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Author Topic:   The Right Side of the News (formerly In the News)
ringo
Member
Posts: 17395
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 2.6


Message 2956 of 2980 (864018)
10-05-2019 12:19 PM
Reply to: Message 2955 by Faith
10-05-2019 12:09 PM


Re: Fox News Gets the Facts Backward
Faith writes:

... seems perfectly straightforward to me.... makes no sense to me at all....


You're trapped in a wrinkle in time. You grew up believing that the (Soviet) Russians were evil but now your hero Trump has his lips permanently attached to Putin's ass. It's no wonder you get confused about which side you're on.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2955 by Faith, posted 10-05-2019 12:09 PM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 2957 by Faith, posted 10-05-2019 12:48 PM ringo has responded

  
Faith
Member
Posts: 33255
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.2


Message 2957 of 2980 (864021)
10-05-2019 12:48 PM
Reply to: Message 2956 by ringo
10-05-2019 12:19 PM


Re: Fox News Gets the Facts Backward
What on earth does that have to do with Biden's bragging about pressuring a foreign government into firing a prosecutor?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2956 by ringo, posted 10-05-2019 12:19 PM ringo has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 2958 by ringo, posted 10-05-2019 12:58 PM Faith has not yet responded

    
ringo
Member
Posts: 17395
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 2.6


Message 2958 of 2980 (864022)
10-05-2019 12:58 PM
Reply to: Message 2957 by Faith
10-05-2019 12:48 PM


Re: Fox News Gets the Facts Backward
Faith writes:

What on earth does that have to do with Biden's bragging about pressuring a foreign government into firing a prosecutor?


It was a general observation in response to your general observation.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2957 by Faith, posted 10-05-2019 12:48 PM Faith has not yet responded

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 15439
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.9


Message 2959 of 2980 (864023)
10-05-2019 1:26 PM
Reply to: Message 2955 by Faith
10-05-2019 12:09 PM


Re: Fox News Gets the Facts Backward
I think the fact that you chose to cite Russian propaganda had a lot to do with it. RT is owned by the Russian government. The fact that they are choosing to bash Biden is evidence that the Russians are still backing Trump.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2955 by Faith, posted 10-05-2019 12:09 PM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 2960 by Faith, posted 10-05-2019 1:40 PM PaulK has responded

    
Faith
Member
Posts: 33255
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.2


Message 2960 of 2980 (864024)
10-05-2019 1:40 PM
Reply to: Message 2959 by PaulK
10-05-2019 1:26 PM


Re: Fox News Gets the Facts Backward
What's RT?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2959 by PaulK, posted 10-05-2019 1:26 PM PaulK has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 2961 by PaulK, posted 10-05-2019 1:44 PM Faith has responded

    
PaulK
Member
Posts: 15439
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.9


Message 2961 of 2980 (864025)
10-05-2019 1:44 PM
Reply to: Message 2960 by Faith
10-05-2019 1:40 PM


Re: Fox News Gets the Facts Backward
RT or Russia Today is the source of your video in Message 2939. As can be seen be anyone who looks. The RT is hardly hidden.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2960 by Faith, posted 10-05-2019 1:40 PM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 2962 by Faith, posted 10-05-2019 2:10 PM PaulK has responded

    
Faith
Member
Posts: 33255
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.2


Message 2962 of 2980 (864026)
10-05-2019 2:10 PM
Reply to: Message 2961 by PaulK
10-05-2019 1:44 PM


Re: Fox News Gets the Facts Backward
Obviously I wasn't interested in the source, just in what Biden said which I'd heard so many times on the radio.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2961 by PaulK, posted 10-05-2019 1:44 PM PaulK has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 2964 by Theodoric, posted 10-05-2019 2:24 PM Faith has not yet responded
 Message 2965 by PaulK, posted 10-05-2019 4:33 PM Faith has not yet responded

    
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 6654
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 4.2


Message 2963 of 2980 (864028)
10-05-2019 2:22 PM
Reply to: Message 2955 by Faith
10-05-2019 12:09 PM


Re: Fox News Gets the Facts Backward
So are you claiming you had no idea that your source is a Russian propaganda outfit, funded by the Russian government?

