 'mental disorder' regardless if it is one or not.

The definition of mental disorder: evolving but dysfunctional? - PubMed

quote:
Extensive and diverse conceptual work towards developing a definition of 'mental disorder' was motivated by the declassification of homosexuality from the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual in 1973. This highly politicised event was understood as a call for psychiatry to provide assurances against further misclassification on the basis of discrimination or socio-political deviance. Today, if a definition of mental disorder fails to exclude homosexuality, then it fails to provide this safeguard against potential abuses and therefore fails to do an important part of the work it was intended to do. We argue that fact-based definitions of mental disorder, relying on scientific theory, fail to offer a robust definition of mental disorder that excludes homosexuality. Definitions of mental disorder based on values do not fare better: these definitions are silent on questions about the diagnostic status of individuals in oppressive societies and over-inclusive of mental or behavioural states that happen to be negatively valued in the individual's social context. We consider the latest definition proposed for the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual-5 (DSM-5) in light of these observations. We argue that definition fails to improve on these earlier deficiencies. Its inclusion in the manual may offer false reassurance against repetition of past misclassifications. We conclude with a provocation that if candidate definitions of mental disorder are unable to exclude homosexuality, it might perhaps be preferable not to attempt a definition at all.

This study was done relatively recently and found like many studies before it that there is a much higher chance of a person becoming homosexual based on parenting, and sexual abuse or first sexual experience during adolescence.

[Study on the causes of sexual orientation of gay] - PubMed

quote:
OBJECTIVE:

To explore the relevant factors of the causes of sexual orientations of gay.
METHOD:

From March to June 2013, 350 gays were recruited from one music bar and three bath centers where gays frequently visited in Changsha city, by proportional stratified sampling method. Meanwhile, another 332 males who identify themselves as non-homosexuality were also recruited considering the composition of ages, gender and educational background. Questionnaire survey was conducted to all the subjects, with 300 effective ones reclaimed. The questionnaire included the general demographic information, traits of character, the condition of foster in childhood and information of family members. The differences between the gays and non-homosexuality groups were analyzed to explore the causes of the sexual orientations of gays.
RESULTS:

There were statistical significant differences between gays and non- homosexuality group on following indexes (χ(2) was 59.63, 5.90, 16.01, 84.99, 161.57, 77.77, 112.32, 190.84, 30.10 respectively, all of P < 0.05) :had a tender father and an imperious mother, were physically weak, not agile, physically inactive, attentive to details, highly conservative, not adventurous, and radical in childhood, were raised as girls before the age of 18, liked to dress as girls before the age of 18, don't liked to play toy knives and toy guns before the age of 18, suffered from sexual abuse before the age of 18 (e.g. forced to expose private parts or forced to have sex) by adults, had read or watched books or films about homosexual and experienced sexual pleasure from that before the age of 18. The rate of gays on these indexes was separately 62.3% (187/300), 57.7% (173/300) , 62.3% (187/300) , 63.0% (189/300), 67.3% (202/300) , 62.7% (189/300), 68.0% (204/300), 65.0% (195/300) and the rate on these indexes of non-homosexuality group was separately 21.3% (64/300), 28.0% (84/300) , 25.0% (75/300) , 12.7% (38/300), 31.3% (94/300), 17.7% (53/300) , 12.7% (38/300), 42.7% (128/300) . The rate of gays on these factors:the youngest boy in family, had the father or twin brothers who were homosexual or self identified as gay was 62.7% (188/300), 56.0% (168/300) and 62.0% (18/29) respectively; and the rate was 40.7% (122/300), 4.0% (12/300) and 20.0% (2/10), respectively among non-homosexuality group. The difference showed statistical significance (χ(2) was 34.52, 193.14, 5.27 respectively, all of P < 0.05).
CONCLUSION:

The correlative factor of sexual orientation of gays maybe was family relationship, tend and education since childhood, psychological characteristics, sexual experience during puberty.

Mental depression in homosexual males highest rated cause by relationships:

Mental health literacy and the experience of depression in a community sample of gay men - PubMed

quote:
BACKGROUND:

Gay men are at higher risk of suffering from a variety of psychiatric disorders, yet the mental health literacy of this population has remained largely unknown.
METHODS:

In 2007 and 2011, surveys were conducted among gay men in Geneva, Switzerland, recruited by probability-based time-space sampling. Based on a case vignette of a man with major depression, respondents were asked a series of questions about labelling, perceived risk, and help-seeking beliefs. Men meeting caseness for major depression were asked open questions about perceived causes and additional help-seeking/self-help.
RESULTS:

