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Author Topic:   Evidence of the flood
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1434 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 676 of 899 (819999)
09-15-2017 3:34 PM
Reply to: Message 671 by Percy
09-15-2017 9:17 AM


STRATA
I NO LONGER BOTHER TRYING TO EXPLAIN THINGS I'VE EXPLAINED A MILLION TIMES BEFORE TO DEAF EARS AND CLOSED MINDS. YOU HAVE SAID THE MOST IDIOTIC THINGS ABOUT MY ARGUMENTS OF ANYBODY HERE. I'VE MADE THE CASE OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER HERE AND PEOPLE WHO SUPPOSEDLY READ IT SAY SUCH STUPID THINGS ABOUT IT THERE IS NO POINT IN TRYING ANY MORE. THE CASE HAS BEEN MADE, IT'S ALL THERE IN PAST THREADS FOR ANYBODY WHO HAS ANY REAL INTEREST, BUT IF NOT WHO CARES.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 671 by Percy, posted 09-15-2017 9:17 AM Percy has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 679 by jar, posted 09-15-2017 4:10 PM Faith has not replied
 Message 683 by Percy, posted 09-15-2017 6:07 PM Faith has not replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 384 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 677 of 899 (820002)
09-15-2017 4:08 PM
Reply to: Message 674 by Faith
09-15-2017 3:25 PM


Re: A charming fat fish proves radiometic dating is false cuz the varves aren't annual
What is the model, method, mechanism, process or procedure that will allow your flud to lay down millions of alternating layers of fine and the coarser silt?

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios My Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 674 by Faith, posted 09-15-2017 3:25 PM Faith has not replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 384 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 678 of 899 (820003)
09-15-2017 4:09 PM
Reply to: Message 675 by Faith
09-15-2017 3:29 PM


Re: strat column
What is the model, method, mechanism, process or procedure that will allow your flud to lay down millions of alternating layers of fine and the coarser silt?

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios My Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 675 by Faith, posted 09-15-2017 3:29 PM Faith has not replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 384 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 679 of 899 (820004)
09-15-2017 4:10 PM
Reply to: Message 676 by Faith
09-15-2017 3:34 PM


Re: STRATA
What is the model, method, mechanism, process or procedure that will allow your flud to lay down millions of alternating layers of fine and the coarser silt?

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios My Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 676 by Faith, posted 09-15-2017 3:34 PM Faith has not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 18248
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 680 of 899 (820005)
09-15-2017 5:40 PM
Reply to: Message 559 by Percy
09-14-2017 5:13 PM


Conclusions That Support A Premise Dont Work
In regards to my request for evidence and the definition of evidence, I find that I cannot make heads nor tails of some of these arguments. I am not a far left liberal nor do I even claim to have any scientific knowledge beyond a layman's level.
What I do appreciate is a participant who explains the thought process which leads to their conclusion. Conclusions that are shoehorned into a discussion only to support a premise don't help me understand anything.
DWise1 has hit the nail on the head in the Lucy thread.
DWise1 writes:
The purpose of creationist claims and arguments is to persuade, therefore the most important test of any creationist claim or argument is in how persuasive it sounds. If a claim sounds persuasive, then it will be used regardless of how utterly false it is. But any that does not sound persuasive will go unnoticed regardless of how true it is.
Edited by Phat, : No reason given.

Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. —RC Sproul
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." —Mark Twain "
~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith
"as long as chance rules, God is an anachronism."~Arthur Koestler

This message is a reply to:
 Message 559 by Percy, posted 09-14-2017 5:13 PM Percy has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 684 by Percy, posted 09-15-2017 6:09 PM Phat has seen this message but not replied
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Percy
Member
Posts: 22359
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 4.7


Message 681 of 899 (820006)
09-15-2017 6:01 PM
Reply to: Message 674 by Faith
09-15-2017 3:25 PM


