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Author Topic:   The Right Side of the News
JonF
Member (Idle past 189 days)
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


(1)
Message 3778 of 5796 (868288)
12-10-2019 9:22 AM
Reply to: Message 3774 by marc9000
12-09-2019 11:12 PM


sRe: More Trump Attack/Insult Tweets
As you, and someone else pointed out, his "parody" came out 2 days after Trump released the actual transcript, which made him look foolish in the eyes of all but the most intense Trump haters.
How so? He read a transcript, he parodied it. What's foolish about thta?
It undoubtedly took Schiff longer than 2 days to dream that up, and he either didn't know about the release, or didn't care, since he knew he would be largely covered for.
Maybe you don't have the intellectual horsepower to produce a parody in two days, but almost everyone else does. I could do it in an hour.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 3774 by marc9000, posted 12-09-2019 11:12 PM marc9000 has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 3781 by Faith, posted 12-10-2019 10:59 AM JonF has replied

  
JonF
Member (Idle past 189 days)
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 3785 of 5796 (868300)
12-10-2019 11:56 AM
Reply to: Message 3781 by Faith
12-10-2019 10:59 AM


Re: sRe: More Trump Attack/Insult Tweets
Schiff presented a parody of the "transcript. It was not a copy of the "transcript:, so he didn't use the same words. But he covered the same material and conveyed a message very similar to the "transcript". Schiff:
quote:
It reads like a classic organized crime shakedown. Shorn of its rambling character and in not so many words, this is the essence of what the president communicates. We’ve been very good to your country, very good. No other country has done as much as we have. But you know what? I don’t see much reciprocity here. I hear what you want. I have a favor I want from you though. And I’m going to say this only seven times so you better listen good. I want you to make up dirt on my political opponent, understand. Lots of it. On this and on that. I’m going to put you in touch with people, not just any people, I am going to put you in touch with the attorney general of the United States, my Attorney General Bill Barr. He’s got the whole weight of the American law enforcement behind him. And I’m going to put you in touch with Rudy. You’re going to love him. Trust me. You know what I’m asking. And so I’m only going to say this a few more times. In a few more ways. And by the way, don’t call me again. I’ll call you when you’ve done what I asked.
This is in sum and character what the president was trying to communicate with the president of Ukraine. It would be funny if it wasn’t such a graphic betrayal of the president’s oath of office. But as it does represent a real betrayal, there’s nothing the president says here that is in America’s interest after all.
Paired with excerpts from the "transcript":
quote:
The President: Well it 1svery nice of you to say that. I will say that we do a lot for Ukraine. We spend a lot of effort and a lot of time. Much more than the European countries are doing and they should be helping you more than they are. Germany does almost nothing for you. All they do is talk and I think it's something that you should really ask them about. When I wasspeaking to Angela Merkel she talks Ukraine, but she doesn't doanything. A lot of the European countries are the same way so I think it's something you want to look at but the United States has been very very good to Ukraine. I wouldn't say that it's reciprocal necessarily because things are happening that are not good but the United States has been very very good to Ukraine.

Schiff: We’ve been very good to your country, very good. No other country has done as much as we have. But you know what? I don’t see much reciprocity here.
quote:
President Zelensky: ...We are ready to continue to cooperate for the next steps. specifically we are almost ready to buy more Javelins from the United States for defense purposes.
The President: I would like you to do us a favor though because our country has been through a lot and Ukraine knows a lot about it. I would like you to find out what happened with this whole situation with Ukraine, they say Crowdstrike {the Russian propaganda - JonF}. I guess you have one of your wealthy people. The server, they say Ukraine has it {there is no physical server - JonF}. There are a lot of things that went on, thewhole situation. I think you're surrounding yourself with some of the same people. I would like to have the Attorney General call you or your people and I would like you t get to the bottom of it.
...
Good because Iheard you had a prosecutor whowas verygood and he was shut down and that's really unfair.A lot of people are talking about that, the way they shut your very good prosecutor down and you had some very bad people involved. Mr. Giuliani is a highly respected man. He was the_ mayor of New York City, a great mayor, and I would like him to call you. I will ask him to call you along with the AttorneyGeneral. Rudy very much knows what's happening and he is a very capable guy. If you could speak to him that would be great. The former ambassador from the United States,the woman, was bad news and the people she was dealing with in the Ukraine were bad news so I just wan to_let you know that. The other thing, There's a lot of talk about Biden's son that Eiden stopped the prosecution {He didn't - JonF} and a lot of people want to find out about that so whatever you can do with the Attorney General would be great. Biden went around bragging that he stopped the prosecution {Nope - JonF} so if you can look into it. It sounds horrible to me.
...
I will have Mr. Giuliani.give you a call and I am also going to have Attorney General Barr call and we will get to the bottom of it. I'm sure you will figure it out. I heard the prosecutor was treated very badly and he was a very fair prosecutor so good luck with everything.
...
I will tell Rudy and Attorney General Barr to call.

