Understanding through Discussion


Welcome! You are not logged in. [ Login ]
EvC Forum active members: 76 (9011 total)
69 online now:
PaulK, Tangle (2 members, 67 visitors)
Newest Member: Burrawang
Upcoming Birthdays: Coragyps
Happy Birthday: DrJones*
Post Volume: Total: 881,651 Year: 13,399/23,288 Month: 329/795 Week: 30/95 Day: 11/19 Hour: 0/0


Thread  Details

Email This Thread
Newer Topic | Older Topic
  
Author Topic:   The Right Side of the News
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 7051
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005


Message 4921 of 5795 (871603)
02-06-2020 12:00 PM


Robert Reich debunks conservative economic mantras
Lower taxes on corporations and the wealthy do not help the overall economy and actually contribute to the redistribution of wealth to the top. With actual facts and data sources.

quote:
Their claim is that cutting taxes on the rich (and for that matter, corporations) will free up capital that will magically find its way back into the economy in the form of investment and hiring. Aside from being demonstrably false (see charts below), it also makes the false assumption that tax rates are what drive or divert hiring and other investments. In reality, more important market signals like demand are what drive these, regardless of tax rates. Cutting taxes on the rich and corporations has done nothing to boost GDP growth. Rather, the added streams of revenue have simply increased profits and increased wealth disparity here in the US.

As he says this is demonstrably false. Those that don't see are not following the facts and data, they are allowing their political viewpoints and prejudices to override reason.
Robert Reich: Several Myths about Taxes and Economics

Paul Krugman agrees.

quote:
The record is actually awesomely consistent. Bill Clinton’s tax hike didn’t cause a depression, George W. Bush’s tax cuts didn’t deliver a boom, Jerry Brown’s California tax increase wasn’t “economic suicide,” Sam Brownback’s Kansas tax-cut “experiment” (his term) was a failure.
Nevertheless, Republicans persist. This time around, the centerpiece of the tax cut was a huge break for corporations, which was supposed to induce companies to bring back the money they’ve invested overseas and put the money to work here. Instead, they basically used the tax savings to buy back their own stock.
What went wrong? Business investment depends on many factors, with tax rates way down the list. While a casual look at the facts might suggest that corporations invest a lot in countries with low taxes, like Ireland, this is mainly an illusion: Companies use accounting tricks to report huge profits and hence big investments in tax havens, but these don’t correspond to anything real.
There was never any reason to believe that cutting corporate taxes here would lead to a surge in capital spending and jobs, and sure enough, it didn’t.

Opinion | Why Was Trumponomics a Flop?

quote:
In short, the supposed rationale for big corporate tax cuts is based on a misinterpretation of the evidence. Multinational corporations move profits – as reported — around based on tax considerations; actual capital, and hence actual economic activity, not so much.
But why aren’t actual capital movements that sensitive to tax rates? There is, I think, an important point about business investment that a lot of discussion has missed.
The business cost of capital doesn’t matter very much
Anyone who follows real-world monetary policy is aware of a dirty little secret about what economists used to call the “transmission mechanism”: interest rates don’t have much direct effect on business investment. In fact, in general it’s hard to find any effect at all. Monetary policy works through housing and, these days, the exchange rate; if it affects business spending, the effect is indirect, through changes in sales that were caused by housing and the exchange rate.

Opinion | Tax Cuts and Leprechauns (Wonkish)
Now I know conservatives are going to attack Krugman and Reich as being liberal. How about you try something different and show the data and conclusions are wrong and not attack them?

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


  
Percy
Member
Posts: 19879
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 5.2


Message 4922 of 5795 (871610)
02-06-2020 3:49 PM


Who's Worse: Trump or Pelosi
Pelosi laces into Trump, defends tearing up his State of the Union speech, says the headline in today's Washington Post. Everyone is appalled at Pelosi's behavior, tearing up his speech and criticizing Trump after today's Prayer Breakfast and his later comments about impeachment.

What's truly astounding is that Pelosi's behavior is receiving the bulk of the criticism when Trump's is far, far worse. This could only be because people realize that Pelosi cares while Trump does not.

--Percy


Replies to this message:
 Message 4923 by jar, posted 02-06-2020 4:02 PM Percy has acknowledged this reply
 Message 4924 by JonF, posted 02-06-2020 4:07 PM Percy has acknowledged this reply

  
jar
Member
Posts: 32965
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 2.4


Message 4923 of 5795 (871611)
02-06-2020 4:02 PM
Reply to: Message 4922 by Percy
02-06-2020 3:49 PM


Re: Who's Worse: Trump or Pelosi
I saw Pelosi's behavior as petty and that she came across as playground reaction after Trump snubbing her when he presented the text.

But both were pretty much childish.

