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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1445 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
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Author | Topic: The Tension of Faith | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
PaulK Member Posts: 17822 Joined: Member Rating: 2.2
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So presumably you should be equally glad when Islamists follow their religion - as you understand it - and persecute and kill non-Muslims ?
I find that the essay seems to be an example of intellectual dissonance, a rationalisation of the moral flaws of religion. Evil is seen as a necessary part, and submission to that evil a worthy sacrifice. An idea I find quite chilling.
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PaulK Member Posts: 17822 Joined: Member Rating: 2.2 |
quote: Oh, no that's just a symptom. Even Faith's bigotry - which is hardly restricted to Muslims - and her love of conspiracy theories (likewise) are hardly the worst thing about her.
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PaulK Member Posts: 17822 Joined: Member Rating: 2.2
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quote: The Old Testament has an awful lot of killing in it - that's even part of the essay. If Judaism isn't dangerous it is because most Jews ignore those parts. And Christian history features a whole lot of killing, too.
quote: In other words you ought to go further than accepting the evil and become propagandists for the evil. You say that there is nothing dangerous in Christianity but you accept genocide as good and necessary. Given your views about Islam - and your view that the State is empowered to act in ways unacceptable in individuals I don't think that genocide against Muslims is very far from your thinking - and your 'Christianity" encourages it.
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PaulK Member Posts: 17822 Joined: Member Rating: 2.2 |
quote: You could say much the same from Islam. The fact remains that the Bible glorifies genocide, and you seek to praise that rather than reject it. That attitude tended to encourage future acts. But it is interesting that you would think of Luther and those puritans who hunted witches as "Fake Christians"
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PaulK Member Posts: 17822 Joined: Member Rating: 2.2 |
Almost, you forget that in Genesis Man was created to be a dumb gardener.
But in that story God is depicted as being more like a pagan God than the grand deity of monotheism. If God is assumed to be greater than the story shows, it becomes considerably different.
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PaulK Member Posts: 17822 Joined: Member Rating: 2.2 |
quote: And I reviewed your comment and it was misleading without that point. I further note that you did not address my other point which was relevant to your discussion with Tangle.
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PaulK Member Posts: 17822 Joined: Member Rating: 2.2
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quote: More accurately you don't let your conscience influence your belief. But that, I must say is a worrying thing. To follow conscience when it is difficult is one thing - to go against it is quite another, especially when you hold your religion up as a source of morality. That doesn't show that you don't engage in picking and choosing, and it is quite likely that you do. But I have to say that I find what you call "picking and choosing" - on these grounds - more admirable then celebrating evil and calling it good. And if God is really perfectly good and just, I am pretty sure that is what He would prefer.
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PaulK Member Posts: 17822 Joined: Member Rating: 2.2
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Of course that isn't true. You are not judged despite what you say, but because of what you say. That really should be obvious.
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PaulK Member Posts: 17822 Joined: Member Rating: 2.2 |
But according to you our choices are irrelevant to salvation, so the possibility of salvation shouldn't affect them anyway.
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PaulK Member Posts: 17822 Joined: Member Rating: 2.2
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So by believing the right things you can force God to save you ?
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PaulK Member Posts: 17822 Joined: Member Rating: 2.2 |
Actually I was just echoing a pretty standard response to anything that smacks of "Salvation by Works". Which the idea that you can just choose to believe and be saved seems to come under.
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PaulK Member Posts: 17822 Joined: Member Rating: 2.2 |
It's your sophistry.
Choosing or not choosing Christ certainly affects our salvation. (...that whosoever believes on Him should have eternal life.).
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PaulK Member Posts: 17822 Joined: Member Rating: 2.2 |
quote: The serpent only said that they would become as gods in the sense of knowing good and evil (Genesis 3:5). The story clearly says that they did (e.g. Genesis 3:22) So no, the serpent didn't lie about that. Odd how many people miss that, even though it is quite obviously there.
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PaulK Member Posts: 17822 Joined: Member Rating: 2.2 |
quote: Actually it's God who suggests that in Genesis 3:22.
And the Lord God said, The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil...
(NIV) Phat, you may think it's arrogant of jar to suggest that you hadn't read the Bible, but isn't it arrogant for you to make this mistake again after I've pointed it out and cited the verses ?
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PaulK Member Posts: 17822 Joined: Member Rating: 2.2 |
Part of the problem is that the Bible isn't clear.
See this discussion for a start: Limited Atonement (Wikipedia)
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