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Author Topic:   Addiction By Definition
Tangle
Member
Posts: 7068
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.5


(1)
Message 101 of 330 (794843)
11-29-2016 9:13 AM
Reply to: Message 100 by Thugpreacha
11-29-2016 8:42 AM


Re: Day 135
Jesus doesn't save, you do.

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien.

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 100 by Thugpreacha, posted 11-29-2016 8:42 AM Thugpreacha has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 102 by Thugpreacha, posted 11-30-2016 1:25 PM Tangle has not yet responded

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 7068
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.5


Message 120 of 330 (795821)
12-17-2016 5:31 PM
Reply to: Message 117 by Thugpreacha
12-17-2016 2:31 PM


Re: Looking Back Over The Past Year Day 153
Phat writes:

Seeing as how my topic is about addiction, perhaps we could discuss the idea of religion as a possible addiction. At what point does belief and subsequent action become addictive rather than prescriptive?

Like all addictions, it's when you feel that can't do without it.


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien.

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 117 by Thugpreacha, posted 12-17-2016 2:31 PM Thugpreacha has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 123 by Thugpreacha, posted 12-18-2016 7:58 AM Tangle has responded

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 7068
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.5


(3)
Message 127 of 330 (795859)
12-18-2016 1:03 PM
Reply to: Message 123 by Thugpreacha
12-18-2016 7:58 AM


Re: Day 154 Tangling with addictions
Phat writes:

What is it?
The idea of God or God Himself?

I have no idea Phat, I think only you can answer that. All I can say is that when you stop thinking about God, praying, attending church and all the paraphenalia of a religious addiction you suddenly liberate a load of time and space for new stuff and you feel responsible for your own life.

What would I replace this addiction with?

Fishing.


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien.

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 123 by Thugpreacha, posted 12-18-2016 7:58 AM Thugpreacha has not yet responded

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 7068
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.5


Message 137 of 330 (797172)
01-13-2017 1:53 PM
Reply to: Message 136 by Thugpreacha
01-13-2017 1:05 PM


Re: Day 180
Phat writes:

Am I sober 180 days due to myself or did God play a part in this?

Speaking of flip sides, when you were a drunk, did god play a part in it?

It's very common to bless god for deliverance but fail to blame him for being a total shit about other stuff.

Edited by Tangle, : No reason given.


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien.

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 136 by Thugpreacha, posted 01-13-2017 1:05 PM Thugpreacha has acknowledged this reply

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 7068
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.5


(1)
Message 181 of 330 (811698)
06-10-2017 5:33 PM
Reply to: Message 180 by Thugpreacha
06-10-2017 5:24 PM


Re: Day 328. Staring In The Mirror
Phat writes:

Religion itself could be a form of addiction.

Religion is the opium of the masses.

What concerns me is that my current arguments are not even as good as these were in the two threads.

Which is in contrst to your logic, argument and actions as an admin.

It seems to me that you're becoming rational.


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 180 by Thugpreacha, posted 06-10-2017 5:24 PM Thugpreacha has acknowledged this reply

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 7068
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.5


Message 215 of 330 (829988)
03-19-2018 5:12 PM
Reply to: Message 214 by Thugpreacha
03-19-2018 5:02 PM


Re: Day 91 and also Day 4
Phat writes:

Stay tuned as I chronicle this topic in scientific detail as well as anecdotal observation.

It seems to me that you're making eating just another one of your obsessions. If you want to be 'normal' why not behave like a normal? Eating is not something you need to make into a big thing. Normal isn't researching, calibrating and chronicling everything you cook and ingest and looking for admiration; normal is just eating what you like and being sensible about it.


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 214 by Thugpreacha, posted 03-19-2018 5:02 PM Thugpreacha has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 217 by Thugpreacha, posted 03-20-2018 11:06 AM Tangle has responded
 Message 227 by Thugpreacha, posted 09-15-2018 7:19 AM Tangle has not yet responded

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 7068
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.5


(1)
Message 218 of 330 (830035)
03-20-2018 11:29 AM
Reply to: Message 217 by Thugpreacha
03-20-2018 11:06 AM


Re: Day 91 and also Day 4
Phat writes:

I challenge you to find any snake oil in the supplements that I have chosen to reboot my body. Lets start with this one. Go ahead, look it up. You will find nothing negative, and you will find that some very intelligent and educated scientists are on board as supporting its effectiveness.