Among the 762 respondents, 14.7% met diagnostic criteria for major depression (MDD) in the past 12 months. The vignette was labelled depression by 44.1% of the entire sample, and 61.9% of the men with MDD. Discrimination (33.2%), acceptance or rejection by others (21.4%), and loneliness (24.9%) were the most common reasons given for greater susceptibility among gay men, yet men with MDD reported problems with love/relationship (32.5%) and work (28.9%) as the most common perceived causes of recent depression, and problems with love/relationship (21.9%), accepting one's homosexuality (21.1%), and family (20.2%) at initial outset. The highest proportions of gay men rated non-medical options such as a close friend (91.6%), relaxation exercises or meditation (84.4%), and physical activity (83.5%) as being helpful for the depression vignette.
LIMITATIONS:

No probes used for open questions, and findings generalizable only to gay men in the sampling scheme.
CONCLUSIONS:

There are many commonalities in labelling, perceived causes, and help-seeking with general populations, but also numerous specificities in mental health literacy and experience among gay men.

Half of all new cases of HIV are from homosexual men:

HIV infection - United States, 2008 and 2010 - PubMed

quote:
At the end of 2009, approximately 1.1 million persons in the United States were living with human immunodeficiency virus (HIV) infection, with approximately 50,000 new infections annually. The prevalence of HIV continues to be greatest among gay, bisexual, and other men who have sex with men (MSM), who comprised approximately half of all persons with new infections in 2009. Disparities also exist among racial/ethnic minority populations, with blacks/African Americans and Hispanics/Latinos accounting for approximately half of all new infections and deaths among persons who received an HIV diagnosis in 2009. Improving survival of persons with HIV and reducing transmission involve a continuum of services that includes diagnosis, linkage to and retention in HIV medical care, and ongoing HIV prevention interventions.

This study shows the ability of homosexuals through therapy to change orientation:

Page not found St. Olaf College

quote:
Most participants noted more than one of the 11 rea-
sons asked about. The most commonly reported reasons
were that the individual did not find life as a gay man
or lesbian emotionally satisfying (males, 85%; females,
70%;2(1)D4:5,p<:05), conflict between their same
sex feelings and behavior and the tenets of their religion
(79%), and desire to get married or stay married (males,
67%; females, 35%;2(1)D15:8,p<:001).
...
Fifty-six participants (28%) had regular heterosex-
ual sex both at PRE and at POST (in all but one case with
the same person, their spouse). As would be expected very few of these 56 participants reported Good Hetero-
sexual Functioning at PRE (5%,nD3). In contrast, 84%(nD47) of these participants reported Good Heterosex-ual Functioning at POST
...

Critiques of the above study include the inability to verify they were changed because of self evaluation, however I hold it up as a proof that its possible as at least some of the respondents were not lying. We can't know the exact numbers until a comprehensive study has been done, which at the moment the homosexual lobbies are blocking through politics, threats of termination, etc...etc.... This is also the reason the best methods haven't been researched or improvements made. You'll also note the results look similar to those of drug rehabilitation therapies.

Another study here, delves into the causes of homosexuality and the rates at which they can be converted to heterosexuals:

Forbidden

quote:
{On being removed from the medical books} On first consideration, such a theory sounds plausible. However we see its startling consequences when we apply it to a condition such as pedophilia. Is the happy and otherwise well-functioning pedophile "normal"? As Dr. Bieber argues in this article, psychopathology can be ego-syntonic and not cause distress; and social effectiveness--that is, the ability to maintain positive social relations and perform work effectively--"may coexist with psychopathology, in some cases even of a psychotic order."
...
But the most significant finding was that of the detached father. "The father-son relationship was almost the diametrical opposite of that between mother and son. The paternal portrait was one of a father who was either detached or covertly or overtly hostile," he reported. While there was some variance in the mother-son relationship, Dr. Bieber reported, "The father-son relationship, however, revealed uniformly an absence of loving, warm, constructive paternal attitudes and behavior. In my long experience, I have not found a single case where, in the developing years, a father had a kind, affectionate, and constructive relationship with the son who becomes homosexual. This has been an unvarying finding. It is my view, and I have so stated and written, that if a father has a kind, affectionate, and constructive relationship with his son, he will not produce a homosexual son, no matter what the mother is like."

Dr. Bieber's study in fact found a continuity of poor relationships with males, beginning with the father, older brothers, and same-sex peers in childhood. He concludes, "The consistent history of unremitting fear of and hostility to other males throughout childhood has led me to conclude that male homosexuality is basically an adaptation to a disorder of a man's relationship with other men."
...
Of the 106 homosexuals who started psychoanalytic therapy, 29 changed to exclusively heterosexuality, which represented 27 percent of the total sample.
...
Dr. Bieber discussed the issue of the definition of normality. Because homosexual fantasies and behavior are fear-based, he concluded, we
...
cannot call them normal.
...
Summary

The factors that determined the decision of the APA to delete homosexuality from DSM-II were summarized as follows:

Gay activists had a profound influence on psychiatric thinking.

