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EvC Forum Side Orders Coffee House The Trump Presidency

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Author Topic:   The Trump Presidency
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 7 of 4573 (796825)
01-05-2017 2:01 AM
Reply to: Message 5 by Faith
01-04-2017 10:04 PM


Is this really representative of how conservatives think?
Faith writes:
I wonder if Trump will even get to the Presidency, thanks to the endless efforts by the Democrats to sabotage him. Now Obama is trying to start a war with Russia, which I suppose he hopes will become Trump's problem Either that or create a national emergency that will give a reason for him to remain in office. He's just moved troops near the Russian border.
Yikes!
Fortunately for us all, reality has a liberal bias.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. Thomas Jefferson
Seems to me if its clear that certain things that require ancient dates couldn't possibly be true, we are on our way to throwing out all those ancient dates on the basis of the actual evidence. -- Faith
Some of us are worried about just how much damage he will do in his last couple of weeks as president, to make it easier for the NY Times and Washington post to try to destroy Trump's presidency. -- marc9000

This message is a reply to:
 Message 5 by Faith, posted 01-04-2017 10:04 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 8 by Faith, posted 01-05-2017 5:35 AM NoNukes has not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 43 of 4573 (796953)
01-08-2017 2:05 PM
Reply to: Message 39 by Faith
01-07-2017 7:52 PM


Jesus did not talk to nations, only individuals.
Is this consistent with your stance on capital punishment?
He did have common sense, which it is painfully obvious Leftists do not.
Oooh. Good one.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. Thomas Jefferson
Seems to me if its clear that certain things that require ancient dates couldn't possibly be true, we are on our way to throwing out all those ancient dates on the basis of the actual evidence. -- Faith
Some of us are worried about just how much damage he will do in his last couple of weeks as president, to make it easier for the NY Times and Washington post to try to destroy Trump's presidency. -- marc9000

This message is a reply to:
 Message 39 by Faith, posted 01-07-2017 7:52 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 44 by Faith, posted 01-08-2017 2:55 PM NoNukes has replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 55 of 4573 (796973)
01-08-2017 6:40 PM
Reply to: Message 44 by Faith
01-08-2017 2:55 PM


Deleted in the interest of not being further provocative. This thread is already descending into more heat (or hate) than light.
Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. Thomas Jefferson
Seems to me if its clear that certain things that require ancient dates couldn't possibly be true, we are on our way to throwing out all those ancient dates on the basis of the actual evidence. -- Faith
Some of us are worried about just how much damage he will do in his last couple of weeks as president, to make it easier for the NY Times and Washington post to try to destroy Trump's presidency. -- marc9000

This message is a reply to:
 Message 44 by Faith, posted 01-08-2017 2:55 PM Faith has not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 69 of 4573 (797014)
01-09-2017 7:45 PM
Reply to: Message 68 by Faith
01-09-2017 6:00 PM


Re: Did Trump mock a disabled reporter?
SO typical. I prove that he wasn't mocking a disabled man for his disability, which is what this whole flap is about
FWIW, I find your argument that he was not mocking the man for his disability compelling. However, you are still giving Trump a free pass. Let's not forget that Trump's mocking of Cruz, for example included indelicate comments about Mrs. Cruz as well as accusations that Cruz poppa was involved in the Kennedy assassination.
So, no Trump's mocking is very way beyond the norm and I'd be happy to provide you any number of examples.
Nonetheless, I think that's a total of three times I thought you were right during the past week including one time when being right meant admitting to an error. Nice. Again, I'd be happy to list them if you want.
Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.
Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. Thomas Jefferson
Seems to me if its clear that certain things that require ancient dates couldn't possibly be true, we are on our way to throwing out all those ancient dates on the basis of the actual evidence. -- Faith
Some of us are worried about just how much damage he will do in his last couple of weeks as president, to make it easier for the NY Times and Washington post to try to destroy Trump's presidency. -- marc9000

This message is a reply to:
 Message 68 by Faith, posted 01-09-2017 6:00 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 70 by Faith, posted 01-09-2017 7:59 PM NoNukes has replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 71 of 4573 (797016)
01-09-2017 8:09 PM
Reply to: Message 70 by Faith
01-09-2017 7:59 PM


