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Author Topic:   A Creationist Sues the Grand Canyon for Religious Discrimination
Coyote
Member (Idle past 2222 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


Message 3 of 99 (809308)
05-17-2017 6:46 PM
Reply to: Message 2 by Davidjay
05-17-2017 6:41 PM


Flood disproved
The Grand Canyon was caused by the receeding Floofdwaters of the worldwide flood, but thery dont want that discussed... or known or studied.
That flood nonsense was studied and disproved over 200 years ago.
The evidence since then has only grown more convincing--to those who actually accept evidence rather than following old tribal myths.
Even my own archaeological research disproves the flood at your "exact" date, which I have posted many times and which you continue to pretend doesn't exist.

Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.
Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein
In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool
It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers
If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle
If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1
"Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity.
Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other points of view--William F. Buckley Jr.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2 by Davidjay, posted 05-17-2017 6:41 PM Davidjay has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 4 by Taq, posted 05-17-2017 6:56 PM Coyote has not replied
 Message 5 by Faith, posted 05-17-2017 7:09 PM Coyote has replied
 Message 12 by RAZD, posted 05-17-2017 8:14 PM Coyote has not replied
 Message 62 by ICANT, posted 05-18-2017 5:26 PM Coyote has replied

  
Coyote
Member (Idle past 2222 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


Message 8 of 99 (809318)
05-17-2017 7:25 PM
Reply to: Message 5 by Faith
05-17-2017 7:09 PM


Re: Flood disproved
Here's a little bit for you. This was the beginning of the end for the flood idea:
Other naturalists were critical of Diluvialism: the Church of Scotland pastor John Fleming published opposing arguments in a series of articles from 1823 onwards. He was critical of the assumption that fossils resembling modern tropical species had been swept north "by some violent means", which he regarded as absurd considering the "unbroken state" of fossil remains. For example, fossil mammoths demonstrated adaptation to the same northern climates now prevalent where they were found. He criticized Buckland's identification of red mud in the Kirkdale cave as diluvial, when near identical mud in other caves had been described as fluvial.[5] While Cuvier had reconciled geology with a loose reading of the Biblical text, Fleming argued that such a union was "indiscreet" and turned to a more literal view of Genesis:[29]
But if the supposed impetuous torrent excavated valleys, and transported masses of rocks to a distance from their original repositories, then must the soil have been swept from off the earth to the destruction of the vegetable tribes. Moses does not record such an occurrence. On the contrary, in his history of the dove and the olive-leaf plucked off, he furnishes a proof that the flood was not so violent in its motions as to disturb the soil, nor to overturn the trees which it supported.[29]
When Sedgwick visited Paris at the end of 1826 he found hostility to Diluvialism: Alexander von Humboldt ridiculed it "beyond measure", and Louis-Constant Prvost "lectured against it". In the summer of 1827 Sedgwick and Roderick Murchison travelled to investigate the geology of the Scottish Highlands, where they found "so many indications of local diluvial operations" that Sedgwick began to change his mind about it being worldwide. When George Poulett Scrope published his investigations into the Auvergne in 1827, he did not use the term "diluvium". He was followed by Murchison and Charles Lyell whose account appeared in 1829. All three agreed that the valleys could well have been formed by rivers acting over a long time, and a deluge was not needed. Lyell, formerly a pupil of Buckland, put strong arguments against diluvialism in the first volume of his Principles of Geology published in 1830, though suggesting the possibility of a deluge affecting a region such as the low-lying area around the Caspian Sea. Sedgwick responded to this book in his presidential address to the Geological Society in February 1830, agreeing that diluvial deposits had formed at differing times. At the society a year later, when retiring from the presidency, Sedgwick described his former belief that "vast masses of diluvial gravel" had been scattered worldwide in "one violent and transitory period" as "a most unwarranted conclusion", and therefore thought "it right, as one of my last acts before I quit this Chair, thus publicly to read my recantation." However, he remained convinced that a flood as described in Genesis was not excluded by geology.[5][30][31]
Flood geology - Wikipedia

Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.
Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein
In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool
It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers
If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle
If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1
"Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity.
Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other points of view--William F. Buckley Jr.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 5 by Faith, posted 05-17-2017 7:09 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 10 by Davidjay, posted 05-17-2017 7:32 PM Coyote has not replied
 Message 11 by Faith, posted 05-17-2017 8:06 PM Coyote has not replied

