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Author Topic:   The 2016 United States Presidential Election
RAZD
Member (Idle past 1516 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


(2)
Message 15 of 892 (792467)
10-10-2016 9:48 AM
Reply to: Message 11 by Percy
10-08-2016 1:56 PM


PEEPING TOM @ Miss Universe
But one has to ask, "Why now?" Trump's true nature is no secret and has been no secret. As Trump's campaign management team is being repeatedly taught, it isn't possible to stop "Trump being Trump." As the antics mount more and more Republicans are finding their reserves of stoicism drained and their ability to continue expressing support exhausted.
This tape plus the new revelations that he boasted of walking into the dressing room at the Miss Universe "contest" in order to see the contestants naked. -- add peeping tom pervert to the list.
Curious that these are being suddenly released now, in counterpoint to the wikileaks about Clinton and the Podesta emails. The Clinton machine built him up and got him a lot of that extra media exposure -- you can be sure that they also had the dirt to use when necessary.
Frankly I am thoroughly disgusted by this years election garbage, these cess-pool occupying candidates, by far the worst choices in decades.
yechh

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This message is a reply to:
 Message 11 by Percy, posted 10-08-2016 1:56 PM Percy has seen this message but not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 16 by Diomedes, posted 10-10-2016 10:02 AM RAZD has replied
 Message 18 by 14174dm, posted 10-10-2016 12:49 PM RAZD has replied
 Message 27 by GDR, posted 10-10-2016 5:24 PM RAZD has replied

  
RAZD
Member (Idle past 1516 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


(1)
Message 17 of 892 (792474)
10-10-2016 11:04 AM
Reply to: Message 16 by Diomedes
10-10-2016 10:02 AM


Race to the Bottom
... I could only stomach watching parts of it. But I did watch some of the post-debate analysis. ...
I find it difficult to listen to either one, and each new revelation makes it that much worse.
... one of the folks on CNN said that 'politics has sunk to a new low'. I would say that is probably accurate.
It's like they are actively racing to the bottom to see how low they can go.
We just got back from 3 weeks in Canada, where headlines were about local politics, and it was quite a relief. My phone had no service (thanks Verizon) and we went from B&B to B&B up to Cape Breton and back, enjoying the views. Very therapeutic.
The only problem I had was our first night on the Bay of Fundy we went to these caves that were open to walk into at low tide but flooded at high tide so you could kayak into them, and I slipped on some seaweed and sprained my wrist -- the kayaks we brought stayed on the car for the duration of the trip.
Now I have to finish the all new front porch before winter.
Fun

we are limited in our ability to understand
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RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
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RAZD
Member (Idle past 1516 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 22 of 892 (792489)
10-10-2016 4:47 PM
Reply to: Message 18 by 14174dm
10-10-2016 12:49 PM


The Clinton Machine
Seriously? You don't think the GOP brought this on themselves?
The GOP set the groundwork via hate-media that enabled Trump to be a candidate, but the impetus for all that media coverage that he received gratus from the main-stream media came from the Clinton Machine using their "contacts" with the media (big donors) in order to get him to be the RNC candidate, even if they didn't like it.
Read the leaked emails -- it lays out this very game plan:
quote:
Leaked Emails Show That Trump Was a Tool Used by the Hillary Campaign From Day One
Calling them the "pied piper" candidates, team Hillary describes Trump, Cruz, and Carson as nominees that could - if handled properly - make the extreme the mainstream.
"We need to be elevating the Pied Piper candidates so that they are leaders of the pack and tell the press to them seriously," it said in the email.
The summary is that the DNC and the Clinton campaign wanted Trump to be Hillary's opponent because they knew his extreme stances could be used to alienate and divide. They could then use these candidates to paint the Republican party as a whole as something dangerous.
Trump was a tool for Hillary's campaign all along. She wanted the press to take Trump seriously, put him up as the most viable option for Republicans, and the right took the bait, hook, line, and sinker. Now with the Trump campaign burning to the ground, and GOP leaders walking away due to his recent comments, the Clinton campaign's plan to put Hillary on top is coming to fruition.
It wasn't just Bernie that they rigged the system against, they've been planning this for years, and you can bet they have dirt on every candidate, including LOTS on Trump, to release when needed.
Enjoy