Re: Did Trump mock a disabled reporter?
I thought he apologized for what he said about Cruz's wife.
Maybe Trump has done so since, but in September, Cruz decided to forgive Trump without the apology. I was not able to find any indication that Trump has apologized, but you are free to think whatever you want. What we do know is that Cruz did endorse Trump without receiving an apology.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. Thomas Jefferson
Seems to me if its clear that certain things that require ancient dates couldn't possibly be true, we are on our way to throwing out all those ancient dates on the basis of the actual evidence. -- Faith
Some of us are worried about just how much damage he will do in his last couple of weeks as president, to make it easier for the NY Times and Washington post to try to destroy Trump's presidency. -- marc9000

This message is a reply to:
 Message 70 by Faith, posted 01-09-2017 7:59 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 72 by Faith, posted 01-09-2017 8:21 PM NoNukes has replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 74 of 4573 (797026)
01-10-2017 12:28 AM
Reply to: Message 72 by Faith
01-09-2017 8:21 PM


Re: Did Trump mock a disabled reporter?
But please let's not go farther down this rabbit trail.
The article you linked to is about Trump's non-apology. After making the allegations about Cruz's wife, Trump later tells the press that he should not have sent the photo. That is not an apology, and of course that admission does not change the facts regarding the statements about Cruz's father.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. Thomas Jefferson
Seems to me if its clear that certain things that require ancient dates couldn't possibly be true, we are on our way to throwing out all those ancient dates on the basis of the actual evidence. -- Faith
Some of us are worried about just how much damage he will do in his last couple of weeks as president, to make it easier for the NY Times and Washington post to try to destroy Trump's presidency. -- marc9000

This message is a reply to:
 Message 72 by Faith, posted 01-09-2017 8:21 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 75 by Faith, posted 01-10-2017 2:55 AM NoNukes has replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 82 of 4573 (797046)
01-10-2017 1:59 PM
Reply to: Message 75 by Faith
01-10-2017 2:55 AM


Re: Did Trump mock a disabled reporter?
I addressed only his remarks about Cruz's wife, not his father, and his saying he shouldn't have sent the photo, whatever that article says about it, others call it an apology. Your having a stricter standard is irrelevant.
It was clearly not an apology; That you have a loose standard when Trump or your other favorites are concerned is what is truly irrelevant. Cruz does not consider it an apology and has said so.
Perhaps you should have cited a better reference if you want to claim that anyone reasonably considers Trump's statement an apology.
Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. Thomas Jefferson
Seems to me if its clear that certain things that require ancient dates couldn't possibly be true, we are on our way to throwing out all those ancient dates on the basis of the actual evidence. -- Faith
Some of us are worried about just how much damage he will do in his last couple of weeks as president, to make it easier for the NY Times and Washington post to try to destroy Trump's presidency. -- marc9000

This message is a reply to:
 Message 75 by Faith, posted 01-10-2017 2:55 AM Faith has not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


(1)
Message 110 of 4573 (797184)
01-13-2017 5:41 PM
Reply to: Message 109 by Percy
01-13-2017 9:54 AM


Re: Russian Mob Bailout for Trump Bankruptcies
Those sources are fine, but the sources you cited and quoted from in your Message 106 were Daily Kos and Snopes.
To be fair, RAZD's message included Snopes heavily quoting and analyzing an ABC news article. Are you really questioning the reliability of Snopes to do such a thing? Should RAZD have gone to the trouble of finding the actual ABC News article?
Not trying to be combative. Just getting your take.
Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. Thomas Jefferson
Seems to me if its clear that certain things that require ancient dates couldn't possibly be true, we are on our way to throwing out all those ancient dates on the basis of the actual evidence. -- Faith
Some of us are worried about just how much damage he will do in his last couple of weeks as president, to make it easier for the NY Times and Washington post to try to destroy Trump's presidency. -- marc9000

This message is a reply to:
 Message 109 by Percy, posted 01-13-2017 9:54 AM Percy has seen this message but not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 111 of 4573 (797185)
01-13-2017 5:47 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by Percy
01-04-2017 8:20 AM


Is discussion about Trump's immediate advisors and cabinet nominees on topic or off for this thread?

