"Natural" (plant-based) Health Solutions

removedEdited by NoNukes, : removed as pointless.

The ad hominems are against the rules.

Phat, I just remembered a part of Dr. Lim's talk about how going on this kind of diet cured diabetic neuropathy, and then remembered that you'd said you are starting to get that problem. So if you are interested he talks about this particular study at 39:53 in the talk: An Introduction to a Whole-Food, Plant-Based Diet - a presentation by Dr. LimLim is an M.D. So is John McDougall who is his mentor. So is Caldwell Esselstyn, so is Dean Ornish, nutrition experts he referenced in the talk, so these aren't just fly-by-night faddists, no matter what anybody here says.A film worth watching if you want to know more about eating plant-based is "Forks over Knives" at Netflix. There are others but Lim mentions this one in particular.ABE: Since you are doing an Atkins-style low carb fat-burning ketosis kind of approach you may not be interested in changing to this completely different kind of diet. It took me a long time to begin to consider it myself because that's where I had started too. I'm still struggling to make the transition but I'm getting there. But I had to become convinced and that took watching a LOT of films and talks on the subject. There are things about this diet that you should immediately be attracted to since you admit to being a carb addict, and that is of course that it's ALL carbs. Do fruit for your sweet tooth (don't overdo it of course). I'm really enjoying getting to eat potatoes for the first time in years. But there are hard parts too, some things you won't want to give up. I've become convinced it's well worth whatever it takes, but some admit it can take a couple of years or so to make the transition. There's no rush but give it a look. Edited by Faith, : No reason given.Edited by Faith, : No reason given.Edited by Faith, : No reason given.Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

John MacDougall is the creator of a fad diet. Lim tells about switching from one fad diet to another. Those are not encouraging signs.

What's encouraging is the success they are having with this diet in improving and even reversing many diseases. This fact comes across in all the films and talks I've heard over the last year. There is a fair amount of leeway in how you go about this plant-based diet, different emphases in different systems, so nobody has to do McDougall's recipes exclusively unless they want to, but as long as they all stick to the main whole foods plant focus they are all good. Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

That’s a big red flag. It’s not proof that they are quacks - but if they don’t have solid studies backing their claims, then they are.To be fair, I can imagine a whole food diet helping diabetics with managing blood sugar levels, but that’s hardly a surprise.

I'm not following you. What's a "big red flag?"There are lots of studies, what are you talking about? I'm watching "Forks over Knives" again which covers the huge "China Study" among other things -- you can get the book by that name -- which tabulated data on the lifestyles of I don't know how many Chinese, correlating various factors with types of cancers in different parts of the country. Esselstyn's study of 18 heart disease patients that Lim discusses is addressed in more detail in this film too. The data is really pretty overwhelming that meat protein contributes to cancers and plant proteins do not.Watch some of these films I've mentioned if you are really interested in this subject and not just content with debunking everything.

The big red flag is claiming to treat many diseases with just diet.I note that you don’t offer a clear reference to even one study, and a reduced risk of cancer or heart disease is not the same as improving let alone reversing a patients condition.

I'm sorry, you have to watch the films. I admit I'm not good at keeping track of sources, but the information in these films is very convincing. Yes this dietary change is claimed to cure all kinds of diseases, yes. Lim talks about that and presents different kinds of evidence for it. Yes it's sort of miraculous but it seems to be true. "Forks over Knives" gives lots of evidence. It isn't JUST diet but that is the biggest factor. IIRC the film "What the Health" also says that many different diseases can be reversed by this diet change.Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

No, you have to actually research the studies. If you can’t get enough to do that out of the video, then why should anyone else be able to ?

I do what I'm able to do, if it isn't enough for you I can't do anything about that. I would hope to stimulate enough interest in a few people to check it out for themselves. If everyone takes the position that I'm just a stupid gullible person and that stops them from pursuing it further, I can't do anything about that, but I would hope at least a few would have the interest. In my experience, it really takes quite a bit of exposure to a lot of sources of information to overcome initial skepticism, and that's what I hope some may be led to do. As I say, I do what I'm able to do, and even if I produced some research statistics it wouldn't do what I want to do here anyway. You have to get interested and want to follow it up for yourself if you're going to get any benefit out of it. Everybody who gets into this finds they have to really really get into it to benefit from it. Our opinions are so ingrained it takes a lot more than seeing some pieces of research to convince us. Take the time to watch "Forks over Knives" at least.Or don't. It's up to you.Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

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I do what I'm able to do, if it isn't enough for you I can't do anything about that

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If you aren’t able to properly evaluate the claims then you shouldn’t be promoting them. And I find it hard to believe that you are incapable of doing better. It’s not exactly difficult to find out that there are questions about the China Study, for instance.The problem, Faith, is that you are gullible. Not that the rest of us aren’t.

Here's some more info:"Forks over Knives" covers the experiences of T. Colin Campbell and Caldwell Esselstyn as they learned about the effects of meat and dairy on different populations, Campbell in the Philippines and Esselstyn as a surgeon dealing with heart disease. Campbell learned that liver cancer was high in children who had more meat and milk. He did a study of mice that confirmed that a high percentage of the milk protein casein in the diet promoted liver cancer and a smaller percentage did not. Etc etc etc. I think you have to watch the film to get the import of this.

I'm properly evaluating them.

You obviously aren’t properly evaluating them. As proven by the fact that you tell us to look at videos or books instead of referring to studies.