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RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
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This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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RAZD
Member (Idle past 1516 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 24 of 892 (792492)
10-10-2016 4:58 PM
Reply to: Message 21 by 1.61803
10-10-2016 4:05 PM


I will miss President Obama. ...
Hillary we shall see what she can do. ...
If she can't win house and senate, particularly senate, they will hog-tie her like the did Obama. The emails may still sink her with low voter turnout and with high voter burnout.
If she does win big, as now seems increasingly possible with a 50 state plan, she can deal the GOP the ultimate irony: Obama as Supreme Court Justice (a position he is highly qualified for). I don't believe he would accept but it is a wonderful thought.
Then we will see what her private positions are instead of her public positions -- especially as regards Wells Fargo and then Wall Street in general.
Unfortunately the big loser will be climate change. Again.
Enjoy

we are limited in our ability to understand
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RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
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RAZD
Member (Idle past 1516 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 25 of 892 (792494)
10-10-2016 5:13 PM
Reply to: Message 23 by Theodoric
10-10-2016 4:54 PM


Re: The Clinton Machine
The RNC wanted Bush. The media railroaded them into Trump -- all you need to do is look at all the anti-Trump republicans.
If you have more evidence for your conspiracy theory present it. If this is it than your argument is laughable.
You mean the rampant evidence of collusion of CNN MSNBC an other media with the Clinton campaign? Where the DNC and Clinton aides wrote the news? The collusion that resulted in a virtual blackout on the Bernie campaign while plastering Trump all over the place?
It's in the hacked emails.
Try google. Really. Or are you like Donna Brazile, afraid of the truth?
Just a moment...
Enjoy

we are limited in our ability to understand
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RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
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This message is a reply to:
 Message 23 by Theodoric, posted 10-10-2016 4:54 PM Theodoric has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 26 by Theodoric, posted 10-10-2016 5:17 PM RAZD has replied

  
RAZD
Member (Idle past 1516 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


(1)
Message 46 of 892 (792688)
10-13-2016 8:44 AM
Reply to: Message 34 by New Cat's Eye
10-12-2016 12:28 PM


Re: sigh
I'm just not going to vote.
I'm going to vote for Jill Stein for president in order to see if we can get the Green Party vote count over 5%.
Down ticket I am voting for progressives in federal and state positions -- building the progressive base that will put Bernies policies into law, eventually if not this election cycle,
And to take back the senate and the house, which is more important than president -- they write the laws and approve the appointments.
What Donald has done to the GOP certainly opens the door for a democrat takeover.
The problem democrats have is that they don't know how to get people to go to the polls -- they don't promote any burning social issues to get people excited. It's not like there are no issues they could use (minimum living wage, universal healthcare, #blacklivesmatter issues on police violence, free community college, etc), rather it is like they have forgotten what it's like to be an advocate for the people.
Enjoy

we are limited in our ability to understand
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RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
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This message is a reply to:
 Message 34 by New Cat's Eye, posted 10-12-2016 12:28 PM New Cat's Eye has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 52 by Percy, posted 10-13-2016 9:39 AM RAZD has replied
 Message 59 by New Cat's Eye, posted 10-13-2016 11:25 PM RAZD has replied

  
RAZD
Member (Idle past 1516 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 47 of 892 (792689)
10-13-2016 8:49 AM
Reply to: Message 44 by nwr
10-12-2016 9:46 PM


Re: International reactions?
... But using the office of the presidency to conduct a personal vendetta against one's political opponent surely fits.
You mean like invading Iraq on a pretext because Saddam threatened daddy bush?

