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Author Topic:   The Right Side of the News (formerly In the News)
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 3766
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 4.4


Message 511 of 1055 (847088)
01-17-2019 8:00 PM
Reply to: Message 510 by caffeine
01-17-2019 3:52 PM


Re: May and Brexit Suffer a Major Blow
People who were struggling economically voted for change.

And without the knowledge that what little prosperity they had, quite substantial in Earth terms, came from their continued part within the EU.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 510 by caffeine, posted 01-17-2019 3:52 PM caffeine has not yet responded

  
Faith
Inactive Member


Message 512 of 1055 (847195)
01-19-2019 11:08 AM


George Will misses the point
So in Message 2718 of the Trump Bashing Thread Percy applauds George Will for his colorful trashing of Trump. The thing is Trump's supporters don't care about such things, don't care about his style at all, and the more he's put down for such irrelevancies the more people rally to his support.

Trump cares about what we care about, he really truly cares about restoring America's greatness in the world after Obama's attempts to destroy it, he cares about the President's job of protecting American citizens, and his faults don't rise to any level yet that challenges our trust in his dedication to these things.

These are what matter, and if they continue to matter this is what will continue to keep him in the position of the strongest opposition to the Loony Left we've ever had.

The Left has been working feverishly to invent calumnies against him for more than two years now. We know it is all lying propaganda, but Hitler went far on propaganda lies so we know they could succeed at bringing him down. That will be the end of America but we've been expecting it for years anyway. Some are predicting civil war but I don't see the conservative side having that mentality myself.


Replies to this message:
 Message 513 by JonF, posted 01-19-2019 11:18 AM Faith has responded
 Message 518 by Percy, posted 01-19-2019 5:20 PM Faith has responded

  
JonF
Member
Posts: 4470
Joined: 06-23-2003
Member Rating: 3.5


(2)
Message 513 of 1055 (847199)
01-19-2019 11:18 AM
Reply to: Message 512 by Faith
01-19-2019 11:08 AM


Re: George Will misses the point
Trump’s supporters don't care about anything but abortion and hurting people they hate. As Crystal Minton of Florida, a Federal worker and Trump supporter, put it in regards to the shutdown: "He's hurting the wrong people".

We all know he could commit any crime, no matter how heinous, and you'd enthusiastically support him.

Edited by JonF, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 512 by Faith, posted 01-19-2019 11:08 AM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 514 by Faith, posted 01-19-2019 11:22 AM JonF has responded

  
Faith
Inactive Member


Message 514 of 1055 (847201)
01-19-2019 11:22 AM
Reply to: Message 513 by JonF
01-19-2019 11:18 AM


Re: George Will misses the point
It isn't Trump hurting the Federal workers, it's Pelosi and her gang who refuse to fund the wall. But Trump gets blamed for all the bad stuff and the criminal stuff his opponents do. That's what you SHOULD know, because his supporters know it.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 513 by JonF, posted 01-19-2019 11:18 AM JonF has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 515 by JonF, posted 01-19-2019 11:53 AM Faith has not yet responded
 Message 516 by JonF, posted 01-19-2019 12:05 PM Faith has not yet responded

  
JonF
Member
Posts: 4470
Joined: 06-23-2003
Member Rating: 3.5


(2)
Message 515 of 1055 (847216)
01-19-2019 11:53 AM
Reply to: Message 514 by Faith
01-19-2019 11:22 AM


Re: George Will misses the point
The point is that his supporters think he should be hurting other Americans.

quote:
"I am proud to shut down the government for border security," Trump told Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer and House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi last week, in front of TV cameras at the White House.

"Because the people of this country don't want criminals and people that have lots of problems and drugs pouring into our country. So I will take the mantle. I will be the one to shut it down. I'm not going to blame you for it," Trump continued, seemingly oblivious to the fact that he was taking ownership of a potentially costly and unpopular breakdown in federal government operations.


