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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1471 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
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Author | Topic: The Right Side of the News | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Theodoric Member Posts: 9197 From: Northwest, WI, USA Joined: Member Rating: 3.2 |
Trump did try to extort the President of Ukraine. It is not a lie.
Not the end of discussion, because there are more witnesses to hear from. Why are you so anti-American? Why are you so against the US Constitution? Why do you support an wannabe autocrat? Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts "God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness. If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?
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ringo Member (Idle past 439 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Faith writes:
No. You don't get to end the discussion. The investigation is still ongoing and the investigators will decide what Trump did ot tried to do, not you. TRUMP DID NOT TRY TO EXTORT UKRAINE THAST IS A **** ***.END OF DISCUSSION. "If you can keep your head when all about you Are losing theirs and blaming it on you...." -- Rudyard Kipling
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DrJones* Member Posts: 2290 From: Edmonton, Alberta, Canada Joined: Member Rating: 6.9 |
and what is your evidence that he is the whistleblower?
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Theodoric Member Posts: 9197 From: Northwest, WI, USA Joined: Member Rating: 3.2 |
If he is at least he should feel safe knowing that he is being outed by doofuses that can't even get his name right.
But you don't have any evidence or even reasonable arguments as to why you think this guy is the whistleblower do you. Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts "God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness. If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?
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JonF Member (Idle past 195 days) Posts: 6174 Joined: |
TRUMP DID NOT TRY TO EXTORT UKRAINE THAST IS A **** ***.
The evidence that he did is overwhelming. Especially after foday.
END OF DISCUSSION.
Yep, the discussion is over. The truth's out.
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JonF Member (Idle past 195 days) Posts: 6174 Joined: |
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1471 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
No he did not. Aid was not mentioned at all in the phone call, and even if it had been it is common for Presidents to make aid contingent on such things as whether there is corruption in the country to receive it, whih is what he was asking about. But no aid was mentioned, it was not withheld, they got it and they did nothing at all in order to get it so there was no extortion whatever. You all just want ot think there was but you don't understand anything about it so you just impose your own hatred of Trump on it.
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JonF Member (Idle past 195 days) Posts: 6174 Joined: |
It's in the transcript. Many reliable witnesses have testified as to what happened. The cat is out of the bag.
Your refusal to return to planet Earth does not change that.
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JonF Member (Idle past 195 days) Posts: 6174 Joined: |
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PaulK Member Posts: 17827 Joined: Member Rating: 2.3 |
quote: Zelensky explicitly mentioned the missiles - which the military aid was for. Trump immediately asked for a favour,
quote: Trump wasn’t concerned with corruption, he wanted Zelensky to help find the imaginary server and to announce that Hunter Biden was being investigated (see Sondland’s testimony - Trump didn’t need an actual investigation, just the announcement). And since you mention corruption it seems that Politico got it’s facts wrong. Manafort’s dealings with the Russians were revealed by anti-corruption investigators, BBCPresident Trump's supporters suggest this document was a fake and that it was deliberately leaked by a Ukrainian journalist turned politician, Sergei Leschenko, who hated Mr Trump. The problem is that the sections released by Mr Leschenko did not refer to Paul Manafort at all. The material related to Mr Manafort was made public by an official Ukrainian anti-corruption body. The aid was given - but only because Republican Senators pushed Trump into it. And the White House visit for Zelensky - the other part of the deal - has not happened.
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1471 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
All but two of the "witnesses" were not witnesses, they wre reporting third and fourth hand hearsay. Aand there is no mention of "aid" in the transcript of the phone call.
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Taq Member Posts: 10077 Joined: Member Rating: 5.2 |
Faith writes: Aid was not mentioned at all in the phone call, . . . There is so much more than just a phone call. This was a campaign that went on for months. The phone call is just a tiny, tiny piece of the overall problem. Only members of the Cult of Trump pretend as if the phone call is all that exists.
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1432 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
Barbarians would have killed him long ago. Romans would have done it ...
quote: Enjoyby our ability to understand RebelAmericanZenDeist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1432 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined:
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All but two of the "witnesses" were not witnesses, they wre reporting third and fourth hand hearsay. Aand there is no mention of "aid" in the transcript of the phone call. Every testimony to date has supported the bare facts that aid was withheld, that favors were asked for -- as detailed in the letter/memo of the August 12 phone call. So far neither Trump nor the republicans have presented any exculpatory evidence:
quote: So far all the evidence presented is inculpatory. All republicans have done is pretend that nothing happened. The bare minimum evidence that everyone should agree on:
(1) -- it weakens the apparent support for Ukraine from the west and emboldens his expansionist behavior. This is evident from watching Russian TV, where they are advising Ukraine to side with Russia. (2) -- it allows Giulliani, as Trump's personal lawyer/representative, to verbalize the quid pro quo (extortion) of "deliverables" ... investigation into Biden, the mythical DNC server etc The action of Trump (whitehouse, administration, etc) in refusing to provide any evidence is (a) obstruction of justice (withholding evidence is a crime) and (b) implies there is no exculpatory evidence they could release, and (c) gives the impression of guilt. Enjoyby our ability to understand RebelAmericanZenDeist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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JonF Member (Idle past 195 days) Posts: 6174 Joined: |
But there's plenty of mentions of aid in the statements of the witnesses. The phone call isn't all we have
All the witnesses tell largely the same story. (If they all told exactly the same story that would be suspicious.) They're not telling third or fourth hand. Even if you want to ignore all of them except the two you acknowledge are directly involved the facts are clear,
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