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Author Topic:   Creation
New Cat's Eye
Inactive Member


(3)
Message 6 of 1482 (782429)
04-22-2016 10:40 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by ICANT
04-22-2016 3:13 AM


Thus the Bible and science agrees that the universe began to exist and it is old.

But science disagrees with the that very first verse in the Bible because the earth was not created in the beginning. There's billions of years between the beginning of the universe and the beginning of the earth.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by ICANT, posted 04-22-2016 3:13 AM ICANT has responded

Replies to this message:
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New Cat's Eye
Inactive Member


Message 13 of 1482 (782438)
04-23-2016 10:29 AM
Reply to: Message 7 by ICANT
04-23-2016 2:28 AM


Genesis 1:1 Does not say the heaven and the earth were created at the same moment. It just says they were created in the beginning.

So where is the problem?

Its a singular beginning, since they were both created in it, they were created at the same moment. It does not say that the heaven and the earth were created in beginnings.

The earth we live on today had to have many growing events

Those are not beginnings. The earth was created in the beginning, growing events are another thing.

Edited by Cat Sci, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 7 by ICANT, posted 04-23-2016 2:28 AM ICANT has responded

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New Cat's Eye
Inactive Member


Message 73 of 1482 (782678)
04-27-2016 4:18 PM
Reply to: Message 72 by ICANT
04-27-2016 4:10 PM


Chronology?
Can you list the verses in the Bible in chronological order?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 72 by ICANT, posted 04-27-2016 4:10 PM ICANT has responded

Replies to this message:
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New Cat's Eye
Inactive Member


Message 77 of 1482 (782690)
04-27-2016 5:01 PM
Reply to: Message 76 by ICANT
04-27-2016 4:53 PM


Re: Chronology?
Can you list the verses in the Bible in the order in which they occurred in time?

Like this:

Gen 1:1
Gen 2:4 - ?
Gen 1:2 - Gen 2:3
Gen 5? - ???

Edited by Cat Sci, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 76 by ICANT, posted 04-27-2016 4:53 PM ICANT has responded

Replies to this message:
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New Cat's Eye
Inactive Member


Message 89 of 1482 (782737)
04-28-2016 9:46 AM
Reply to: Message 78 by ICANT
04-27-2016 9:52 PM


Re: Chronology?
Genesis 1:1 took place in the beginning whenever that was.
Genesis 2:4 is the history of the day God created the heavens and the earth.
Genesis 2:5-4:24 is the history of the day God created the heavens and the earth and took place the same day God created the heavens and the earth.

That is what the text says.

Where does the text say to omit Gen 4:25-26 from the history of that day?

So this is how it goes:

Gen 1:1
Gen 2:4 - Gen 4:24or26
Gen 1:2 - Gen 2:3

Then it goes to Gen 5?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 78 by ICANT, posted 04-27-2016 9:52 PM ICANT has responded

Replies to this message:
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New Cat's Eye
Inactive Member


Message 92 of 1482 (782759)
04-28-2016 2:39 PM
Reply to: Message 90 by NoNukes
04-28-2016 1:51 PM


Re: Chronology?
The universe was created in 1:1, and then silently fell apart before 1:2? Where does that come from?

The idea is that the Garden of Eden story occurred first, during a gap between Gen 1:1 and Gen 1:2. Then god reset the earth and created a new male and female in his own image, which lead down the lineage to the Flood and on to today. There was some excuse about "Adam" in Gen 5 just meaning "a man" and totally not being the guy that was named Adam in Gen 2.

He's lining up Gen 2:4 with Gen 1 as both being in the same day that god created the heavens and the earth. And he's lining up Gen 5:1-2 with Gen 1:27 as being the same timeframe when God made male and female in his own image.

So the chronology would be as I wrote:

Gen 1:1
Gen 2:4 - Gen 4:24*
Gen 1:2 - Gen 2:3
Gen 5 onwards.

The problem that he never got around was that Gen 4:25-26 ends with:

quote:
And Adam knew his wife again; and she bare a son, and called his name Seth: For God, said she, hath appointed me another seed instead of Abel, whom Cain slew.

And to Seth, to him also there was born a son; and he called his name Enos: then began men to call upon the name of the LORD.


While Gen 5 starts with:

quote:
And Adam lived an hundred and thirty years, and begat a son in his own likeness, after his image; and called his name Seth:

And the days of Adam after he had begotten Seth were eight hundred years: and he begat sons and daughters:

And all the days that Adam lived were nine hundred and thirty years: and he died.

And Seth lived an hundred and five years, and begat Enos:


So we'd have to have two different Adams, who both had sons named Seth who both had sons named Enos. I think he ended our last discussion with that not being impossible, so he was still right.

This time around though, he decided to just chop those last two verses off of his narrative and have Gen 4 end at verse 24*.

I was asking where the text said to do that.


This message is a reply to:
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New Cat's Eye
Inactive Member


Message 279 of 1482 (814677)
07-11-2017 7:42 PM
Reply to: Message 277 by Tom Larkin
07-11-2017 6:26 PM


Re: Alignment Evolution and Genesis
which eliminates the conflict with evolution

How so?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 277 by Tom Larkin, posted 07-11-2017 6:26 PM Tom Larkin has responded

Replies to this message:
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New Cat's Eye
Inactive Member


Message 308 of 1482 (814987)
07-14-2017 10:24 AM
Reply to: Message 297 by Tom Larkin
07-13-2017 6:09 PM


Re: Alignment Evolution and Genesis
which eliminates the conflict with evolution

How so?

Men and woman in chapter 1 ("daughters of men") were created prior to Adam and Eve ("sons of God")in Chapter 2.

I disagree. The first two chapters in Genesis are not in any chronological order.

Also, according to history, Chapter 2 was actually written before Chapter 1.

Men and women in Chapter 1, I speculate, we created by God are part of the normal evolution process, just like all the other creation in Chapter 1

So you have speculated that there is no conflict, not "eliminated" it, correct?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 297 by Tom Larkin, posted 07-13-2017 6:09 PM Tom Larkin has not yet responded

  
New Cat's Eye
Inactive Member


(1)
Message 309 of 1482 (814988)
07-14-2017 10:27 AM
Reply to: Message 299 by Faith
07-13-2017 6:28 PM


Re: Alignment Evolution and Genesis
So you apparently agree with others here that Paul was lying when he said in the Romans passage I quoted in Message 280 and Message 283 that death entered the world as a result of Adam's sin?

If I say:

"Just like Star Trek had the Prime Directive, if we find life on another planet then we need to be careful."

Am I claiming that Star Trek is a real thing that actually happened?
Or can I just be referencing a commonly understood fiction?
Given that Star Trek is not real, would I be lying to say what I said?

I don't think so: Star Trek really does have a Prime Directive. We all just know that I'm referencing fiction.

Perhaps Paul was doing the same?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 299 by Faith, posted 07-13-2017 6:28 PM Faith has not yet responded

  
New Cat's Eye
Inactive Member


Message 388 of 1482 (817996)
08-22-2017 1:24 PM
Reply to: Message 387 by kbertsche
08-22-2017 1:13 PM


Re: days and dates
the only place for the earth/land and waters to be created is in verse 1.

So there's "The Earth", which is our world. Then there is the "earth", which is the land in our world.

In verse 1, our world was formless and void - that tells me that it existed but it hadn't physically existed as land yet.

It isn't until verse 9 that the land is talked about being seen, which implies that it didn't physically exist as land until the third day.

As I see it: our world was created on the first day but the land didn't exist until the third.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 387 by kbertsche, posted 08-22-2017 1:13 PM kbertsche has not yet responded

  
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