Here is a quick primer.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RT_%28TV_network%29

Edited by Theodoric, : No reason given.


Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 2955 by Faith, posted 10-05-2019 12:09 PM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 2968 by Faith, posted 10-06-2019 10:46 AM Theodoric has not yet responded

    
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 6654
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 4.2


Message 2964 of 2980 (864029)
10-05-2019 2:24 PM
Reply to: Message 2962 by Faith
10-05-2019 2:10 PM


Re: Fox News Gets the Facts Backward
You have no interest in facts or sources.

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 2962 by Faith, posted 10-05-2019 2:10 PM Faith has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 2966 by Percy, posted 10-05-2019 5:30 PM Theodoric has not yet responded

    
PaulK
Member
Posts: 15439
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.9


Message 2965 of 2980 (864036)
10-05-2019 4:33 PM
Reply to: Message 2962 by Faith
10-05-2019 2:10 PM


Re: Fox News Gets the Facts Backward
Obviously you should be interested in your sources. And you certainly can’t complain if someone notices which sources you are using.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2962 by Faith, posted 10-05-2019 2:10 PM Faith has not yet responded

    
Percy
Member
Posts: 18868
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 2.4


(2)
Message 2966 of 2980 (864041)
10-05-2019 5:30 PM
Reply to: Message 2964 by Theodoric
10-05-2019 2:24 PM


Re: Fox News Gets the Facts Backward
Theodoric writes:

You have no interest in facts or sources.

How my response is related to this won't be immediately obvious, because I want to first reference an interesting analysis piece in the New York Times: In the Land of Self-Defeat. It describes a chunk of rural America, typical in character, that has gradually become, through no fault of its own, more and more impoverished as the circumstances that once made their community strong and vibrant gradually dissipate. One might think this would cause appeals for help from state and federal government, but they've instead withdrawn into themselves and insisted more and more upon self-reliance.

It *does* take a community, and rural America is part of the community of America. We should be helping them (I don't think we know what form that help would take, but it would undoubtedly need to be both intense and diverse), but they don't want our help. They vote against the very politicians who would be most sympathetic to their plight.

They favor Trump by more than 70%, and that's both the mystery and the tragedy. The tragedy is obvious, but the mystery is perplexing. They believe nearly every nonsensical word Trump speaks (I'm now finally addressing your comment) with no apparent interest in facts or logic. "Trump good, Democrats bad" combined with disparaging attitudes about government, education, minorities, immigrants and urbanites (anyone who's not them) seems to be the foundation of their philosophy.

I can understand it mattering to people that Biden exaggerated both his role and the details (A billion dollars? Really, Joe?) concerning the dismissal of Ukrainian prosecutor Shokin, but I can't understand confusing it with Trump's impeachable offense in pressuring a foreign power to dig up dirt on a likely presidential opponent. Biden could bald-facedly lie that he singlehandedly chased Shokin down, cuffed him, and threw him in a cell and it would not be remotely relevant to what Trump's done.

Shokin *was* investigating Burisma Holdings where Biden's son sat on the board, but for actions it took before he joined the board. What upset western democracies was Shokin's failure to assist in bringing to justice financial malfeasance in the west by Ukrainian nationals, among them the founder of that very same Burisma Holdings. By working with other western democracies to have Shokin removed as prosecutor Biden made it more likely, not less, that the founder of the company on whose board his son sat would be investigated.

--Percy

Edited by Percy, : Typo.