Re: A charming fat fish proves radiometic dating is false cuz the varves aren't annual
My, did we ever wake up on the shrill side of the bed today!
You can pretty much throw out your entire tirade because you evidently lost the plot on what had been said. I warned you of the dangers of one-liner mode. Your posts were averaging, what, maybe six words each? Ironic that the person who got the most confused was you.
You didn't follow what Edge was saying, which was who you were replying to in your Message 658. In his Message 651 he replied to you like this (I quoted all this in my earlier message, too):
edge writes:
Faith writes:
But it is representative of what happened in the Flood as is every other stratigraphic column. The strata were all deposited one after another in rapid succession during the Flood and that represents the entire extent of the Geo Time Scale everywhere.
Once again, that is very strange. Other geological columns show the effects of erosion, volcanism and plate tectonics.
In case the plain English escapes you, let me explain at greater length. Edge is pointing out that stratigraphic columns all around the world include layers that show erosion, volcanism and plate tectonics that were not laid down in "rapid succession" but that could only have occurred in a succession of both depositional and erosional events.
So, would you care to revise your answer?
Responding to a few of the things you say:
THEY DON'T "LATER HAVE THE EFFECTS OF SURFACE EROSION!" YOU'VE OBVIOUSLY NEVER UNDERSTOOD ONE THING I'VE EVER SAID ABOUT THAT CROSS SECTION, WHICH I SUSPECTED LONG AGO.
Of course we understand your Grand Canyon scenario. That's how we were able to rebut it so thoroughly.
LOOK AT THE CROSS SECTION. THERE IS NO "EROSION" UNTIL THE CANYON AND STAIRCASE WERE CUT AND THEN THERE IS MASSIVE "EROSION"
Edge was talking about unconformities. As the Wikipedia article on the Geology of the Grand Canyon area states, "There are at least 14 known unconformities in the geologic record found in the Grand Canyon."
THE MAGMA STARTS AT THE VERY BOTTOM AND PENETRATES TO THE VERY TOP -- OBVIOUSLY BEGUN AFTER ALL THE STRATA WERE IN PLACE. I'VE EXPLAINED THIS HUNDREDS OF TIMES ALREADY WHEN THIS CROSS SECTION HAS COME UP.
This cross section is not a complete inventory of magma intrusions, but in any case the magma intrusion at Brian's head goes very nearly to the top, and the ones at the Grand Canyon Supergroup do not.
I ALSO ARGUE THAT THE GREAT UNCONFORMITY FORMED AFTER ALL THE STRATA WERE IN PLACE AND HAVE ARGUED IT IN GREAT DETAIL.
It's also been thoroughly rebutted in great detail, time and again. Take a pile of plywood sheets. Rotate the bottom four sheets upward about 30 degrees. How'd that work out for you?
Your problem is that you haven't got a lick of common sense about the way things work in the real world, and so you come up with ideas that are patently impossible.
I REJECT THE WHOLE IDEA OF INVISIBLE UNCONFORMITIES...
They aren't invisible, and so what that you reject the whole idea? You reject lots of evidence. It's what makes you you. Your inability to incorporate evidence into your scenarios is why they're so wildly impossible.
...AND THERE IS CERTAINLY NO EROSION BETWEEN LAYERS...
You're making bald declarations with no evidence again. Do you have any reason to think this? That Wikipedia article I referenced above says, "Geologists do know that deep channels were carved on the top of the Muav Limestone during this time." These deep channels were carved while the Muav Limestone was exposed to erosion at the surface. It represents an unconformity between it and the Redwall Limestone above. By the way, note that the boundary between the Muav Limestone and the Redwall Limestone isn't anywhere close to flat.
IT IS SICKENING TO HAVE TO START ALL OVER EXPLAINING WHAT I'VE EXPLAINED SO MANY TIMES ALREADY TO SOMEONE WHO NEVER BOTHERED TO UNDERSTAND ONE WORD OF IT.
But there was no need to reexplain what you've explained before, and I keep asking you to stop doing it. We already understand your position. You've repeated it endlessly and we're tired of hearing it. What we'd like to see is responses to the rebuttals that consist of more than simple denials of evidence. We show you an unconformity and you stare at it and state, "That's not an unconformity," with no evidence or argument whatsoever. You're not God making pronouncements from on high. Your delusions of inerrancy are not shared by anyone else, and are in fact belied by your inability to get through a sentence, let alone an entire paragraph, without making blunders. You have to make your case from evidence and argument and things that are true, just like everyone else.
THIS COULD BE MY PROBLEM OF FAILURE TO SAY IT CLEARLY ENOUGH... THERE IS NO POINT IN EVEN TRYING TO HAVE A DISCUSSION WITH THIS DEGREE OF MISCOMMUNICATION.
Ya think? Maybe if you're done with one-liner mode you could drop the all-caps now?
WHAT A PATHETIC JOKE DEBATE AT EVC IS.
You're the joke at EvC.
By the way, what's the Faith Thread Abandonment Probability Index today?
--Percy
Edited by Percy, : Grammar.
Edited by Percy, : Clarify.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 674 by Faith, posted 09-15-2017 3:25 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 685 by Faith, posted 09-15-2017 6:44 PM Percy has replied

