Ambiguity-uncertainty-vagueness the key to resistance against the idea of evolution?

Do you accept the fact that allele frequencies in populations change over time?

But if you have learned anything in the mutation thread you should have learned that what is considered "deformity" in some environments is actually an advantageous adaptation in another.The same is true with some diseases, with Sickle Cell Disease coming to mind. Sure, it causes anemia and other nasty symptoms but it also confers immunity to malaria, which is the more deadly of the conditions. People with Sickle Cell can live long enough to reproduce, while malaria kills lots of infants and children.And, lo and behold, we see SCD in populations which have been living for hundreds of generations in places where malaria is common.What is an undesireable disease in NYC is quite the reproductive advantage where there is malaria.

Those are apparently quite rare occurrences but yes, very interesting that even in the process of deteriorating there are occasionally positive side effects. One can hardly call SCD an advantage, however, except in this negative sense that it happens to protect against malaria. As I understand it, all? or most? of these mutations confer their benefit by simply eliminating something the attacking disease or toxin needs in order to infect or kill the person or organism. None of this challenges the idea of the Fall in any way that I can see.

Faith, can you come up with any philosophical argument that there was a Fall, apart from Bibilical references?On the face of it, it all looks accidental.

No, that's why we need the Bible, because we can't figure out what really happened without it. No man-originated religion has ever grasped the Fall, though there are vaguely related ideas, such as about human spiritual ignorance, delusion and the like, from Hinduism and Buddhism in particular.Soon as I grasped the idea of the Fall myself, the idea of Original Sin, I thought it explained reality perfectly. That as much as anything else in Christianity made a believer of me. The brokenness of our world, the very accidents you mention, the diseases and disasters, all human misery, all the evil within human beings, murders and war and the works, is explained by original sin to my mind, and absolutely nothing else explains it. That's the best I can do for a philosophical argument.

We're in a Science Forum Faith.Time to back up your assertions with some evidence for something called the Fall.Or you can admit yet again that you are wrong!ROTFLMAO.

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

I suppose one might be able to come up with some "argument from conscience." We know these things are bad, but how do we know it? Why does the world seem so unfair? After all, all we have is this world. What is this ideal that we are comparing it to? It must be an ideal buried in collective human memory, of Paradise.Not much of an argument, I don't think.Perhaps the reason for my unbelief is my fear of ambiguity! ha! I can't handle all those paradoxes about the concept of God.

[qs]Or you can admit yet again that you are wrong!/qsThis should be worded as:
"Or you can admit that you are wrong yet again."Faith has never admitted to being wrong so the "yet again" can not refer to the "admit". However, Faith has frequently been wrong so the "yet again" can refer to that.

Not having scientific evidence for a supernaturally revealed fact does not automatically make one wrong -- except of course in this particular corner of the universe.

This is a science forum? I didn't know that. Doesn't seem like it.

Support your assertions, Faith. Evidence.You're not in your little playpen where we work so hard to protect you. Now you're in the real world, not fantasyland.Evidence for the FALL Faith.

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

Perhaps it would be appropriate or educational for Faith if you supplied evidence against the "fall"?

It just BECAME a science forum for the purpose of hounding me about evidence, RR, or in other words they just remembered that it is for that purpose. LOL

It's near impossible to provide evidence against something that never happened in the first place. But I do have great hope that someday Faith will begin to understand what Christianity is all about.

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

One can provide evidence against the Biblical flood easily enough.The fall is less discussed in this way. This isn't the thread for it by the way but one in Bible accuracy and inerrancy might be interesting.As an example thought: If the fall has occured it is clearly (to me anyway) being reversed. All the records we have show that we, on average, live longer and toil less for food. This seems to be a general trend of history.It may well be that the rest is based on a lack of evidence which is harder to work with. However, it may be possible to say that the effects of the fall simply are not there.