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Author Topic:   Do oceans of water in mantle rock prove the flood?
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 15 of 108 (729708)
06-17-2014 2:00 PM
Reply to: Message 13 by Coyote
06-17-2014 12:44 AM


We have had posters on these very forums advocating both the K-T and the P-T boundaries as the location of the global flood.

Yes, but many of those posters still insist that means only a few thousand years ago.

Most creos are not looking for proof because they already believe. Instead they are latching onto anything that might indicate that they aren't idiots. If there were an ocean of liquid water underground, would that really prove the flood happened?

Edited by Adminnemooseus, : Off-topic banner.


Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)

I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei

If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass


This message is a reply to:
 Message 13 by Coyote, posted 06-17-2014 12:44 AM Coyote has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 17 by Porosity, posted 06-17-2014 2:35 PM NoNukes has not yet responded

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 20 of 108 (729715)
06-17-2014 4:48 PM
Reply to: Message 18 by Faith
06-17-2014 4:00 PM


Re: No, not proof, but likely evidence at least
Yes, the mere FACTS of the Geologic Column and the bazillions of fossils ARE evidence for the Flood

You think you have evidence because you are clueless about what evidence is. Assuming momentarily that the facts in question are consistent with the Flood as you say, those facts would not evidence unless they are consistent with the flood and inconsistent with their not being a flood. And you've never come close to establishing anything like that.

The earth existing is complete consistent with the Flood and with there not being a Flood. So that is not evidence for either proposition.

And of course, as has been demonstrated many times here, the geological column is actually completely incompatible with the Biblical account, as are the existence of the Egyptian pyramids, the genetic makeup of the human race and nearly every other animal on this planet, the 30,000 year old cave paintings in France and Spain, and dozens of other facts, some of which you acknowledge not having an answer.

. Along with the "oceans of water" recognized as locked up in those deep rocks.

No, Faith. Evidence does not include 'facts I can weave into a tale consistent with the Bible'. It means facts that would likely not be facts if the Flood actually had occurred.

Thanks for showing more of the 'indomitable will'.

Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.

Edited by Adminnemooseus, : Off-topic banner.


Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)

I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei

If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass


This message is a reply to:
 Message 18 by Faith, posted 06-17-2014 4:00 PM Faith has not yet responded

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


(1)
Message 27 of 108 (729723)
06-17-2014 7:55 PM
Reply to: Message 24 by Faith
06-17-2014 7:10 PM


Re: No, not proof, but likely evidence at least
Well, the part that most needs explaining is why they call it water at all, and why they use the term "oceans," which sure does imply, you know, water, the wet stuff, in great quantities.

I suppose that "oceans" could only mean "water, the wet stuff" to a Bible literalist.

quote:

To be, or not to be, that is the question—
Whether 'tis Nobler in the mind to suffer
The Slings and Arrows of outrageous Fortune,
Or to take Arms against a Sea of troubles,
And by opposing end them?

A Sea??

That's right, troubles are the wet stuff. Hamlet is talking about picking up a spear and fighting the ocean.


Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)

I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei

If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass


This message is a reply to:
 Message 24 by Faith, posted 06-17-2014 7:10 PM Faith has not yet responded

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 43 of 108 (729743)
06-18-2014 4:36 AM
Reply to: Message 39 by Dr Adequate
06-18-2014 1:48 AM


To pump so much as a jugful of water to that depth, against that amount of pressure, is way beyond the technological resources of the twenty-first century. And you want the water to have gone there on its own, without any mechanism to pump it.

At some point in the discussion, it is always possible to invoke supernatural power. In fact, if the fountains of the deep opened right on time, and if the water did drain away into the deep at some point, then surely the totality of action was not natural.

In any event, there appears to be more than enough "instant water" down there to make a global flood. I don't see anything gained by denying that.


Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)

I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei

If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass


This message is a reply to:
 Message 39 by Dr Adequate, posted 06-18-2014 1:48 AM Dr Adequate has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 44 by Faith, posted 06-18-2014 4:43 AM NoNukes has responded

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 47 of 108 (729749)
06-18-2014 8:55 AM
Reply to: Message 44 by Faith
06-18-2014 4:43 AM


What is described is presented as physical phenomena that happen to be different from the current situation, physical and natural nevertheless.

Have you forgotten that you don't know any physics?

but nevertheless it is presented as natural and physical and not supernatural.

Well, no. Unless you want to designate all of God's actions as natural, there is no such implication in the Biblical text that things just followed the rules of nature.

God announces that he is going to destroy most of the living beings on earth with a Flood, and then you assume that he did absolutely nothing and the Flood just happened naturally.

There is nothing in the Biblical account that is inconsistent with God taking supernatural action, and every implication that things happened under God's direction and timing. That's particularly true about the timing and events causing the Flood.


Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)

I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei

If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass


This message is a reply to:
 Message 44 by Faith, posted 06-18-2014 4:43 AM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 55 by Faith, posted 06-18-2014 4:39 PM NoNukes has not yet responded

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 48 of 108 (729750)
06-18-2014 8:59 AM
Reply to: Message 46 by Faith
06-18-2014 6:38 AM


I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

Your quote does not say how God does any of those things. Surely you saw that lack before you posted it, so I'm wondering why you bothered.

Further you say this: "God makes everything happen, but He normally doesn't use miraculous means."

I take this to mean that you understand there are exceptions to the non miraculous means rule in the Bible.


Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)

I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei

If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass


This message is a reply to:
 Message 46 by Faith, posted 06-18-2014 6:38 AM Faith has not yet responded

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 87 of 108 (729799)
06-19-2014 7:13 AM
Reply to: Message 86 by Faith
06-19-2014 7:01 AM


Re: From the "on/off-topic fuzzy" zone
I object to your characterization of creationist explanations as "magicking" anything, which is something you love to do.

You can object all you want. There is nothing off topic or inappropriate about doing so.

And speaking of unscientific stupidity, I hope you'll think through your new thread proposal a bit before it gets promoted. Do you know where rain water comes from?

Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.

Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.


Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)

I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei

If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass


This message is a reply to:
 Message 86 by Faith, posted 06-19-2014 7:01 AM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 88 by Faith, posted 06-19-2014 7:25 AM NoNukes has responded

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


(1)
Message 100 of 108 (729828)
06-19-2014 4:33 PM
Reply to: Message 88 by Faith
06-19-2014 7:25 AM


Re: From the "on/off-topic fuzzy" zone
As for where rain comes from, why don't all you know-it-alls at least acknowledge the one basic fact of the creationist position which is that THINGS WERE DIFFERENT BACK THEN.

Because the position is stupid? There was never water suspended in a canopy over the earth.


Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)

I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei

If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass


This message is a reply to:
 Message 88 by Faith, posted 06-19-2014 7:25 AM Faith has not yet responded

  
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