  
Astrophile
Member (Idle past 118 days)
Posts: 92
From: United Kingdom
Joined: 02-10-2014


Message 682 of 899 (820008)
09-15-2017 6:01 PM
Reply to: Message 636 by edge
09-14-2017 7:22 PM


Re: A charming fat fish proves radiometic dating is false cuz the varves aren't annual
In that case, where are the huge sandstone deposits of the Colorado Plateau in Great Britain? Where are the coal seams in the Superior Province?
Sorry, not even remotely.
There are about 2500 metres of Triassic New Red Sandstone in Cheshire, and >2700 metres of probable Permo-Triassic in south-east Devon. There are about 2000-3900 metres of Namurian-age Millstone Grit in the Pennines. Finally, there are 7-13 km of Devonian Old Red Sandstone in the Shetland Islands, and in the Scottish Midland Valley. I don't know whether these rocks are the same age as the sandstone deposits of the Colorado Plateau.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 636 by edge, posted 09-14-2017 7:22 PM edge has replied

Replies to this message:
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Percy
Member
Posts: 22359
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 4.7


Message 683 of 899 (820010)
09-15-2017 6:07 PM
Reply to: Message 676 by Faith
09-15-2017 3:34 PM


Re: STRATA
Faith writes:
I NO LONGER BOTHER TRYING TO EXPLAIN THINGS I'VE EXPLAINED A MILLION TIMES BEFORE TO DEAF EARS AND CLOSED MINDS. YOU HAVE SAID THE MOST IDIOTIC THINGS ABOUT MY ARGUMENTS OF ANYBODY HERE. I'VE MADE THE CASE OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER HERE AND PEOPLE WHO SUPPOSEDLY READ IT SAY SUCH STUPID THINGS ABOUT IT THERE IS NO POINT IN TRYING ANY MORE. THE CASE HAS BEEN MADE, IT'S ALL THERE IN PAST THREADS FOR ANYBODY WHO HAS ANY REAL INTEREST, BUT IF NOT WHO CARES.
Little of what you've said in the present or past makes any sense, so there's not much value to it, plus it's extremely repetitive.
So does this mean you're abandoning the thread again?
--Percy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 676 by Faith, posted 09-15-2017 3:34 PM Faith has not replied

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 22359
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 4.7


(2)
Message 684 of 899 (820011)
09-15-2017 6:09 PM
Reply to: Message 680 by Phat
09-15-2017 5:40 PM


