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Author Topic:   Gun Control III
NosyNed
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Posts: 8949
From: Canada
Joined: 04-04-2003
Member Rating: 7.3


(1)
Message 597 of 848 (842782)
11-08-2018 9:58 AM
Reply to: Message 595 by ringo
11-07-2018 11:03 AM


Facts and Statistics
It isn't an opinion. It's a fact, as evidenced by the statistics cited in this thread.

A statistical fact tells you about a number of samples. It does not tell you a "fact" about the specific case.

The statistics tell you that in a population possessing guns those that have them in the house are in the sub-population that will have more gun incidents than the sub population that doesn't.

It doesn't tell you a fact about one individual.

My mother and I used to endlessly argue about smoking. I couldn't say that she would for sure get lung cancer (it killed her in the end but at 89) all I could say was there were two large groups of people out there and one had many fewer deaths from various cancers. I couldn't say for a fact that going over to join one would mean I wouldn't get cancer but I could say it seemed like a reasonably bet to join the that seemed to be doing better.

You can't tell ICANT that he is less safe with a gun in the house as a fact for him based on population statistics.

But what he should ask himself is, having chosen to join a population that is demonstratively less safe, why should he think he isn't subject to whatever causes them to be less safe.

The fact is he has chosen to put himself and his family and friends into a factually less safe group of people without knowing if he is someone different from that population so that the statistics of the population don't apply.

Edited by NosyNed, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 595 by ringo, posted 11-07-2018 11:03 AM ringo has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 598 by ringo, posted 11-08-2018 10:50 AM NosyNed has not yet responded
 Message 599 by Tangle, posted 11-08-2018 10:51 AM NosyNed has not yet responded
 Message 615 by ICANT, posted 11-19-2018 4:25 PM NosyNed has not yet responded

  
NosyNed
Member
Posts: 8949
From: Canada
Joined: 04-04-2003
Member Rating: 7.3


Message 670 of 848 (846242)
01-01-2019 11:24 AM
Reply to: Message 669 by Percy
01-01-2019 9:11 AM


How Do you Get from Here to There?
So your argument isn't that guns aren't responsible but that there's no practical solution.

I'm across the 49th up north where we have pretty strict gun laws and, as you've noted, a lot less killing and, I think, suicide.
But maybe Hyro has a point: How do you get from where the US is with people like Hyro and ICANT in it to where we are in Canada. Your political system is on the edge of breakdown so how do you do what Australia did with the gun numbers Hyro points out, the power of the NRA, and people like Hyro running around?

I'd like to see you fix it all but I honestly don't know how you get there.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 669 by Percy, posted 01-01-2019 9:11 AM Percy has responded

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 Message 671 by Percy, posted 01-02-2019 9:50 AM NosyNed has not yet responded

  
NosyNed
Member
Posts: 8949
From: Canada
Joined: 04-04-2003
Member Rating: 7.3


(1)
Message 715 of 848 (849027)
02-21-2019 11:12 AM
Reply to: Message 714 by ringo
02-21-2019 10:58 AM


Southern Border
You'd have to leave your beloved guns behind.

Our problem is they won't. The US represents a significant long term risk to us. I think there is squat we can do about it and when things get bad any neighbor would be dangerous.

Since we are not going to take the action (see Green New Deal) required over the next decades I'll have to take my own action to avoid the consequences. I'm 73 plan B is to be dead. But I have kids and assholes like the republicans (and our conservatives) are going to risk their lives.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 714 by ringo, posted 02-21-2019 10:58 AM ringo has acknowledged this reply

  
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