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Author Topic:   Self-Driving Cars
Tangle
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Posts: 7090
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 3.8


Message 7 of 142 (767530)
08-30-2015 1:34 PM


Fantastic, more civil rights and freedom arguments in the pipeline. You guys are going to need a whole new Amendment. 'Cars don't kill people, people do.'

Of course the car manufacturers will hate it, everything will have to be standardised and compatible. How can you have a 12 cylinder, fuel injected, turbo charge, chickogasmic status symbol if it can't break the speed limit and has to do exactly what the guy next door's car does that got his from Walmart. Hell, it's almost communism. All you can do is pimp the HiFi.


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif.

Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


Replies to this message:
 Message 8 by Capt Stormfield, posted 08-30-2015 1:42 PM Tangle has not yet responded

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 7090
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 3.8


Message 10 of 142 (767538)
08-30-2015 2:04 PM
Reply to: Message 9 by Jon
08-30-2015 1:42 PM


Jon writes:

I can understand people being very uncomfortable with knowing that no matter what they do on their way to work, the only thing keeping them from ending up on the other side of the windshield is statistical good luck.

They seem to accept that eventuality everytime they step onto a train, bus or plane.


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif.

Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 9 by Jon, posted 08-30-2015 1:42 PM Jon has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 12 by Jon, posted 08-30-2015 3:01 PM Tangle has responded

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 7090
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 3.8


Message 15 of 142 (767574)
08-30-2015 4:10 PM
Reply to: Message 12 by Jon
08-30-2015 3:01 PM


Re: Public Transportation
Woah! There are billions of passenger miles on public transport travelled every year - especially in Europe. Even so, it'll be another case of 'out of my cold dead hands for some/many.

But robocars will behave a lot like public transport when on the move, they'll lock onto the car in front and form 'roadtrains' on the freeways.


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif.

Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 12 by Jon, posted 08-30-2015 3:01 PM Jon has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 19 by Jon, posted 08-30-2015 6:42 PM Tangle has responded

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 7090
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 3.8


Message 21 of 142 (767609)
08-31-2015 3:23 AM
Reply to: Message 19 by Jon
08-30-2015 6:42 PM


Re: Public Transportation
Jon writes:

And at that point you're just talking about a very inefficient form of 'public' transportation.

I wonder. Trains are pretty efficient but apart from rush hours, they don't run full and you have to get to and from their terminus's, usually by car. Cars running a couple of feet apart will have much better aerodynamics and they won't be on the road at all unless someone needs to be there, so every 'carriage' will be occupied all the time. Though I guess it'll be like today with most cars running with only a single passenger. Not as efficient as just the train element of the journey but more efficient than now.

Some quite interesting things occur though. The car could drive you to the theatre in the centre of town, drop you off, self park out of town, then pick you up after. If you think about it, you don't actually need a car anymore. You could just pay a monthly subscription to have acces to one, then call one up when you want one. Send it away when you're finished. You get your garage back to keep your hooch in and you don't have to clean, service and insure the damn thing.


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif.

Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 19 by Jon, posted 08-30-2015 6:42 PM Jon has not yet responded

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 7090
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 3.8


Message 33 of 142 (767788)
09-02-2015 1:46 AM
Reply to: Message 32 by NoNukes
09-02-2015 12:17 AM


Re: Google Goes Bladeless, Plus Random Thoughts
NoNukes writes:

Maybe having self driving cars might mean fewer traffic jams.

I seem to remember something about queue theory that says that for a given amount of stuff moving through a given size aperture there's an optimum speed that gets the most stuff through. Too fast and the stuff backs up and causes waves right back down the line, which build to cause jams. Sometimes on a motorway (freeway) when there's a lot of traffic you come to a halt, then you move for a while, then you stop again - for no apparent reason. That's what's happening - possibly because three or four hours previously one lane was virtually closed by a slow moving truck.

If all the traffic is receiving messages from the road about 'smart' speeds and, more importantly, being forced to stick to them, in theory you get optimum flow.

You should also get reduced accidents too. No more dramatic lane changing, no lane hogging, no excessive speeding, no falling asleep at the wheel, no human error. It seems to me that it's accidents that cause most jams.

Can't do much about road works I guess though. Except your car would know about them in advance and avoid them if possible. Which would make traffic news items redundant.

No more driving tests or licences to lose. Drink driving returns!..it just keeps getting better....


