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Author | Topic: Gun Control III | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
dwise1 Member Posts: 5925 Joined: Member Rating: 5.2 |
I dunno.
Some several months ago, upwards to over a year ago, in the midst of all kinds of political insanity, some USA state with some kinds of insane open-carry laws played host to some kind of insane right-wing political rally. I remember the standard sick joke of mixing all kinds of toxic factors that must inevitably result in complete and utter disaster, to which you casually remark, "What could possibly go wrong?" And yet, surprisingly, complete and utter insane mayhem did not happen. Personally, I think that they were behaving themselves only because they knew we were watching.
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dwise1 Member Posts: 5925 Joined: Member Rating: 5.2
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Personally. Our teenage son was interested in weaponry. At a local sports shop, an Enfield rifle was available. My then-wife, my son's own mother, gave me a direct order to buy MY OWN SON that weapon. I directly refused that order, since introducing such a weapon into my family could only serve to endanger my family. What happened? Her indifference to my concerns resulted in my son killing himself with that very weapon she had placed in her own hands.
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dwise1 Member Posts: 5925 Joined: Member Rating: 5.2
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Ditto, not a gun afficionado, but I've studied it a bit.
"Slug throwers" (sci-fi term for these kinetic-energy weapons) impart a packet of kinetic energy (K) to their targets:
K = mv2
To calculate and compare the K of different firearms, you need to know two properties: muzzle velocity and mass of the projectile. Here are a few examples (using MKS):
In the MKS system (meter-kilogram-second) K is measured in joules:1 joule = 1 kg·m2·sec-2
Even though the AR 15's slugs are about half the mass of the sidearms' slugs, the kinetic energy they impart is about 3 times greater because of their much higher velocity; ideally, with slugs of the same mass when you triple their velocity you increase their kinetic energy by a factor of nine. Another effect of the much higher velocity is what we saw in the video when the AR round ripped through the ballistic gelatin. I think I've heard that referred to as cavitation, but it's caused by the shock wave which would be much less for a slower projectile. I've also heard over the years that an M16 round will tumble, especially when it enters the body, thus doing much more damage than a sidearm round would. On the radio a few months ago the expert being interviewed described the differences in effect and had a scale for comparing the lethality/damage imparted by different firearms. The AR15 rated considerable higher on that scale than a 9mm sidearm. As to Percy's original question/comment, I've only heard radio reports of that incident and from what I heard I would assume that a sidearm had been used instead of an AR15. It was in an enclosed area, which would have placed him in close proximity with his intended victims. A long gun is a better choice when there's some distance between you and your target; if they are close enough to close distance to you, they would have a chance of disarming you. All they need to do to neutralize you as an immediate threat would be to wrestle the muzzle into a neutral direction. Doing that when you're armed with a sidearm would be much more difficult. So I would think that if the gunman had done any amount of planning, he would have chosen to use a sidearm. Just my own guess. On the subject of "slug throwers", in the armory of Burg Eltz on the Mosel I saw something I had never known even existed. Laid out there with the other medieval weaponry was a row of handheld catapults. They had an arm and bucket and some kind of spring to throw the arm and its payload (eg, a rock you picked up) forward when you release it, like your typical catapult. I never knew any such thing existed. At the same castle they also had about a dozen functional miniature cannons with barrels up to a foot or two long. The guide explained that traveling armament salesmen would take those with him to demonstrate how the real thing would look and work as well as to demonstrate the quality of their craftmanship. And if you put in an order for cannons, you could keep one of the miniatures of the model you ordered. Hence the castle's collection.
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dwise1 Member Posts: 5925 Joined: Member Rating: 5.2 |
It varies from state to state since most gun laws are state laws.
