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Author Topic:   Micro v. Macro Creationist Challenge
Meddle
Member (Idle past 297 days)
Posts: 179
From: Scotland
Joined: 05-08-2006


Message 213 of 252 (817860)
08-21-2017 9:07 AM
Reply to: Message 208 by CRR
08-16-2017 6:37 PM


Re: Non homologous genes between humans and chimps
Remind me, how do you explain that every human/chimp chromosome has genes that are non-homologous between humans and chimps?

I would be interested to know what you consider the presence of non-homologous genes infers. You seem to be suggesting that these represent ‘statistically significant increase in functional information’ and therefore represent macroevolution. However, of the genes you listed in Message 167, all have homologues in the Orangutan and most are also found in the Gorilla and even the Macaque. This leaves the Chimpanzee as a seeming outlier based on your criteria, so what does this indicate for how you view primate evolution?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 208 by CRR, posted 08-16-2017 6:37 PM CRR has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 215 by CRR, posted 08-27-2017 3:48 AM Meddle has responded

  
Meddle
Member (Idle past 297 days)
Posts: 179
From: Scotland
Joined: 05-08-2006


Message 226 of 252 (818686)
08-31-2017 11:01 PM
Reply to: Message 215 by CRR
08-27-2017 3:48 AM


Re: Non homologous genes between humans and chimps
What does this indicate for how you view primate evolution?

I would agree with Taq, Percy and others that these were examples of gene loss in the ancestors of Chimpanzees since they branched off from a common ancestor with Humans. We can use these pattern of gene loss/gain with other primates to establish phylogenetic relationships and compare this to other features we see in the sequenced genomes to see if they concur.

But this isn't why I posted because Taq and Percy already have this well in hand. What I was looking for was your own interpretation of these patterns. For example, creationists possibly including Durston, tend to separate humans from other primates as separate kinds, possibly going further with ape and monkey kinds. But this example you've raised contradict this depending on however you would define the significance of gene gain/loss.
So how would you describe the relationships of primate species, if any, based on the distribution of shared genes?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 215 by CRR, posted 08-27-2017 3:48 AM CRR has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 228 by Percy, posted 09-05-2017 1:56 PM Meddle has responded

  
Meddle
Member (Idle past 297 days)
Posts: 179
From: Scotland
Joined: 05-08-2006


Message 240 of 252 (819314)
09-09-2017 10:22 AM
Reply to: Message 228 by Percy
09-05-2017 1:56 PM


Re: Non homologous genes between humans and chimps
I was still thinking back to the genes CRR cited in Message 167 which were examples of loss in Chimpanzees. But the discussion has moved on since then to include gene gain, so sorry for the confusion.

Also your graph in Message 223 comes from here but it is a supplementary image not in the main body of the article.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 228 by Percy, posted 09-05-2017 1:56 PM Percy has acknowledged this reply

  
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