The point is that everything your body needs to sustain itself is available in a normal, balanced diet. Add in some excercise - preferably natural like walking to work or digging the garden, a low stress job and a good family life, a bit of alcohol and maybe for you a bit of prayer, and you've got what you need.

Supplements are only necessary if you have a deficiency in something. You don't seem to be a wealthy man Phat, why are you wasting money on this nonsense?


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 217 by Thugpreacha, posted 03-20-2018 11:06 AM Thugpreacha has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 220 by Thugpreacha, posted 03-20-2018 11:47 AM Tangle has responded

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 7068
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.5


Message 222 of 330 (830082)
03-20-2018 7:36 PM
Reply to: Message 220 by Thugpreacha
03-20-2018 11:47 AM


Re: Day 91 and also Day 4
Phat writes:

It's only $45.00 for a 3 month supply. I'll chalk it up to my entertainment budget.

Ok, so long as you really do think of it that way. But you don't, do you?

Don't tell me that you don't have any spending habits that could be scrutinized!

Well actually I don't. I am a wealthy man by any measure but I find it hard to spend money on things that I'm 'supposed' to like cars and houses etc. Wealth is not the issue, it's need that we're talking about. You appear to need things - God's, gambling, diets, miracle cures. It's a personality disorder of a relatively minor sort that you won't solve with a miracle cure like a diet or a supplement. Don't waste your time and money.


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 220 by Thugpreacha, posted 03-20-2018 11:47 AM Thugpreacha has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 223 by Thugpreacha, posted 03-21-2018 3:24 AM Tangle has not yet responded
 Message 224 by Thugpreacha, posted 04-03-2018 10:22 AM Tangle has not yet responded

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 7068
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.5


(2)
Message 231 of 330 (849695)
03-18-2019 9:29 AM
Reply to: Message 230 by Thugpreacha
03-18-2019 7:15 AM


Re: The Science and Theory of Addiction
Phat writes:

The rational brain is a good wolf. The animal brain is the bad wolf. Comments?

It's better not to equate natural processes as good and bad; they're neutral. The 'animal brain' as you call it is actually the more primitive parts of our brain that mostly deal with survival and reproduction, breathing, sweating, feeling, seeing, hearing etc etc. It's not bad, it's essential to life.

The bits of the brain that makes us human are those responsible for executive functions - decision making, rational analysis, planning the future etc etc

Your executive functions regulate your desires and try prevent you doing things that feel good but might be bad for you or that are antisocial and destructive. They're developmental and need help to work.

https://developingchild.harvard.edu/...ts/executive-function


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 230 by Thugpreacha, posted 03-18-2019 7:15 AM Thugpreacha has acknowledged this reply

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 7068
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.5


Message 256 of 330 (849967)
03-27-2019 5:21 PM
Reply to: Message 255 by ringo
03-27-2019 3:07 PM


Re: Rational Mind vs Irrational Intrusive and Primitive Thoughts
Um...god is supposed to be all knowing - what's with this committee majority shit?

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 255 by ringo, posted 03-27-2019 3:07 PM ringo has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 257 by Thugpreacha, posted 03-28-2019 2:23 AM Tangle has responded
 Message 262 by ringo, posted 03-28-2019 11:41 AM Tangle has responded

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 7068
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.5


Message 258 of 330 (849982)
03-28-2019 4:31 AM
Reply to: Message 257 by Thugpreacha
03-28-2019 2:23 AM


Re: Rational Mind vs Irrational Intrusive and Primitive Thoughts
Phat writes:

A better question is whether a Creator Of All Seen & Unseen can be thought of the rational mind without evidence. Pros & Cons?

There is no such thing as the rational mind - it's a metaphor. 'A creator' can be thought of by a brain in a rational (evidence based) or irrational (belief based) way or a mixture of both.


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 257 by Thugpreacha, posted 03-28-2019 2:23 AM Thugpreacha has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 259 by Thugpreacha, posted 03-28-2019 10:46 AM Tangle has responded

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 7068
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.5


Message 261 of 330 (850007)
03-28-2019 11:23 AM
Reply to: Message 259 by Thugpreacha
03-28-2019 10:46 AM


Re: Addicted To Jesus
Phat writes:

Can Belief be rational if unevidenced?

As a general principle, belief in something for which there is no evidence can not ever be rational.

But it gets blurred when you start talking about it philosophically. I think it's possible to have a rational belief in a non-interventionist, non-theistic god so long as you've gone through the various logical positions and formed a conclusion based on them.

