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Author Topic:   Micro v. Macro Creationist Challenge
herebedragons
Member
Posts: 1517
From: Michigan
Joined: 11-22-2009


(2)
Message 244 of 252 (819428)
09-10-2017 11:12 PM
Reply to: Message 243 by CRR
09-10-2017 9:16 PM


Re: Genetic Differences
(b) Number of gains (red) and losses (blue) per million years ...

Here is a good link to the figure Suppl. Fig 7

If we figure an average generation time of 25 years, that would give us 40,000 generations in a million years. So to calculate the number of generations to gain or lose a gene we can divided number of generations by number of mutations per million years.

organism# genes gained# genes lostmutation rate / gen# gen. / loss or gain
Human250-.0063160
"-50.0013800
Chimp50-.0013800
" -150.0038260
Orangutan30-.00081300
" -200.005200

So... worst case, humans gained, on average, 1 gene every 160 generations, that is every 4,000 years. Orangutans lost a gene every 5,000 years.

What's the incredibly high mutation rate you see here?

HBD

ABE: Here is the original paper that figure is from in case anyone is interested. Common Marmoset genome. It is quite an intense paper, with around 100 authors, a dozen supplemental figures and about 40 supplemental tables.

Edited by herebedragons, : added link to original paper

Edited by herebedragons, : the colors indicating loss or gain in Suppl Fig 7 were swapped around, the chart above has been corrected to reflect this.

Edited by herebedragons, : No reason given.


Whoever calls me ignorant shares my own opinion. Sorrowfully and tacitly I recognize my ignorance, when I consider how much I lack of what my mind in its craving for knowledge is sighing for... I console myself with the consideration that this belongs to our common nature. - Francesco Petrarca

"Nothing is easier than to persuade people who want to be persuaded and already believe." - another Petrarca gem.

Ignorance is a most formidable opponent rivaled only by arrogance; but when the two join forces, one is all but invincible.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 243 by CRR, posted 09-10-2017 9:16 PM CRR has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 245 by CRR, posted 09-11-2017 7:44 AM herebedragons has responded

  
herebedragons
Member
Posts: 1517
From: Michigan
Joined: 11-22-2009


Message 246 of 252 (819441)
09-11-2017 7:56 AM
Reply to: Message 245 by CRR
09-11-2017 7:44 AM


Re: Genetic Differences
Ah yes, they did swap the colors around, I do now remember you mentioning that. I thought it kind of odd (unexpected) that humans lost genes compared to other groups, but that they have the highest number of gains makes more sense. I will revise my chart to reflect this correction.

HBD


Whoever calls me ignorant shares my own opinion. Sorrowfully and tacitly I recognize my ignorance, when I consider how much I lack of what my mind in its craving for knowledge is sighing for... I console myself with the consideration that this belongs to our common nature. - Francesco Petrarca

"Nothing is easier than to persuade people who want to be persuaded and already believe." - another Petrarca gem.

Ignorance is a most formidable opponent rivaled only by arrogance; but when the two join forces, one is all but invincible.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 245 by CRR, posted 09-11-2017 7:44 AM CRR has not yet responded

  
herebedragons
Member
Posts: 1517
From: Michigan
Joined: 11-22-2009


Message 248 of 252 (819473)
09-11-2017 1:47 PM
Reply to: Message 247 by Taq
09-11-2017 10:52 AM


Re: Genetic Differences
The grand question is what does all of this have to do with the topic in the opening post?

It's called "muddying the waters"

HBD


Whoever calls me ignorant shares my own opinion. Sorrowfully and tacitly I recognize my ignorance, when I consider how much I lack of what my mind in its craving for knowledge is sighing for... I console myself with the consideration that this belongs to our common nature. - Francesco Petrarca

"Nothing is easier than to persuade people who want to be persuaded and already believe." - another Petrarca gem.

Ignorance is a most formidable opponent rivaled only by arrogance; but when the two join forces, one is all but invincible.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 247 by Taq, posted 09-11-2017 10:52 AM Taq has not yet responded

  
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