Schiff: I hear what you want. I have a favor I want from you though. And I’m going to say this only seven times so you better listen good. I want you to make up dirt on my political opponent, understand. Lots of it. On this and on that. I’m going to put you in touch with people, not just any people, I am going to put you in touch with the attorney general of the United States, my Attorney General Bill Barr. He’s got the whole weight of the American law enforcement behind him. And I’m going to put you in touch with Rudy. You’re going to love him. Trust me. You know what I’m asking
Edited by JonF, : No reason given.
Edited by JonF, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 3781 by Faith, posted 12-10-2019 10:59 AM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 3789 by Faith, posted 12-10-2019 3:11 PM JonF has replied

  
JonF
Member (Idle past 189 days)
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 3791 of 5796 (868309)
12-10-2019 3:50 PM
Reply to: Message 3788 by Faith
12-10-2019 3:03 PM


Re: Parody?
And yet the transcript and Schiff align quite well. Same subjects in the same order.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 3788 by Faith, posted 12-10-2019 3:03 PM Faith has not replied

  
JonF
Member (Idle past 189 days)
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 3792 of 5796 (868311)
12-10-2019 3:52 PM
Reply to: Message 3789 by Faith
12-10-2019 3:11 PM


Re: sRe: More Trump Attack/Insult Tweets
It's all come out already. The investigation phase is winding down.
No matter how many times you deny what the investigation found the results don't go away.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 3789 by Faith, posted 12-10-2019 3:11 PM Faith has not replied

  
JonF
Member (Idle past 189 days)
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


(2)
Message 3793 of 5796 (868312)
12-10-2019 3:58 PM
Reply to: Message 3788 by Faith
12-10-2019 3:03 PM


Re: Parody?
how cany anyone justify someone's doing a parody of a President's call to a foreign leader?
First Amendment. I know you hate it but it's still in force.
What kind of bizarre government are we running here?
One with a Constitution and system of laws. Which are being followed in the impeachment. Which were followed in the Mueller investigation, as the IG report shows.
Which people like you and Trump are trying to destroy and replace with some kind of perverted monarchy.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 3788 by Faith, posted 12-10-2019 3:03 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 3795 by jar, posted 12-10-2019 4:12 PM JonF has not replied
 Message 3799 by Faith, posted 12-10-2019 4:51 PM JonF has replied

  
JonF
Member (Idle past 189 days)
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 3806 of 5796 (868331)
12-10-2019 7:13 PM
Reply to: Message 3799 by Faith
12-10-2019 4:51 PM


Re: Parody?
First Amendment does not allow misrepresenting people, don't care what twisted rationbalizatiobn you make about that.
Depending on circumstances, it sometimes does allow misrepresenting someone. Especially public figures like Trump. Misrepresentation is OK when it's clearly labeled as such, and a reasonable person would not be fooled into thinking they were Trump’s words. Schiff's parody meets that test.
All kinds of laws have been broken in this impeachement and the wntire witch hunrt.
Wait, wait, don't tell me... you can't name a single specific broken law. (Remember right to confront and question the accuser doesn't apply for the several reasons previously posted.)
  • impeachment is not a criminal matter, which is what the Sixth Amendment covers.
  • What's happened so far is not a prosecution, it's an investigation. Representation at Investigative meetings is never required and rarely appropriate.
  • The whistleblower is not one of the witnesses against Trump. Trump’s culpability has been solidly established by people with more direct and complete knowledge.
I can only hope it will all come out soon.
Rejoice! It's all out!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 3799 by Faith, posted 12-10-2019 4:51 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 3808 by Faith, posted 12-10-2019 8:27 PM JonF has replied
 Message 3811 by Faith, posted 12-10-2019 8:37 PM JonF has replied

  
JonF
Member (Idle past 189 days)
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 3807 of 5796 (868332)
12-10-2019 7:33 PM
Reply to: Message 3805 by Percy
12-10-2019 6:18 PM


Re: Remarkable Cross Examination by Reprentative Swalwell
Exactly right. It's at 1:38:02 in the C-Span video and transcript. Can't embed.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 3805 by Percy, posted 12-10-2019 6:18 PM Percy has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 3812 by Percy, posted 12-10-2019 9:18 PM JonF has not replied

  
JonF
Member (Idle past 189 days)
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 3820 of 5796 (868367)
12-11-2019 10:35 AM
Reply to: Message 3808 by Faith
12-10-2019 8:27 PM