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. Thomas Jefferson
Seems to me if its clear that certain things that require ancient dates couldn't possibly be true, we are on our way to throwing out all those ancient dates on the basis of the actual evidence. -- Faith
Some of us are worried about just how much damage he will do in his last couple of weeks as president, to make it easier for the NY Times and Washington post to try to destroy Trump's presidency. -- marc9000

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Percy, posted 01-04-2017 8:20 AM Percy has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 112 by Percy, posted 01-13-2017 6:03 PM NoNukes has seen this message but not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 121 of 4573 (797342)
01-17-2017 6:48 PM
Reply to: Message 115 by Percy
01-16-2017 6:15 AM


Re: Trump Promises Health Care for All
I thought the main Republican objection to Obamacare was that it forced people to either purchase insurance or pay a penalty through their income tax, and that the secondary objection was to the government provided subsidies to those who couldn't afford to pay full price.
Republican politicians certainly voiced those objections, but they also objected to the "floor" for coverage mandated by the ACA. Almost certainly anything the Ryan led House will pass is going to allow employers to provide piss-poor coverage, maybe without any minimum level at all.
Both Trump and the Congress have plenty of exposure here. I expect "Teflon Don" to escape scrutiny by the people in exactly the way he has skated by on make financial disclosures and avoiding conflicts of interest.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. Thomas Jefferson
Seems to me if its clear that certain things that require ancient dates couldn't possibly be true, we are on our way to throwing out all those ancient dates on the basis of the actual evidence. -- Faith
Some of us are worried about just how much damage he will do in his last couple of weeks as president, to make it easier for the NY Times and Washington post to try to destroy Trump's presidency. -- marc9000

This message is a reply to:
 Message 115 by Percy, posted 01-16-2017 6:15 AM Percy has seen this message but not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 123 of 4573 (797348)
01-17-2017 9:35 PM


Obama commutes sentence of Chelsea Manning.
I admit that I had thought about this until somebody suggested to me yesterday that Obama might do that. After hearing the suggestion, I thought there was a good chance Obama would do this, but the announcement was still a surprise!
Chelsea Manning sentence commuted | CNN Politics
Cannot wait to see Trump's tweet in response to this.
ABE:
And then there is this:
quote:
Earlier this month, WikiLeaks said it would agree to a US extradition request for the site's founder, Julian Assange, if Obama granted clemency to Manning. It was not immediately clear if WikiLeaks would make good on its promise, though the group declared "victory" in a tweet Tuesday afternoon.
Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. Thomas Jefferson
Seems to me if its clear that certain things that require ancient dates couldn't possibly be true, we are on our way to throwing out all those ancient dates on the basis of the actual evidence. -- Faith
Some of us are worried about just how much damage he will do in his last couple of weeks as president, to make it easier for the NY Times and Washington post to try to destroy Trump's presidency. -- marc9000

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 133 of 4573 (797435)
01-20-2017 11:49 AM
Reply to: Message 130 by Percy
01-20-2017 10:12 AM


Re: The First Day of the Next Four Years
Diminish the strength of NATO, thereby increasing Russian influence.
Start a trade war with any number of countries, including China.
Fill court vacancies with conservative judges, i.e., the Supreme Court and many other federal courts with vacancies.
I don't expect that Ginsburg will stay until the end of Trump's term, and perhaps Kennedy and Breyer will also retire. I cannot see any of the three lasting beyond a second term for Trump. I think it very likely that Trump could replace up to four Supreme Court Justices. And of course, there are the other federal courts.
If you want to know where the evangelical support came from, it may well be based on the potential to turn the Supreme Court irrevocably right.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. Thomas Jefferson
Seems to me if its clear that certain things that require ancient dates couldn't possibly be true, we are on our way to throwing out all those ancient dates on the basis of the actual evidence. -- Faith
Some of us are worried about just how much damage he will do in his last couple of weeks as president, to make it easier for the NY Times and Washington post to try to destroy Trump's presidency. -- marc9000

This message is a reply to:
 Message 130 by Percy, posted 01-20-2017 10:12 AM Percy has seen this message but not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 139 of 4573 (797449)
01-20-2017 7:31 PM
Reply to: Message 138 by Percy
01-20-2017 5:08 PM


Re: Reaction: The Trump Inauguration
This is ironic, the man who manages to talk and talk while saying nothing specific calling for an end to empty talk.
Exactly. Trump did not say much of anything specific.
The inauguration speech was essential a Valentine's Day card for his base. I'm not surprised that it was full of stuff that I am not onboard with. Over the next few months, we are going to see Trump in action as president. If I am going to complain from this point on, it is going to be about what he does and tries to do as president.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. Thomas Jefferson
Seems to me if its clear that certain things that require ancient dates couldn't possibly be true, we are on our way to throwing out all those ancient dates on the basis of the actual evidence. -- Faith
Some of us are worried about just how much damage he will do in his last couple of weeks as president, to make it easier for the NY Times and Washington post to try to destroy Trump's presidency. -- marc9000

