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Author | Topic: Christianity and the End Times | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
ringo Member (Idle past 439 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
"No man comes to the father except by the way, the truth and the life." The way, as He explained more than once, is by feeding the hungry, healing the sick, etc. The life is living your life with the community in mind, not just yourself. The truth is the message, not the messenger. Additionally, John 14:5 makes a case that the messenger was, in fact, the message: Jesus was an example of the way, the truth and the life. That doesn't absolve you from following His way, accepting the truth and living your own life according to His teaching.And our geese will blot out the sun.
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Phat Member Posts: 18338 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
You squirmed out of that one! good answer, and a support for your secular belief...though I still dont trust secular government nor human motives for keeping the world safe from destruction. I tend to agree with Percys argument
here regarding the behavioral inclinations of a global populace threatened with poverty. Edited by Phat, : No reason given.Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. —RC Sproul "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." —Mark Twain " ~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo
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ringo Member (Idle past 439 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
I never promised you anything but blood, sweat, toil and tears. The straight and narrow isn't guaranteed to be easy. I still dont trust secular government nor human motives for keeping the world safe from destruction.And our geese will blot out the sun.
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PaulK Member Posts: 17827 Joined: Member Rating: 2.3 |
quote: If the content doesn’t matter why would it matter where that content originated ?
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Phat Member Posts: 18338 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
OK you have a point. The content and motive both matter.
Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. —RC Sproul "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." —Mark Twain " ~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo
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PaulK Member Posts: 17827 Joined: Member Rating: 2.3 |
The truth is still the truth regardless of the motive of the teller.
In Genesis 3 the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evil , did open Adam and Eve’s eyes and did make them like God in that one respect. Just as the serpent said. Genesis 3:5
For God knows that in the day you eat of it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil.
Genesis 3:7
Then the eyes of both of them were opened, and they knew that they were naked; and they sewed fig leaves together and made themselves coverings.
Genesis 3:22
Then the Lord God said, Behold, the man has become like one of Us, to know good and evil...
Read it in context if you doubt me. It’s easy enough. Or are you going to reject the content because you suspect my motive in accurately reporting it ?
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Tangle Member Posts: 9510 From: UK Joined: Member Rating: 4.8 |
Jaywill writes: Tangle, some of us are here examining the Second Coming of Christ and the end of the age No. That's exactly what you're NOT doing. What you're doing is literary criticism of a single book. You might as well be arguing about the hidden meaning in Game of Thrones. Utterly pointless.
In route we see from the Bible something of human origins, human nature, the human purpose for existence, THE human problem, the destiny of humanity, the universe, and the climax of the eternal purpose of the Creator, and an example of a Perfect human life along with His availability to experience and live with. I found the bible derivative and juvenile. As you would expect from an unattributed collection of stone age myths
What in YOUR philosophy do you offer me that is superior to the teaching of Jesus Christ and the Bible ? Take a post to explain something of what I would gain by dropping my faith in Christ and picking up your philosophy of life. You misunderstand the situation. From MY point of VIEW you're just another NUTTER spouting delusional drivel from a virtual pulpit. I know that nothing can affect your PATHOLOGY so I'm just making a tut-tut comment as I pass.Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona "Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android "Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved." - Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.
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jaywill Member (Idle past 1968 days) Posts: 4519 From: VA USA Joined: |
You're overlooking the fact that the MOST insidious effective way of lying is to include in the lie some amount of what is true.
The MIXTURE of some truth with some insidious slanderous untruth is what was done to man.
"A little leaven leavens the whole lump." Sure Adam gained the knowledge of good and evil. What he did not get, because he is now united to Satan - is the power to carry out the good that he knows or the power to resist the evil that he now knows. In reach for autonomy rather than dependence on his Creator he became united with God's enemy. Now he must die. Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.
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jar Member (Idle past 421 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
jaywill writes: You're overlooking the fact that the MOST insidious effective way of lying is to include in the lie some amount of what is true. The MIXTURE of some truth with some insidious slanderous untruth is what was done to man. "A little leaven leavens the whole lump." Sure Adam gained the knowledge of good and evil. What he did not get, because he is now united to Satan - is the power to carry out the good that he knows or the power to resist the evil that he now knows. In reach for autonomy rather than dependence on his Creator he became united with God's enemy. Now he must die. You're just making shit up again jaywill; none of that is in the story written in Genesis 2&3. Also absolutely none of that has anything to do with Christianity and the End Times.
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jaywill Member (Idle past 1968 days) Posts: 4519 From: VA USA Joined:
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Excuse me Mr. Potty Mouth. Strong language doesn't add any to the strength of your argument.