  
Coyote
Member (Idle past 2222 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


Message 21 of 99 (809394)
05-18-2017 10:13 AM
Reply to: Message 20 by Faith
05-18-2017 10:07 AM


Re: Leonardo inadvertently proves the Flood
So the Flood laid down all the sediments along with the shells and other fossils, and after the Flood the mountains were raised: that's the tectonic activity that occurred with the splitting of the continents. See? It all works out just fine.
But the dating doesn't work.
That's way too much mountain building etc. to pack into 4350 years. Or actually more like under 2000 years, as by about 500 BC the Greeks were making a lot of observations and records and the tectonic activity that would be associated with such rapid mountain building (and plate movement) would surely have been noticed.
(The Egyptians were making records much earlier, and they made no reference to a worldwide flood.)

Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.
Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein
In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool
It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers
If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle
If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1
"Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity.
Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other points of view--William F. Buckley Jr.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 20 by Faith, posted 05-18-2017 10:07 AM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 23 by Faith, posted 05-18-2017 10:26 AM Coyote has not replied

  
Coyote
Member (Idle past 2222 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


(3)
Message 43 of 99 (809448)
05-18-2017 12:29 PM
Reply to: Message 42 by Faith
05-18-2017 12:26 PM


Re: Leonardo inadvertently proves the Flood
Well golly gosh I don't even care if all the scientists in the world disagree with me if I'm convinced they're wrong about something.
As per my signature line, "Belief gets in the way of learning."
Perhaps you should stick to the Faith and Belief threads. With your a priori religious bias you are unqualified to do, or even comment on science in any way.

Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.
Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein
In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool
It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers
If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle
If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1
"Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity.
Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other points of view--William F. Buckley Jr.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 42 by Faith, posted 05-18-2017 12:26 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 46 by Faith, posted 05-18-2017 12:35 PM Coyote has not replied

  
Coyote
Member (Idle past 2222 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


Message 77 of 99 (809546)
05-18-2017 9:06 PM
Reply to: Message 62 by ICANT
05-18-2017 5:26 PM


Re: Flood disproved
There would be no way to disprove the Biblical flood if the Bible is true.
The flood has been disproved, so obviously the bible is not true in this regard.
There was one body of land at Genesis 1:10 as all the water was gathered to one place in Genesis 1:9.
This body of land would have still been in existence at the time of the flood in Genes chapter 6, 7.
The earth was then divided into what we see today during the days of Peleg.
The last time all the land masses were together was about 175 million years ago.
All the mountains were formed during this division.
Which would make it impossible for you to find a trace of a world wide flood.
So, you have to also claim there were humans round 175 million years ago, and that the flood occurred that long ago. There is no evidence for either.
But there is no doubt that every inch of dry land we have today was covered with water in the past. Which agrees with Genesis 1:2.
There is no evidence for a global flood during historic times.
Lets see now I have 3 scientific facts that support words that were written over 3400 years ago.
One land mass.
land mass covered with water
divided land mass
All of which never happened during human history.
You're not doing very well, eh?

Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.
Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein
In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool
It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers
If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle
If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1
"Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity.
Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other points of view--William F. Buckley Jr.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 62 by ICANT, posted 05-18-2017 5:26 PM ICANT has not replied

  
Coyote
Member (Idle past 2222 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


Message 79 of 99 (809548)
05-18-2017 9:08 PM
Reply to: Message 66 by Faith
05-18-2017 5:51 PM


Belief vs. facts
As I understand it I'm allowed to start from my biblical premises in this debate.
Just because you believe something doesn't make it factual.
Nor are we required to accept anything just because you happen to believe it.

Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.
Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein
In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool
It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers
If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle
If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1
"Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity.
Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other points of view--William F. Buckley Jr.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 66 by Faith, posted 05-18-2017 5:51 PM Faith has not replied

  
Coyote
Member (Idle past 2222 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


(1)
Message 99 of 99 (809670)
05-20-2017 9:41 AM


Summation
If this clown is really doing science, how is it that he's suing for religious discrimination?

Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.
Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein
In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool
It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers
If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle
If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1
"Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity.
Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other points of view--William F. Buckley Jr.

  
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