Edited by Percy, : Another typo.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 2964 by Theodoric, posted 10-05-2019 2:24 PM Theodoric has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 2967 by Faith, posted 10-05-2019 8:18 PM Percy has acknowledged this reply
 Message 2969 by marc9000, posted 10-06-2019 9:30 PM Percy has not yet responded

    
Faith
Member
Posts: 33255
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.2


Message 2967 of 2980 (864044)
10-05-2019 8:18 PM
Reply to: Message 2966 by Percy
10-05-2019 5:30 PM


Re: Fox News Gets the Facts Backward
...disparaging attitudes about

government,
education,
minorities,
immigrants and
urbanites
(anyone who's not them) seems to be the foundation of their philosophy.

Leftist spin of course.

GOVERNMENT: The sane people of the nation object to the socialist/communist/Marxist lean of the government, also to BIG government;

EDUCATION: Object also to the Leftist ideological propaganda that is today's education.

MINORITIES: Also to the racial emphasis in everything, to the PC namecalling of "racist" or "homophobe" for instance, and to what is perceived as the ideological favoring of minorities at the expense of others, not an objection to MINORITIES themselves,

"IMMIGRANTS" Also to the protection and favoring of ILLEGAL immigrants, not immigrants, against the rights of citizens

URBANITES: Also to the ideological political hegemony of urban areas, which now of course the Left wants to set in concrete against the rural parts of the country by doing away with the Electoral College.

Your way of putting it is blindly biased. I just hope the sane people you are misrepresenting do get their way in the next election.

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 2966 by Percy, posted 10-05-2019 5:30 PM Percy has acknowledged this reply

    
Faith
Member
Posts: 33255
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.2


Message 2968 of 2980 (864054)
10-06-2019 10:46 AM
Reply to: Message 2963 by Theodoric
10-05-2019 2:22 PM


Re: Fox News Gets the Facts Backward
So are you claiming you had no idea that your source is a Russian propaganda outfit, funded by the Russian government?

Yes, I was looking for the clip I'd heard so many times on the radio of Biden bragging about withholding aid if Ukraine didn't fire a particular prosecutor. When I finally found it I didn't notice the source, it didn't matter to me.

Here is a quick primer.

But it doesn't matter to me. Biden said what he said, I don't care where he said it.

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 2963 by Theodoric, posted 10-05-2019 2:22 PM Theodoric has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
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marc9000
Member
Posts: 1015
From: Ky U.S.
Joined: 12-25-2009


(1)
Message 2969 of 2980 (864103)
10-06-2019 9:30 PM
Reply to: Message 2966 by Percy
10-05-2019 5:30 PM


Re: Fox News Gets the Facts Backward
How my response is related to this won't be immediately obvious, because I want to first reference an interesting analysis piece in the New York Times: In the Land of Self-Defeat. It describes a chunk of rural America, typical in character, that has gradually become, through no fault of its own, more and more impoverished as the circumstances that once made their community strong and vibrant gradually dissipate.

Hi Percy, this lowlife WHITE rural American has a little time to play tonight.

In reading through your link, it looks to me like the between-the-lines implication is that these circumstances are party, or completely because of conservatism / Trump. But are they really, were they pretty close to the same when Obama was president?

There were a few things in that article that pointed to possibilities of increasing impoverishment;

quote:
One of the biggest natural gas companies in the area, Houston-based Southwestern Energy, stopped paying taxes to the counties here, arguing that the rates were unfair.

and;

quote:
Many rural counties are also experiencing declines in whatever industries were once the major employers. In Appalachia, this is coal;

"Unfair" tax rates for business, the war on coal by environmentalists? You're right, this is not the fault of these Trump voters, or Trump himself.

It *does* take a community, and rural America is part of the community of America. We should be helping them (I don't think we know what form that help would take, but it would undoubtedly need to be both intense and diverse), but they don't want our help. They vote against the very politicians who would be most sympathetic to their plight.

Yes, the ones who say; "Hell yes, we're going to take your AR-15. The ones who are also sympathetic to little foreign girls who hate U.S. productivity. Or those who place a higher priority in meddling with the fossil fuel industry than actually helping people. A LOT of intensity and diversity.