Re: Parody?
I posted what he said. Clearly labeled as parody. As he said it, not afterwards. It was an obvious comedy routine to everyone except RWNJs.
quote:
It reads like a classic organized crime shakedown. Shorn of its rambling character and in not so many words, this is the essence of what the president communicates.
This is in sum and character what the president was trying to communicate with the president of Ukraine. It would be funny if it wasn’t such a graphic betrayal of the president’s oath of office. But as it does represent a real betrayal, there’s nothing the president says here that is in America’s interest after all.
List six specific instances of Pelosi or Schiff breaking any laws
You can because they haven't. I challenged you yesterday and you didn't respond.
Trump, on the other hand, abused power in extorting Ukraine and obstructed justice by blocking investigation of that extort.
See how "specific" works?
Your turn. Six specific instances.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 3808 by Faith, posted 12-10-2019 8:27 PM Faith has not replied

  
JonF
Member (Idle past 189 days)
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 3821 of 5796 (868368)
12-11-2019 10:38 AM
Reply to: Message 3811 by Faith
12-10-2019 8:37 PM


Re: Parody?
Investigators do not invite the accused and their lawyers into interviews with witnesses and people of interest. Period. Have you ever seen a cop show or movie?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 3811 by Faith, posted 12-10-2019 8:37 PM Faith has not replied

  
JonF
Member (Idle past 189 days)
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 3822 of 5796 (868369)
12-11-2019 10:43 AM
Reply to: Message 3815 by Faith
12-11-2019 12:22 AM


Re: Trump handlers rush to his side ...
Impeachment does not apply to members of Congress.
The articles of impeachment against both Nixon and Clinton included obstruction of justice. Can you say "there is precedent"?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 3815 by Faith, posted 12-11-2019 12:22 AM Faith has not replied

  
JonF
Member (Idle past 189 days)
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 3823 of 5796 (868370)
12-11-2019 10:56 AM


Worker threw exception | www.rawstory.com | Cloudflare
quote:
According to new reports, Donald Trump Jr. illegally shot and killed an endangered argali sheep on a taxpayer-funded hunting trip in Western Mongolia in August and the Mongolian government retroactively gave him a permit rather than tread on the toes of the U.S. government.
They all think they are above the law. But I love this: Worker threw exception | www.rawstory.com | Cloudflare

  
JonF
Member (Idle past 189 days)
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 3864 of 5796 (868552)
12-14-2019 11:12 AM
Reply to: Message 3863 by Faith
12-14-2019 10:59 AM


Re: More Trump Attack/Insult Tweets
He's being impeached for two specific offenses for which there is overwhelming evidence.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 3863 by Faith, posted 12-14-2019 10:59 AM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 3865 by Faith, posted 12-14-2019 11:14 AM JonF has replied

  
JonF
Member (Idle past 189 days)
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 3867 of 5796 (868556)
12-14-2019 11:40 AM
Reply to: Message 3865 by Faith
12-14-2019 11:14 AM


Re: More Trump Attack/Insult Tweets
And the ten felonies Mueller found Trump could be impeached for.
Claiming that the offenses aren't impeachable is just another RWNJ fantasy. Trump did what he's accused of.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 3865 by Faith, posted 12-14-2019 11:14 AM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 3868 by Faith, posted 12-14-2019 11:44 AM JonF has replied
 Message 3869 by Faith, posted 12-14-2019 12:49 PM JonF has replied

  
JonF
Member (Idle past 189 days)
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 3870 of 5796 (868613)
12-15-2019 9:26 AM
Reply to: Message 3868 by Faith
12-14-2019 11:44 AM


Re: More Trump Attack/Insult Tweets
You have no clue what Mueller found.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 3868 by Faith, posted 12-14-2019 11:44 AM Faith has not replied

  
JonF
Member (Idle past 189 days)
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 3871 of 5796 (868614)
12-15-2019 9:34 AM
Reply to: Message 3869 by Faith
12-14-2019 12:49 PM


Re: More Trump Attack/Insult Tweets
I don't know why they didn't impeach Trump for Mueller's felonies. I do know it didn't take any fishing to find more reasons to impeach him. The reasons were presented to the Democrats without asking in spite of the administration's efforts to illegally cover them up.
The Constitution does not list all valid impeachable offenses. Obstruction of Justice and Abuse of Power were in Nixon's charges and Obstruction of Justice was in Clinton's charges. So there's precedent for both.
Nor are the offenses required to be felonies; misdemeanors are specifically mentioned and misdemeanors are not felonies. Although obstruction of justice can be a felony.
Too much reality for you , of course.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 3869 by Faith, posted 12-14-2019 12:49 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 3872 by Faith, posted 12-15-2019 10:58 AM JonF has replied

  
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