The entire gun issue has also been heavily politicized, especially by the National Rifle Association (NRA -- which is not doing as well now that it has lost its Russian funding). But in my opinion the really fucked up aspect are the open-carry laws. One female friend posted a photo of a guy buying groceries wearing a gun belt with holstered sidearms on either side and other handguns strapped to his legs and ankles. This was how he walks around in his daily business! She was trying to imagine how freakishly small his penis must be to drive him to over-compensate so drastically. One aspect of open-carry is that in some open-carry states you can not long visibly carry handguns, but also long guns (eg, rifles, assault rifles -- see Open carry in the US). I seem to recall that one recent mass shooting in a supermarket where the shooter walked in openly carrying his assault rifle and then opened fire. The thing is that openly and visibly carrying an assault rifle into a store is completely legal in that state (Colorado, I seem to recall), so anyone observing him walking from his car to the store with an assault rifle would not raise any alarms (it is not allowed in New York, Illinois, Tennessee, Florida, Hawaii, Puerto Rico and other territories). In such a situation, you do not know that you are in mortal danger until he opens fire; because of the open carry laws you literally cannot see it coming. Interestingly, California's stricter gun laws date back to the late 1960's under Republican rule (I think Reagan was Governor at the time). All it took was the publication of photographs of heavily armed Black Panthers. As you said, fucked up.
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dwise1 Member Posts: 5925 Joined: Member Rating: 5.2
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Perhaps, but we cant simply have 51% of the people voting in laws that 100% are required to follow. Two big problems with that:
The sad situation we are in now is that through various forms of political skullduggery the representatives of a distinct minority of the population form the majority of many legislative bodies in this country. That means that the majority of Americans are being subjected to laws imposed on them by the minority! And now we are seeing representatives of that minority making new laws to further dilute the vote of the majority thus giving even more power to that minority. Time to do some math:
Basically, what the numbers show is that Democrats outnumber Republicans and that the swing demographic (ie, unaffiliated and other) is surprisingly large. Also, the Trumpian base amounts to about 44% of Republicans or about 15.9 million, about 6.8% of the total electorate (or about 10% of the electorate that had bothered to vote). And yet the Republican politicians holding seats in both houses of Congress as well as in state legislatures are Trumpian!. And in many of those state legislatures those Trumpians control those legislatures, while in Congress they have controlled Congress in the past and they have Congress very narrowly split (and could take the Congress back in 2022) while representing only 10%! Even if we were to give them the benefit of the doubt and allow them to be deemed as representing 46.86% of the electorate, that is still a minority! A minority making laws that adversely affect the majority! So your complaint about the "51%" is not only contrary to how democracy works, but it is also far out of touch with reality.
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dwise1 Member Posts: 5925 Joined: Member Rating: 5.2 |
So if you want to write a law banning weapons of war, what would be the wording? I just returned from visiting my son on the other side of the country. He just finished first year law school and he's an ex-cop. Furthermore, he owns a sidearm. I feel that this would make him a reliable source, however he voted for Trump and refuses to get vaccinated, so ... . During Biden's speech, he got upset and a bit of an argument erupted between him and his girl friend about "assault weapons" which he said that the AR-15 is not (as I gathered, due to its lack of full automatic fire). Apparently most people think that the "AR" stands for "Assault Rifle", which I already knew it doesn't but rather it refers to the original manufacturer, Armalite, so it stands for "ArmaLite Rifle". I haven't verified this, but he started talking about such weapons having been banned by a law in the Clinton Administration, but adding a handle changed the AR-15 to no longer fit the legal definition and so it is no longer covered until that law. Whether I'm remembering and understanding it correctly or not, it does underline the importance of how the law is written. Because in prosecution, the wording of the applicable law(s) and how it is interpreted is crucial. That is why it is so difficult to deal with many forms of misconduct and with issues of privacy and search-and-seizure on-line (or even just in one's electronic devices", because the laws that should be applicable were not written to cover the new technology.
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dwise1 Member Posts: 5925 Joined: Member Rating: 5.2
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Only at reading comprehension?
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dwise1 Member Posts: 5925 Joined: Member Rating: 5.2
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"No one actually does anything" needs to be corrected to:
Republicans block all attempts to do anything.
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