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Author | Topic: Nothing in biology makes sense except in the light of evolution. | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
ringo Member (Idle past 433 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Dredge writes:
In the same way, the potential for War and Peace exists in the Bible - all of the letters are there. All you need to do is rearrange them. So there's only "micro" difference between them?
The potential for these "new" colours always existed.
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ringo Member (Idle past 433 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Dredge writes:
Again, your task as a creationist is to show that those vestigial frets CAN NOT be used. You need to show that no frets are possible beyond 12.
Why all these extra frets if they're rarely used? The answer is, the "junk" frets (13-20/24) are vestigial; remants of a bygone era - perhaps billions of years ago - when all frets were used equally (not by humans , of course, but by some kind of musical monkey-man).
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ringo Member (Idle past 433 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Pressie writes:
Creationists need re-training in a lot of areas. Lack of training is what makes them creationists. ringo, creationists are trained to think that the term vestigial is a synonym for the word 'useless'. Vestigial refers to the loss of a former use. It doesn't necessarily mean there is no current use. For example, wagon wheels have a use are lawn ornaments but they've lost their former use as wagon wheels. Edited by ringo, : Fixed attribution.
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ringo Member (Idle past 433 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined:
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Dredge writes:
That's kinda like saying a brick gets promoted to a house. What really happens is that a hypothesis is tested; if it fails the test it's discarded, like a damaged brick. But if it passes the test it becomes a brick in the wall, a plank in the theory. The testing tends to spawn new hypotheses which are tested and discarded or added to the wall. Eventually, you get a house (theory). It's my understanding that if there is enough evidence to support a hypothesis, it gets promoted to a theory. So common descent is just another brick in the wall. Even without it, there would still be a wall.
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ringo Member (Idle past 433 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
NosyNed writes:
A theory, specifically one like evolution, is not based on one hypothesis.
I agree with Dredge on this. At least as I've always used it a hypothesis may not be "smaller" than a theory, just less well founded.
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ringo Member (Idle past 433 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
CRR writes:
Matter isn't dead. Some matter isn't alive and never was - e.g. an iron bar. Some matter is alive - e.g. a squirrel. Some matter used to be alive - e.g. a corpse. The corpse is dead but the matter isn't. Dead matter can't produce life.Humans can't produce life from dead matter. There's no fundamental difference between the matter in a living thing and the matter in a non-living thing. Life is just a different set of chemical reactions. And it isn't even all that easy to tell whether something is alive or not. It's a fuzzy line. So it's rather silly to proclaim that matter can't make a certain change.
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ringo Member (Idle past 433 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined:
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Dredge writes:
The fact that you hand-wave it says a lot about your grip on chemistry. Firstly, the fact that you consider it possible that science could one day produce life from dead matter says a lot about your grip on reality. Again. Non-living matter is not dead. The only difference between living and non-living is chemistry.
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ringo Member (Idle past 433 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
Sure it is. The young-earthers will tell you that science keeps changing the age of the earth. It's getting closer and closer to the "right" answer but it has to get a lot of "wrong" answers along the way. The best that science can ever do is the current best estimate of "right".
Science, done properly, is never wrong as far as we can tell.
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ringo Member (Idle past 433 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined:
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Dredge writes:
So you reject astronomy too? Because what astronomers are seeing today is what happened a long time ago.
No one knows what happened billions of years ago.
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ringo Member (Idle past 433 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined:
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CRR writes:
Both are a demonstration that the chemistry is possible. I.e it is a step towards but not an example of a self replicating molecule. Neither is it spontaneous polermization as the video claimed since it required a carefully constructed template. You guys keep saying it's impossible. Then every time they demonstrate a step you say, "No wait, it's the next step." Then when that step is demonstrated you say, "No wait, it's the next step after that." After being wrong step after step, maybe it's time to reconsider your conclusion.
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ringo Member (Idle past 433 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Dredge writes:
Science knows the answer to both of those.
It's a bit like asking, why did God make the sky blue and grass green?
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ringo Member (Idle past 433 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Dredge writes:
If astronomy can tell us what happened billions of years ago, why can't geology? Why would you reject one and not the other?
I didn't know astronomy can tell us what happened on earth billions of years ago.
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ringo Member (Idle past 433 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Dredge writes:
Science can and does explain why the sky IS blue and the grass IS green. You can put any fairy-tale spin on it that you want but that's not as satisfying as knowing.
God could make the sky and grass any colour he wants to. Science can't explain why he chose blue and green, respectively.
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ringo Member (Idle past 433 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Dredge writes:
Figures of speech are habitually silent.
If silently, how does that work?
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ringo Member (Idle past 433 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Dredge writes:
You can no more explain "why" God did something than science can. "How" is certainly a step above no explanation at all.
Explaining "how" is not explaining "why".
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