They favor Trump by more than 70%, and that's both the mystery and the tragedy. The tragedy is obvious, but the mystery is perplexing. They believe nearly every nonsensical word Trump speaks (I'm now finally addressing your comment) with no apparent interest in facts or logic.

They just understand facts and logic that sympathetic Democrats tend to forget and ignore. Like our $22 trillion, and growing national debt. Like recent increases in homeless communities in California that make their own lifestyles seem pretty good. And Democrat politicians (Pelosi, Waters, Schiff, anyone?) who show no concern about it.

"Trump good, Democrats bad" combined with disparaging attitudes about government, education, minorities, immigrants and urbanites (anyone who's not them) seems to be the foundation of their philosophy.

That's it - and facts and logic are involved.

...but I can't understand confusing it with Trump's impeachable offense in pressuring a foreign power to dig up dirt on a likely presidential opponent.

What I can't understand is how the mainstream media and Democrats are getting by with this, why it isn't trumpeted by Republicans just how fake it really is. Biden is NOT a political opponent of Trump's, because he's not been named as the 2020 Democrat candidate yet. The election is over a year away, while Biden is the front runner, front runners this far out are often not the candidate. Biden would take office at age 78 if elected. Even some Democrats would agree that there's too much likelihood of his death, or serious medical problems, for it to be good for the country. His chances or being the nominee are very small.

26 - is that the number of Democrats who are, or were running for the 2020 nomination? Does that mean that all of them, upon their announcement as a candidate, are suddenly immune to questioning by a sitting president for possible crimes involving foreign governments any time in the past? To think that Trump is scared of the 76 year old Biden 14 months before the upcoming election is laughable. It's very believable when he says his phone call had nothing to do with the upcoming election.

But back to your link;

quote:
Economic appeals are not going to sway any Trump voters, who view anyone who is trying to increase government spending, especially to help other people, with disdain, even if it ultimately helps them, too.

In this economy, you can be sure "economic appeals" aren't going to sway any Trump voters. The left will never understand it, but it's a simple fact that "Trump voters" often find more value in being left alone more than getting free stuff.

quote:
And Trump voters are carrying the day here in Van Buren County. They see Mr. Trump’s slashing of the national safety net and withdrawal from the international stage as necessities — these things reflect their own impulse writ large.

They believe every tax dollar spent now is wasteful and foolish and they will have to pay for it later. It is as if there will be a nationwide scramble to cover the shortfall just as there was here with the library. As long as Democrats make promises to make their lives better with free college and Medicare for all sound like they include government spending, these voters will turn to Trump again — and it won’t matter how many scandals he’s been tarnished by.


His "scandals", most all of them greatly magnified by the Democrat news media, are microscopic compared to the current national debt, or rural America's knowledge of the disastrous results of many past socialist experiments worldwide.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 2966 by Percy, posted 10-05-2019 5:30 PM Percy has not yet responded

  
ICANT
Member
Posts: 6244
From: SSC
Joined: 03-12-2007
Member Rating: 1.4


Message 2970 of 2980 (864115)
10-07-2019 1:20 AM
Reply to: Message 2953 by Percy
10-05-2019 6:17 AM


Re: Fox News Comes a Little Closer to the Truth
Hi Percy

Percy writes:

By pushing for Shokin's dismissal Biden was making it more likely that the founder of Burisma Holdings where his son sat on the board would be investigated.

Isn't that the same investigation Trump is asking for?

It seems under Yuri Lutsenko the prosecutor general who succeeded Shokin the investigation ended with a settlement and a fine paid by one of the firm's accountants.

So the results of Shokin being fired was a settlement and a fine paid by an accountant which benefited the company.

Since we are still giving Ukraine a lot of money and military hardware why shouldn't that investigation be completed rather than accepting a decision made by the person who followed Biden's having Shokin fired or the Gov. would not get the billion dollars.

God Bless


"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2953 by Percy, posted 10-05-2019 6:17 AM Percy has not yet responded

    
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