This message is a reply to:
 Message 138 by Percy, posted 01-20-2017 5:08 PM Percy has seen this message but not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


(1)
Message 145 of 4573 (797467)
01-21-2017 6:00 PM
Reply to: Message 138 by Percy
01-20-2017 5:08 PM


Re: Reaction: The Trump Inauguration
He's right in one sense. I believe everyone in the Senate is a multi-millionaire, and those in the House probably aren't doing badly either. How is that Obama is a multi-millionaire, $12.2 million according to Google. Politics should not be a route to riches. Those who hear its siren call should fare no better than teachers and policemen.
Obama entered the white house with a net worth of something like 2 million dollars. Let's recall that both he and Michelle worked at large law firms before entering public service. The president drew a salary of 400K for 8 years, and now his net worth is estimated at something between 7 and 12 million dollars[1] depending on who does the estimating.
Now at the upper end of the estimating, there are some questions one might ask, but at the lower end, prudent investing, plus 8 years of salary, plus book royalties from a book written before he became president, plus winning the Noble Peace Prize (something like a million dollar award) easily explains Obama's increase in fortune.
[1]http://time.com/...9729/barack-obama-net-worth-55th-birthday
quote:
An analysis of Obama’s financial disclosure in 2015 showed a net worth between $2 million and $7 million, reported USA Today. Celebrity finance resource Celebrity Net Worth, however, reported that Obama’s net worth is as high as $12.2 million.
The same article lists the sources for Obama's income. I see nothing untoward in those sources. YMMV.
Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. Thomas Jefferson
Seems to me if its clear that certain things that require ancient dates couldn't possibly be true, we are on our way to throwing out all those ancient dates on the basis of the actual evidence. -- Faith
Some of us are worried about just how much damage he will do in his last couple of weeks as president, to make it easier for the NY Times and Washington post to try to destroy Trump's presidency. -- marc9000

This message is a reply to:
 Message 138 by Percy, posted 01-20-2017 5:08 PM Percy has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 146 by Percy, posted 01-22-2017 9:44 AM NoNukes has replied
 Message 162 by caffeine, posted 01-23-2017 3:20 PM NoNukes has not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


(2)
Message 151 of 4573 (797498)
01-22-2017 2:20 PM


Trump whining about inauguration head count...
One of the most disappointing things about Trump is his thin skin. Trump claims, again without any evidence, and in fact against all of the evidence, to have had the largest attendance for an inauguration ever. Reports that his attendance was about average or maybe less really irk Trump and when that happens, the press gets attacked.
Trump's press secretary [Sean Spicer] went off on a screed yesterday complaining about the portrayal of the attendance. Spicer refused to answer any of the presses questions about his rant. Today on "Meet the Press", Kellyanne Conway told folks that it was not the presses job to call statements by the press secretary and the president ridiculous. She then called their version of things "alternative facts".
Quite obviously, this idiocy is being directed by Trump himself.
Conway: Trump White House offered 'alternative facts' on crowd size | CNN Politics
quote:
Trump himself directed Spicer to go to the White House briefing room to talk about the inauguration crowd size, Conway told CNN's Athena Jones on Sunday.
quote:
Your job is not to call things ridiculous that are said by our press secretary and our president. That's not your job," Conway said.
"I'll answer it this way: Think about what you just said to your viewers. That's why we feel compelled to go out and clear the air and put alternative facts out there."
The term "Alternative facts" apparently means a Trump narrative having no basis in reality and unsupported by anything except Trump's ego.
So far the news folks have done a poor job of holding Trump accountable for lying since the election. I have no hope that being caught in lies will affect the base's support for Trump. However, Trump has historically low approval ratings for an incoming president, suggesting that his antics are having at least some effect on those folks who are at least amenable to hearing the truth.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. Thomas Jefferson
Seems to me if its clear that certain things that require ancient dates couldn't possibly be true, we are on our way to throwing out all those ancient dates on the basis of the actual evidence. -- Faith
Some of us are worried about just how much damage he will do in his last couple of weeks as president, to make it easier for the NY Times and Washington post to try to destroy Trump's presidency. -- marc9000

Replies to this message:
 Message 155 by nwr, posted 01-22-2017 10:00 PM NoNukes has seen this message but not replied

  
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