And DIE I count as separation. Separation from God was a degrading process.It culminated in him finally turning back into the dust from which he was taken. And the serpent said to the woman, You shall not surely die. A LIE - SURELY they did. God did not deny that their eyes were opened.
and Jehovah God said, Behold, the man has become like one of Us, knowing good and evil ... (Gen. 3:22) God did not lie in telling them that this would not happen.In fact the very NAME of the tree tells them that gaining this knowledge would be the result of their eating. And Jehovah God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden you may eat freely. But of the tree of the KNOWLEDGE OF GOOD AND EVIL, of it you shall not eat; for in the day that you eat of it you shall surely die. (Gen. 2:16,17) On the day they ate of it did they SURELY DIE or not?Surely they did. So God did not LIE there either. But you, like the snake, are a slanderer. This is such an OLD, OLD argument on this Forum so often repeated that it is kind of depressing to see you dupes still cling desperately to it. The very NAME of the tree tells them what will be the result.Actually the name of the tree should have been The TREE OF DEATH. It could be that in the contest between God and Satan, Satan came up with the name of the tree. - "Oh no. Don't call it the Tree of Death. Call it something attractive like The Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil." Admittedly this is my speculation. However it is hardly speculative that what was going on there was a contest just like the oldest book of the Bible - Job. That is an implied challenge and controversy in which was a TRIANGLE situation. God on one side, the serpent on the other side, and man in the Middle with freedom of will to choose between the two poles - God or Satan. The Tree of Life representing God on one side.The Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil representing Satan on the other. Adam in the middle, neutral and wit a free will to choose between the two destinies presented before him. But some protest - Adam didn't DIE physically that day of 24 hours. That is suppose to prove that the serpent is some heroic figure that told the truth while God misrepresented the truth. By viewing the whole of Scripture though, we have to count DEATH as mainly a matter of SEPARATION. In being alienated from God man began to die. And he SURELY died on and from the day he first was alienated from God.
"DEAD in trespasses and sins" is the indictment upon men since the fall of Adam.
And you, though DEAD in your offenses and sins, in which you walked according to teh age of this world, according to the ruler of the authority of the air, the spirit which is now operating in the sons of disobedience. (Eph. 2:1) In separation from God Adam began the process of degradation from the center to the circumference of his being which would eventually lead to him turning back into dust.
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jar Member (Idle past 421 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
jaywill writes: And DIE I count as separation. Separation from God was a degrading process.It culminated in him finally turning back into the dust from which he was taken. Again, you are simply making shit up and perverting what is actually written in the Genesis 2&3 story. There is nothing in the story about being separated from God or even in the following stories about Adam & Eve. And they did not die the day they ate from the Tree of Knowledge no matter how many times you claim they did.
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jaywill Member (Idle past 1968 days) Posts: 4519 From: VA USA Joined: |
quote: Ignoramus. Why do you think God called out to Adam - "Where are you ?" ? The previous fellowship was lost and degrading more and more. Separation. Man needs to be BORN ANEW because his innermost being is separated from God.
"Let the dead bury their own dead" shows that Christ regarded fallen men as both dead and dying. Sorry if you refuse to realize that the whole Bible is one unified revelation. Edited by jaywill, : No reason given. Edited by jaywill, : No reason given. Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.
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jar Member (Idle past 421 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
jaywill writes: Man needs to be BORN ANEW because his innermost being is separated from God. "Let the dead bury their own dead" shows that Christ regarded fallen men as both dead and dying. Sorry if you refuse to realize that the whole Bible is one unified revelation. And once again you simply try to change the subject, moved the goal posts, palm the pea, con the rubes and misdirect attention in the vain hope folk won't notice your song and dance routine is flawed. The Bible is not one unified revelation and the evidence to support that conclusion is overwhelming. In fact there is no such thing as "The Bible" since there are many Christian Canons, the smallest including only the first five books of the Bible and excluding all of the New Testament and the largest including over eighty books. Reality shows that the Bible really is not one unified revelation at all. And it still has nothing to do with the topic or the content of Genesis 2&3.
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jaywill Member (Idle past 1968 days) Posts: 4519 From: VA USA Joined: |
quote: I undersrtand the situation. You have NOTHING. You have nothing because you're empty and clueless about our origin or destiny. You're tangled up in an inescapable labyrinth of your own blindness.Tangle, you're tangled up in hopelessness of your unbelief. Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.
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jaywill Member (Idle past 1968 days) Posts: 4519 From: VA USA Joined: |
quote: Where would you cast then your vote for the most powerful personality that has ever lived if not Jesus of Nazareth? Who are you more impressed with?
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