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This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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RAZD
Member (Idle past 1516 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 48 of 892 (792690)
10-13-2016 8:52 AM
Reply to: Message 45 by nwr
10-12-2016 9:52 PM


Re: Recent Polls and Election Predictions
It may reach an even higher pitch during a Clinton administration, with a women in the oval office.
Most certainly they will if they retain a majority in the house and senate.
The senate is the most likely to fall, so at least appointments can be approved, the house has some systemic issues (gerrymandering), so not as likely.
Enjoy

we are limited in our ability to understand
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RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
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Replies to this message:
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RAZD
Member (Idle past 1516 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 49 of 892 (792691)
10-13-2016 8:59 AM
Reply to: Message 26 by Theodoric
10-10-2016 5:17 PM


Re: The Clinton Machine
Well since you claim it exists how about showing it.
The evidence is there in documents, mostly the emails, that show collusion, but I am not interested in converting you -- if you want to pursue the issue, fine, if you want to ignore it and feel cozy warm in ignoring it, also fine. This election has shown me that the vast majority of people are not interested in the fact that our democracy is under siege by the 1% or dealing with social issues, they are much more interested in the behavior of football players. Hillary is bought\colluding, the DNC is bought.
Enjoy

we are limited in our ability to understand
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RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
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This message is a reply to:
 Message 26 by Theodoric, posted 10-10-2016 5:17 PM Theodoric has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 53 by Theodoric, posted 10-13-2016 10:12 AM RAZD has replied

  
RAZD
Member (Idle past 1516 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 50 of 892 (792692)
10-13-2016 9:05 AM
Reply to: Message 27 by GDR
10-10-2016 5:24 PM


Re: PEEPING TOM @ Miss Universe
... What do you mean decades? I can't in my wildest imagination believethat there were EVER two worse candidates. ...
I mean the 50 years (5 decades) that I have personal knowledge of, and this includes two impeachment trials (Nixon and Clinton). Trump would likely be a fast 3rd, and if Hillary\DNC lose the 2018 election (house and senate) we can expect the GOP to play this game again.
We can also expect both to face legal trials if not elected.
Enjoy

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RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
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This message is a reply to:
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RAZD
Member (Idle past 1516 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 63 of 892 (792903)
10-14-2016 11:08 PM
Reply to: Message 51 by Diomedes
10-13-2016 9:35 AM


Re: Recent Polls and Election Predictions
If Hillary wins and they take over the senate, I would love to see them appoint the most far left individual they can find. ...
Elizabeth Warren.
... Although my instincts tell me that if they the Republicans do lose the senate, they will use their lame duck time frame to rush Garland's nomination through the process.
There could be 3 opportunities for the next president, but ...
... so at least appointments can be approved
That is what I am truly hoping for. ...
The bigger problem is that the democrats need to learn how to win off-year elections -- they are likely to lose the senate in 2018, and then we are back to gridlock, with even more vengeance, not just misogyny but because it is Hated Hillary.
The fear Trump gambit won't work in 2018. You need social issues to bring out voters ... like the progressive platform issues:
Living wage
Universal Health
Free Community College
etc etc etc
The DNC (under DWS) blew it in 2014 and lost the senate ... when #FightFor15 was producing strikes and marches and lots of publicity, the DNC was silent. Same with #BlackLivesMatter.
The need to be FOR the people in order to get the people to vote for them.
Enjoy

we are limited in our ability to understand
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RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
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This message is a reply to:
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RAZD
Member (Idle past 1516 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 64 of 892 (792904)
10-14-2016 11:15 PM
Reply to: Message 52 by Percy
10-13-2016 9:39 AM


Re: sigh
I don't think the race is close down your way, ...
It isn't. RI is a D+11 state on the Cook Preferred Voting Index, which means that whoever is the democrat will be the one to win our electoral votes.
That liberates me to vote my conscience.
Trump seems to me a dangerous combination of Groucho Marx and Adolph Hitler. ...
He doesn't have the brains to be either. He is a vengeful idiot that grew up rich, squandered more than he earned, and is the epitome of white male privilege with no conscience.
Enjoy

we are limited in our ability to understand
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RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
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RAZD
Member (Idle past 1516 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 65 of 892 (792905)
10-14-2016 11:26 PM
Reply to: Message 53 by Theodoric
10-13-2016 10:12 AM


Re: The Clinton Machine
On WikiLeaks, Journalism, and Privacy: Reporting on the Podesta Archive is an Easy Call
WikiLeaks: New York Times Propped Up Clinton, Subverted Sanders
Media To Voters: Drop Dead, We're Getting Hillary Elected
Just some articles I came across today.
Don't you dare act as if you know what I think or feel. ...
I didn't, but if the shoe fits.
... Just because people don't agree with your conspiracy theories does not mean they do not understand the gravity of the issues in this country and presidential race.
Like I said, I am not interested in convincing anyone, especially anyone not interested in finding out. Are all Bernie supporters now conspiracy theorists, or is this just you way to dismiss it.
As always, your "holier than thou" attitude is off putting and offensive.
LOL. Attack the messenger fallacy.
Enjoy.