A sincere belief was held by liberal-minded and compassionate psychiatrists that listing homosexuality as a psychiatric disorder supported and reinforced prejudice against homosexuals. Removal of the term from the diagnostic manual was viewed as a humane, progressive act.

There was an acceptance of new criteria to define psychiatric conditions. Only those disorders that caused a patient to suffer or that resulted in adjustment problems were thought to be appropriate for inclusion in the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual.

We find that the removal of homosexuality was mostly political, coupled with a lack of information at the time, if it were to be re-evaluated using modern studies it would be put right back in because it 'regularly causes distress' from within homosexual relationships and not from external pressures and according to the above studies it is fear based.

This aggregate of multiple genetic studies found that there is no correlation between homosexuality and genetics, only a correlations between popular opinion and media expression of the idea that genetics causes homosexuality:

Is There A - Gay Gene | PDF | Homosexuality | Genetics-

quote:
Many laymen now believe that homosexuality is part of
who a person really is from the moment of conception.

The "genetic and unchangeable" theory has been actively promoted by gay activists and the popular media. Is homosexuality really an inborn and normal variant of human nature?

No. There is no evidence that shows that homosexuality is simply "genetic." and none of the research claims there is.

Only the press and certain researchers do, when speaking in sound bites to the public.

Even adolescents that are confused due to environmental factors (as shown in the studies above) tend to naturally shift toward heterosexuality by age 17-19:

http://www.mygenes.co.nz/Change.htm

quote:
The idea that adolescent same-sex attraction will always become adult same sex attraction is quite incorrect. Data from the large USA ADD-Health survey (Savin-Williams and Ream, 2007) confirm that adolescent homosexuality/bisexuality both in attraction and behaviour undergoes extraordinary change from year to year. Much of this could be experimentation. The changes are overwhelmingly in the direction of heterosexuality, which even at age 16-17 is at least 25 times as stable as bisexuality or homosexuality, whether for men and women. That is, 16 year olds saying they have an SSA or Bi- orientation are 25 times more likely to change towards heterosexuality at the age of 17 than those with a heterosexual orientation are likely to change towards bi-sexuality or homosexuality. Under the most extreme conservative assumptions heterosexuality is still 3x more stable for men and 4x for women.

This study shows that same-sex parents increase maltreatment of children and that there is a link between maltreatment of children and homosexuality:

Does maltreatment in childhood affect sexual orientation in adulthood? - PubMed

quote:
Epidemiological studies find a positive association between physical and sexual abuse, neglect, and witnessing violence in childhood and same-sex sexuality in adulthood, but studies directly assessing the association between these diverse types of maltreatment and sexuality cannot disentangle the causal direction because the sequencing of maltreatment and emerging sexuality is difficult to ascertain. Nascent same-sex orientation may increase risk of maltreatment; alternatively, maltreatment may shape sexual orientation. Our study used instrumental variable models based on family characteristics that predict maltreatment but are not plausibly influenced by sexual orientation (e.g., having a stepparent) as natural experiments to investigate whether maltreatment might increase the likelihood of same-sex sexuality in a nationally representative sample (n = 34,653). In instrumental variable models, history of sexual abuse predicted increased prevalence of same-sex attraction by 2.0 percentage points [95 % confidence interval (CI) = 1.4-2.5], any same-sex partners by 1.4 percentage points (95 % CI = 1.0-1.9), and same-sex identity by 0.7 percentage points (95 % CI = 0.4-0.9). Effects of sexual abuse on men's sexual orientation were substantially larger than on women's. Effects of non-sexual maltreatment were significant only for men and women's sexual identity and women's same-sex partners. While point estimates suggest much of the association between maltreatment and sexual orientation may be due to the effects of maltreatment on sexual orientation, confidence intervals were wide. Our results suggest that causal relationships driving the association between sexual orientation and childhood abuse may be bidirectional, may differ by type of abuse, and may differ by sex. Better understanding of this potentially complex causal structure is critical to developing targeted strategies to reduce sexual orientation disparities in exposure to abuse.

Most of the articles I find that criticize the studies that show homosexual change fall under the Continuum logical fallacy claiming things like the definition they used for homosexuality was 'imprecise' or 'not accurate'. No definition of homosexuality is widely agreed upon in the medical or scientific world so it would be impossible to have a precise or accurate definition to start from.

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