Edited by jar, : only one "e" in her


My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios     My Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 4922 by Percy, posted 02-06-2020 3:49 PM Percy has acknowledged this reply

  
JonF
Member
Posts: 6171
Joined: 06-23-2003
Member Rating: 3.4


(1)
Message 4924 of 5795 (871612)
02-06-2020 4:07 PM
Reply to: Message 4922 by Percy
02-06-2020 3:49 PM


Re: Who's Worse: Trump or Pelosi
Matt Gaetz Too Stupid For Laura Ingraham (warning:extreme liberal snark)

quote:
Describing Trump's mendacious rant as "an uplifting celebration of diversity of the American experience and the triumph of the American spirit," Gaetz demands that the House Ethics Committee censure the speaker and refer her to the Justice Department for criminal prosecution.

quote:
There is no question that Speaker Pelosi "mutilated, obliterated, or destroyed" the copy of the President's address provided to her at the beginning of the evening. The video evidence is clear and abundant, and the Speaker herself told reporters that she tore up this document because it was "the courteous thing to do given the alternatives."

Accordingly, after the House Committee on Ethics thoroughly investigates this matter and recommends Speaker Pelosi's censure, I urge you to make all appropriate referrals to the Department of Justice for further investigation and prosecution.



UH HUH. Well, as the Washington Post points out, there are a few small problems with this argument. Namely, a copy of a speech is not a federal record, Speaker Pelosi is not a legal custodian, and the House of Representatives is not the National Archives. But other than that, William and Mary Law School must be so proud of its distinguished alum's masterful legal reasoning.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 4922 by Percy, posted 02-06-2020 3:49 PM Percy has acknowledged this reply

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 19879
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 5.2


(7)
Message 4925 of 5795 (871613)
02-06-2020 5:32 PM


Joe Walsh is Running for President
I didn't even know who Joe Walsh was, let alone that he was running for president, until I read his column in today's Washington Post: Perspective | Joe Walsh: Challenging Trump for the GOP nomination taught me my party is a cult. This column's a must read, here's a taste:

quote:
Last Thursday, the president came to Des Moines for one of his narcissistic rallies. I was in Des Moines, too, so I tried to talk to some folks outside the event before they went in.
...
But three people said that Trump has never golfed since he’s been president. No one said that they thought he did anything wrong with Ukraine. No one knew that our annual deficits just blew past $1 trillion. Everyone believed hundreds of miles of new wall had been built. (Fact check: False!) When I asked whether they thought Mexico was paying for the wall, most people said yes but were at a loss to explain how. On and on it went: CNN was the enemy and Rep. Adam B. Schiff (Calif.), along with the rest of the congressional Democrats, were lying traitors.
...
They’re being spoon-fed a daily dose of B.S. from “conservative” media. They don’t know what the truth is and — more importantly — they don’t care. There’s nothing that any Republican challenger can do to break them out of this spell. (Thanks, Hannity.)

What I'm afraid of is that not Joe Walsh, not any Democrat, not any person in the world including the Pope, could defeat Trump's wall of lies.

We still wonder today how the Germans and Italians could have so blindly followed Hitler and Mussolini. We're seeing it again before our very eyes, but it remains inexplicable.

--Percy


Replies to this message:
 Message 4926 by Coragyps, posted 02-06-2020 5:49 PM Percy has acknowledged this reply
 Message 4927 by jar, posted 02-06-2020 6:01 PM Percy has responded
 Message 4929 by vimesey, posted 02-07-2020 2:19 AM Percy has acknowledged this reply

  
Coragyps
Member
Posts: 5548
From: Snyder, Texas, USA
Joined: 11-12-2002
Member Rating: 3.6


Message 4926 of 5795 (871615)
02-06-2020 5:49 PM
Reply to: Message 4925 by Percy
02-06-2020 5:32 PM


Re: Joe Walsh is Running for President
Anybody that sang “Rocky Mountain Way” is OK to be my presi...
oh, never mind.

I am glad that someone is opposing Il
Donald on the R side, anyway.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 4925 by Percy, posted 02-06-2020 5:32 PM Percy has acknowledged this reply

Replies to this message:
 Message 4933 by ringo, posted 02-07-2020 11:30 AM Coragyps has not yet responded

  
jar
Member
Posts: 32965
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 2.4


Message 4927 of 5795 (871617)
02-06-2020 6:01 PM
Reply to: Message 4925 by Percy
02-06-2020 5:32 PM


Re: Joe Walsh is Running for President
It can't happen here

It was predicted in 1935.


My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios     My Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 4925 by Percy, posted 02-06-2020 5:32 PM Percy has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 4930 by Percy, posted 02-07-2020 6:52 AM jar has responded

  
JonF
Member
Posts: 6171
Joined: 06-23-2003
Member Rating: 3.4


Message 4928 of 5795 (871620)
02-06-2020 7:52 PM


Miami Democrats file bar complaint against Matt Gaetz for his classified facility raid

quote:
“[We have] taken action to hold one of President Trump’s top defenders accountable for violating legal ethics by risking America’s national security to “grandstand” in Congress which entailed breaking into a secure, compartmented information facility, then ordering pizza,” stated the Miami-Dade Democratic Party in a press release.

  
vimesey
Member
Posts: 1178
From: Birmingham, England
Joined: 09-21-2011
Member Rating: 2.3


(1)
Message 4929 of 5795 (871623)
02-07-2020 2:19 AM
Reply to: Message 4925 by Percy
02-06-2020 5:32 PM


Re: Joe Walsh is Running for President
It’s inexplicable, but chillingly resonant.