Re: Conclusions That Support A Premise Dont Work
Evidence is information you gather from the real world.
--Percy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 680 by Phat, posted 09-15-2017 5:40 PM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1434 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 685 of 899 (820014)
09-15-2017 6:44 PM
Reply to: Message 681 by Percy
09-15-2017 6:01 PM


strata continuing
Sorry, all edge was doing was repeating the standard explanation with which I disagree. ALL strat columns everywhere were laid down and THEN erosion, volcanism and all the other disturbances occurred.
And the volcanism at the bottom of the GC also occurred after the strata were all in place just as the Great Unconformity did. And I've explained my thinking on this a million times and if you never got it that's just typical for you. You should at least know what my argument is after all this time with a million restatements of it and you don't. That IS your fault, the usual inability to think.
No you don't understand any of it, and you cannot rebut it. All you can do is repeat the idiotic standard interpretation.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 681 by Percy, posted 09-15-2017 6:01 PM Percy has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 686 by jar, posted 09-15-2017 6:55 PM Faith has not replied
 Message 690 by edge, posted 09-15-2017 9:40 PM Faith has not replied
 Message 703 by Percy, posted 09-16-2017 8:45 AM Faith has not replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 384 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 686 of 899 (820016)
09-15-2017 6:55 PM
Reply to: Message 685 by Faith
09-15-2017 6:44 PM


Re: strata continuing
What is the model, method, mechanism, process or procedure that will allow your flud to lay down millions of alternating layers of fine and the coarser silt?
The question remains Faith.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios My Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 685 by Faith, posted 09-15-2017 6:44 PM Faith has not replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1434 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 687 of 899 (820017)
09-15-2017 6:59 PM
Reply to: Message 680 by Phat
09-15-2017 5:40 PM


Re: Conclusions That Support A Premise Dont Work
Most of the creationist-evolutionist debate doesn't involve new evidence. It's all about different interpretations of the same facts held by both sides. Such as: Evos look at a wall of strata and see millions of years; I look at it and see rapid deposition/ the Flood.
There is a sense in which there is new evidence, however, since I would point out different features of, say, a cross section of the Grand Canyon area, than an evolutionist is likely to notice, to show that it supports my interpretation and not theirs.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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 Message 689 by Coyote, posted 09-15-2017 7:44 PM Faith has not replied
 Message 691 by edge, posted 09-15-2017 9:44 PM Faith has not replied
 Message 696 by PaulK, posted 09-16-2017 2:41 AM Faith has not replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 384 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 688 of 899 (820019)
09-15-2017 7:09 PM
Reply to: Message 687 by Faith
09-15-2017 6:59 PM


Re: Conclusions That Support A Premise Dont Work
What is the model, method, mechanism, process or procedure that will allow your flud to lay down millions of alternating layers of fine and the coarser silt?
The question remains Faith.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios My Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 687 by Faith, posted 09-15-2017 6:59 PM Faith has not replied

  
Coyote
Member (Idle past 2096 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


Message 689 of 899 (820021)
09-15-2017 7:44 PM
Reply to: Message 687 by Faith
09-15-2017 6:59 PM


Re: Conclusions That Support A Premise Dont Work
So where do you place the flood deposits in this photograph?

Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.
Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein
In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool
It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers
If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle
If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1
"Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity.
Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other points of view--William F. Buckley Jr.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 687 by Faith, posted 09-15-2017 6:59 PM Faith has not replied

  
edge
Member (Idle past 1696 days)
Posts: 4696
From: Colorado, USA
Joined: 01-09-2002


(2)
Message 690 of 899 (820026)
09-15-2017 9:40 PM
Reply to: Message 685 by Faith
09-15-2017 6:44 PM


Re: strata continuing
Sorry, all edge was doing was repeating the standard explanation with which I disagree. ALL strat columns everywhere were laid down and THEN erosion, volcanism and all the other disturbances occurred.
And the volcanism at the bottom of the GC also occurred after the strata were all in place just as the Great Unconformity did. And I've explained my thinking on this a million times and if you never got it that's just typical for you. You should at least know what my argument is after all this time with a million restatements of it and you don't. That IS your fault, the usual inability to think.
No you don't understand any of it, and you cannot rebut it. All you can do is repeat the idiotic standard interpretation.
To the contrary. I think that we do understand what you are saying.
The problem is that there is nothing to support it.
You are simply wrong.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 685 by Faith, posted 09-15-2017 6:44 PM Faith has not replied

  
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