I don't believe that belief in a theistic god is ever rational nor do I think that anybody arrives at their beliefs via a rational process so it's of accademic interest anyway.


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 259 by Thugpreacha, posted 03-28-2019 10:46 AM Thugpreacha has acknowledged this reply

Replies to this message:
 Message 267 by Porkncheese, posted 03-30-2019 8:35 AM Tangle has responded

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 7068
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.5


Message 264 of 330 (850010)
03-28-2019 11:49 AM
Reply to: Message 262 by ringo
03-28-2019 11:41 AM


Re: Rational Mind vs Irrational Intrusive and Primitive Thoughts
If he ain't all knowing, all powerful, all loving and all over the place he ain't the god I was taught about. But sure, it's all made up anyway so why not have a committee. No problem.

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 262 by ringo, posted 03-28-2019 11:41 AM ringo has acknowledged this reply

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 7068
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.5


Message 270 of 330 (850076)
03-30-2019 1:52 PM
Reply to: Message 267 by Porkncheese
03-30-2019 8:35 AM


Re: Addicted To Jesus
P&C writes:

I was always told it was based on faith. So I agree, both theists and atheists are irrational.

Theists and atheists can be both rational and irrational. It's belief in a god without evidence - faith - which is the irrational position.

Seeing 95% of theoretical scientists begin with the theist question of God (which everyone agrees doesn't belong in science).
And so take on the position of atheist as the basis of their studies its fair to say the theoretical science is irrational.

That's just gobbledegook. What do you think you mean? Are you saying that because science concerns itself with objective, fact-based, analysis of the natural word that it is atheistic? And 'therefore' irrational? If so, it doesn't make logical sense.

Well thought out Tangle. I can confirm your conclusion with the simple fact that rational questioning is always blocked.

Try not to be childish.

Is that like a deist?

It's a god that does not intervene in human affairs.

non-theistic god
Can u please explain this further cos I couldn't find any kind of definition of it.

quote:
theism
/ˈθiːɪz(ə)m/
noun
belief in the existence of a god or gods, specifically of a creator who intervenes in the universe.
"there are many different forms of theism"

Basically a religion.

Im not even sure how to define what I think now. Maybe still just agnostic seeing i have no problem admitting I don't know.
But I actually now think there is a high probability that there is some kind of God that is undefinable to us. Nothing more.

Nobody knows. Atheists don't know either. There's nothing special about not knowing. But belief is a binary, positive thing - you either have it or you don't. If you don't have that belief, then you're an atheist. Atheism just means lacking belief in god(s).


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 267 by Porkncheese, posted 03-30-2019 8:35 AM Porkncheese has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 275 by Porkncheese, posted 04-03-2019 10:42 AM Tangle has not yet responded

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 7068
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.5


(1)
Message 281 of 330 (850316)
04-06-2019 4:09 AM
Reply to: Message 278 by Porkncheese
04-05-2019 6:52 PM


P&C writes:

I was hoping to to talk to Tangle...

You got lucky.

So if an atheist tells me there is no God it would be rational for me to say there is [no god] according to your logic.

If you agree with my insert to your statement, then yes.

A tentative position would be agnostic as we don't have all the info/evidence available.

We are all agnostics, both believers and atheists. That's because agnosticism deals with knowledge not belief and none of us have knowledge of god.

Agnosticism is purely word play. You either believe or you don't. If you don't know if you believe or not, then you don't believe. If you don't believe in god(s) you are an atheist

We aren't stuck between a black and white fallacious decision.

We are, and it's not fallacious. The existence or non-existence of god(s) is binary. There either is or there isn't. The fact that we don't and can't know is irrelevant to his/their existence.

If someone says all swans are white, all he's saying is that he's only seen white swans therefore he believes that all swans are white. He has evidence of white swans and no evidence of black swans so his belief seems rational. But without total knowledge of all swans, it's actually only a hypothesis.

The existence of god(s) is a hypothesis. Believers believe in them, atheists don't. Neither know, but atheists have the stronger hypothesis.

Eg. I have a beard. Do u believe me?

Well you either have or you haven't, what I believe about it is irrelevant.

What I KNOW is that beards DO exist. So unless you give me reason to doubt you, I'll happily accept what you say, particularly as it a matter of no consequence. But if you then said that it was a prehensile beard and it can take food off you plate and put it in your mouth I'm going to call you a liar and ask for evidence. I'm now atheistic about your beard.


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 278 by Porkncheese, posted 04-05-2019 6:52 PM Porkncheese has not yet responded

  
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