Primo Levi, Holocaust survivor:

Monsters exist, but they are too few in number to be truly dangerous. More dangerous are the common men, the functionaries ready to believe and to act without asking questions.

We must be listened to: above and beyond our personal experience, we have collectively witnessed a fundamental unexpected event, fundamental precisely because unexpected, not foreseen by anyone. It happened, therefore it can happen again: this is the core of what we have to say. It can happen, and it can happen everywhere.

Edited by vimesey, : No reason given.


Could there be any greater conceit, than for someone to believe that the universe has to be simple enough for them to be able to understand it ?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 4925 by Percy, posted 02-06-2020 5:32 PM Percy has acknowledged this reply

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 19879
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 5.2


Message 4930 of 5795 (871624)
02-07-2020 6:52 AM
Reply to: Message 4927 by jar
02-06-2020 6:01 PM


Re: Joe Walsh is Running for President
jar writes:

It can't happen here

It was predicted in 1935.

You've mentioned this before, that's why I have a copy now.

--Percy


This message is a reply to:
 Message 4927 by jar, posted 02-06-2020 6:01 PM jar has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 4932 by jar, posted 02-07-2020 7:57 AM Percy has acknowledged this reply

  
frako
Member
Posts: 2923
From: slovenija
Joined: 09-04-2010


Message 4931 of 5795 (871625)
02-07-2020 7:42 AM


Fox Lying piece of crap news
Top 10 Deadliest European Cities

Ok WTF rain in your lying News. I don't care how much fox news lies about the status of america but stop lying about my country. Celje is definitively positively not among the top 10 most dangerous cities in EU. The stats are made up there where no 0, zilch murders in 2017 in Celje.


Christianity, One woman's lie about an affair that got seriously out of hand

What are the Christians gonna do to me ..... Forgive me, good luck with that.


  
jar
Member
Posts: 32965
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 2.4


Message 4932 of 5795 (871626)
02-07-2020 7:57 AM
Reply to: Message 4930 by Percy
02-07-2020 6:52 AM


Re: Joe Walsh is Running for President
It was an assigned reading back when I was in the 8th or 9th grade IIRC. About the same time 1984 and Animal Farm and Words in Thought and Action were mandatory reading.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios     My Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 4930 by Percy, posted 02-07-2020 6:52 AM Percy has acknowledged this reply

Replies to this message:
 Message 4936 by dwise1, posted 02-07-2020 1:36 PM jar has not yet responded

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 18799
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 2.1


Message 4933 of 5795 (871634)
02-07-2020 11:30 AM
Reply to: Message 4926 by Coragyps
02-06-2020 5:49 PM


Re: Joe Walsh is Running for President
I thought he was dead, so the good news is he isn't.

Oh, and there's another Joe Walsh.


"I'm Fallen and I can't get up!"

This message is a reply to:
 Message 4926 by Coragyps, posted 02-06-2020 5:49 PM Coragyps has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 4934 by jar, posted 02-07-2020 12:13 PM ringo has acknowledged this reply

  
jar
Member
Posts: 32965
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 2.4


Message 4934 of 5795 (871637)
02-07-2020 12:13 PM
Reply to: Message 4933 by ringo
02-07-2020 11:30 AM


Re: Joe Walsh is Running for President
And this Joe Walsh just pulled out of the race.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios     My Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 4933 by ringo, posted 02-07-2020 11:30 AM ringo has acknowledged this reply

  
RAZD
Member (Idle past 66 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 4935 of 5795 (871641)
02-07-2020 12:30 PM
Reply to: Message 4917 by Percy
02-06-2020 8:34 AM


Re: Paying down the National Debt, improving society[qs]
But you can't leave inflation out of the equation. Increased worker salaries mean that businesses must raise prices.

But if the change is how profits are distributed within a company, inflation should not be an issue.

Curiously I am amused by people so ready to accept a feudal type organization of corporations, when we fought a revolutionary war to get feudal type government out and replaced by a democratic system.

The answer, of course, is worker owned cooperatives, where all the workers decide major company policies, like pay and benefits, and they hire and fire managers. Not surprisingly they are successful and have high worker satisfaction. They also seem to be more robust in startups than your standard business model companies.

Mondragon Corporation - Wikipedia is a huge success story.

van Gogh

I meant among people I know.

And you don't wonder why there are no "van Gogh" type people in your circle of friends, but think you have a well rounded group. Interesting. I guess you don't know what you don't miss.

Yeah, sure, when I said "capitalism" I really meant "unchecked capitalism."

"Capitalism" without any modifiers defaults to unchecked capitalism. Capitalism is amoral, while socialism provides a moral culture. Done democratically it is OF the people FOR the people BY the people.

Enjoy

Enjoy


we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
Rebel•American•Zen•Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 4917 by Percy, posted 02-06-2020 8:34 AM Percy has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 4937 by Percy, posted 02-07-2020 2:30 PM RAZD has responded

  
Newer Topic | Older Topic
Jump to:


Copyright 2001-2018 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved

™ Version 4.0 Beta
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2020