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif.

Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 32 by NoNukes, posted 09-02-2015 12:17 AM NoNukes has acknowledged this reply

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 7090
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 3.8


Message 53 of 142 (780732)
03-19-2016 2:25 PM


Just on the crash rate thing - google's crash rate will be totally accurate, but I assume that the human crash rate will be massively understated. Humans have dozens of minor accidents that don't get reported - either to police or insurance. Or do they have a clever way of sampling those?

Also it's probably fair to assume that google will improve while people will still be people - albeit with improvements to people-driven cars too.


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien.

Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 7090
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 3.8


Message 73 of 142 (830083)
03-20-2018 7:45 PM


quote:
Nearly 1.3 million people die in road crashes each year, on average 3,287 deaths a day. An additional 20-50 million are injured or disabled.

But this one made the news. We needed to get the first ones out of the way because deaths and injuries can'r be prevented - just lessened - and it looks like this one is a 'good' one.


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 7090
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 3.8


Message 120 of 142 (845118)
12-12-2018 11:23 AM


I'd have to spend more time than I want to to show this but it's always the case that new technologies always take an awful lot longer than you'd expect to be adopted. If you're interested it's covered by the diffusion of innovation theory.

I can't remember now, but it was an extraordinarily long time after colour television was invented until it reached mass market penetration. And we had b&w Tvs already.

But there's a lot of evidence showing that the innovation curve is getting faster and, of course, there's vast quantities of investment and effort going into both AI and AI cars now which tends to speed things up.


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


Replies to this message:
 Message 123 by NosyNed, posted 12-12-2018 12:33 PM Tangle has not yet responded

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 7090
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 3.8


Message 125 of 142 (845152)
12-12-2018 3:32 PM
Reply to: Message 124 by Percy
12-12-2018 3:13 PM


Re: Part Of The Problem
Percy writes:

But try, "Hey Siri, show 17 Cowesett Road, Warwick, RI" and it will get it wrong time after time no matter how carefully you pronounce "Cowesett.

A human would get that wrong every time too - unless they came from there.

All Siri has to do is what a human would do and ask to spell it. Simples :-)


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 124 by Percy, posted 12-12-2018 3:13 PM Percy has acknowledged this reply

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 7090
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 3.8


Message 130 of 142 (845161)
12-12-2018 5:21 PM
Reply to: Message 129 by Percy
12-12-2018 4:59 PM


Re: sneaking up on us
Percy writes:

But take the simple case of a policeman with his hand up indicating stop.

Any person in the road would cause the car to stop - I would hope.

But you are imagining a the world as it is now, not how it would be. The first cars in this country had to be led by a chap with a red flag, that didn't last long. Barriers to the inevitable are pushed aside or worked around.


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 129 by Percy, posted 12-12-2018 4:59 PM Percy has acknowledged this reply

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 7090
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 3.8


Message 132 of 142 (845185)
12-13-2018 3:19 AM
Reply to: Message 131 by Tanypteryx
12-12-2018 7:04 PM


Tany writes:

If the change in infrastructure to accommodate electric self drivers does indeed happen on these short timescales it will force the poor to lose their access to personal transportation.

I think it may do the opposite. It should make public transport cheaper and more reliable. But more importantly it removes the requirement to own a car or even rent one. Once cars are self-drive you can just order one for your journey and wave bye-bye to it when it drops you off.

Imagine all those empty parking lots. - all that new space.


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 131 by Tanypteryx, posted 12-12-2018 7:04 PM Tanypteryx has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 133 by Pressie, posted 12-13-2018 5:36 AM Tangle has not yet responded
 Message 137 by ringo, posted 12-13-2018 10:50 AM Tangle has responded

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 7090
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 3.8


Message 138 of 142 (845209)
12-13-2018 10:59 AM
Reply to: Message 137 by ringo
12-13-2018 10:50 AM


ringo writes:

There's an incentive for the auto industry.

Yeh but their incentive is to still have a business at all.

They may even do better because in theory they could cut out the entire chain of distributors and dealerships. The cars just drive off the conveyor belt to wherever they're needed then work their wheels off generating fee income day and night.


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 137 by ringo, posted 12-13-2018 10:50 AM ringo has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 139 by ringo, posted 12-13-2018 11:06 AM Tangle has not yet responded

  
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