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This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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RAZD
Member (Idle past 1516 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 66 of 892 (792906)
10-14-2016 11:31 PM
Reply to: Message 59 by New Cat's Eye
10-13-2016 11:25 PM


Re: sigh
I'm going to vote for Jill Stein for president in order to see if we can get the Green Party vote count over 5%.
Why? Why 5?
Then donations are tax deductible.
The problem democrats have is that they don't know how to get people to go to the polls -
Well, they haven't been gettin' me to the polls.
And that's why they lose off-year elections, as in 2014 when they lost the senate.
Enjoy

we are limited in our ability to understand
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RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
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RAZD
Member (Idle past 1516 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 74 of 892 (792941)
10-16-2016 8:59 AM
Reply to: Message 72 by nwr
10-16-2016 12:03 AM


really?
If the DNC had bent over backward to help Bernie, he still would have lost the primaries. He did not lose because of sabotage. He lost because he did not have enough voters supporting him.
Voters purged from registration overwhelmingly Bernie supporters while areas of Clinton supporters not purged. Voters with registrations mysteriously changed so that they couldn't vote, predominantly young.
Evidence of machine tampering to record false results, always to Clinton benefit (a trick learned from the GOP).
Long lines in Bernie districts because of sudden cut-back on polling stations ... but not in Clinton districts.
Then add in the systemic rigging of closed primaries where independents could not vote, as in New York where you had to register democrat before the first debate to be able to vote in the primary. Half of Bernie's supporters were independents.
And add in the systemic rigging through the media (all owned by corporations that supported Hillary massively) so that even MSNBC rarely mentioned Bernie and the media blackout on his rallies,
Finally there is the systemic rigging of the superdelegates such that Bernie would have needed something over 60% of the popular vote to win.
Given all the deck stacking against him I find it incredible that he was only 10% behind of the "official" DNC "certified" popular vote at the end.
Bernie said the system was rigged at the beginning, but I think people were shocked by the degree of rigging and the degree of complacency about it -- dismissing it as "politics as usual" -- especially when election fraud was exposed and admitted (Nevada).
How to solve the "problem" is simple. They have to show up and vote.
It isn't good enough to vote in presidential elections, but then skip voting for the midterm elections. That's what they are doing wrong.
Agreed, and this is where the incompetence of Debbie Wasserman-Schultz first became apparent in 2014, when the democrats were handed a social issue on a silver platter and they ignored it: the protests, strikes and marches for $15/hr wages. That is also when they lost the senate. She should have been fired then, but hey, she was installed to support Hillary (2008 campaign chair, Tim Kane asked to step down to make room for her ... wonder what he got in that deal).
Also, they have to work at the grass roots to build coalitions. It isn't sufficient for them to have a tantrum when your favorite candidate loses a primary. They have to be out there drumming up support for their ideas long before they even have a favorite candidate. Sitting home watching TV, or sending out tweets, or doing "likes" on facebook won't do it.
And this is where the Bermie revolution continues today, thousands of people have stepped up to run for offices "from dog-catcher to senator" to get progressive issues back into the party. Here in RI we elected 13 "Berniecrats" in the primary, and they will be elected in November because RI is a D+11 state on the Cook Partisan Voting Index.
But our voting system has some severe systemic problems that perpetuate the two party system and the easy corruption of candidates to get funding to get elected. Bernie has shown us a path to deal with some of it, but it is going to take a much larger effort to change the system to enable third parties a viable role in American politics.
Enjoy

we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)

This message is a reply to:
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