Trump’s called for a shutdown 25 times. He owns this one. Last spring there was a deal for fixing DACA and $25 billion for the wall:he said he would sign it but he didn't. The Senate passed a clean non-wall funding bill 100 to 0; he said he would sign, until Coulter and Limbaugh vetoed it. The House passed the same bill and McConnell won't bring it up. Democratic leadership went to the White House and Trump walked out of the meeting. Maybe we'll see something this afternoon, but so far the shutdown is 100% Republican owned and they're the stonewallers.

Nobody's blamed Trump for any liberal crimes. We only blame him for the crimes \he's committed. Such as suborning perjury, which he's almost certainly done.

Don't claim there's no evidence of his crimes unless you have been briefed by the leakproof Mueller investigation.

BTW the wall won't aff the drug traffic or illegal immigration, there are few if any criminal in the asylum seekers, and not much if any disease. Illegal immigrants are extremely few. The only crisis is the one Trump manufactured.

Edited by JonF, : No reason given.

Edited by JonF, : No reason given.

Edited by JonF, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 514 by Faith, posted 01-19-2019 11:22 AM Faith has not yet responded

  
JonF
Member
Posts: 4470
Joined: 06-23-2003
Member Rating: 3.5


(1)
Message 516 of 1055 (847217)
01-19-2019 12:05 PM
Reply to: Message 514 by Faith
01-19-2019 11:22 AM


Re: George Will misses the point
Here's a graph of border apprehensions from 1970 to 2017. 2018 was a very little bit higher than 2017.

That's a trickle, not a flood.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 514 by Faith, posted 01-19-2019 11:22 AM Faith has not yet responded

  
JonF
Member
Posts: 4470
Joined: 06-23-2003
Member Rating: 3.5


Message 517 of 1055 (847231)
01-19-2019 4:52 PM


Well, now we know. He proposed a compromise the Democrats will probably reject. (Remember they flipped the House running on NO WALL.)

And of course Coulter and Malkin and Cernovich hate it because it's AMNESTY! (Not according to the dictionary definition, but it does stir up the troops.)

Trump’s in a bad position. Anything other than "I get it all and you get nothing" the base won't accept. The Democrats won't accept WALL, or might if they get lots more than this in return.


  
Percy
Member
Posts: 18263
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 4.1


(1)
Message 518 of 1055 (847235)
01-19-2019 5:20 PM
Reply to: Message 512 by Faith
01-19-2019 11:08 AM


Re: George Will misses the point
Faith writes:

So in Message 2718 of the Trump Bashing Thread Percy applauds George Will for his colorful trashing of Trump.

Applauds? You did see that I called it "most harsh," right? You do know that George is a staunch conservative, right? You *did* read the opinion piece, right, and therefore saw the places were he was critical of liberals, such as when he referred to "the unsustainable trajectory of the entitlement state" or that his "media detractors...have sunk to his level of insufferable self-satisfaction by preening about their superiority to someone they consider morally horrifying and intellectually cretinous."

What you also didn't do is mount any defense of Trump against George's characterizations.

The thing is Trump's supporters don't care about such things, don't care about his style at all, and the more he's put down for such irrelevancies the more people rally to his support.

In recognition of the actual facts, such as that Trump's base is not expanding, George puts it a bit differently:

quote:
And as balm for his base, which remains oblivious to his likely contempt for them as sheep who can be effortlessly gulled by preposterous fictions. The tungsten strength of his supporters’ loyalty is as impressive as his indifference to expanding their numbers.

Moving on:

Trump cares about what we care about,...

Well, as I just quoted George saying, Trump's base "remains oblivious to his likely contempt for them." I think what 800,000 federal workers care about, many of whom apparently live paycheck to paycheck, is figuring out how they're going to survive the shutdown. Obviously Trump doesn't care about them. The wall is not going to help TSA workers or IRS workers or air traffic controllers feed their families or pay the rent.

...he really truly cares about restoring America's greatness in the world after Obama's attempts to destroy it,...

Most of the world thinks Trump a buffoon way out of his depth who is being played a fool by Putin and Kim Jong Un.

...he cares about the President's job of protecting American citizens,...

Yeah, he cares so much about you you can't even afford your medicine.

...and his faults don't rise to any level yet that challenges our trust in his dedication to these things.

Just because you're turning a blind eye to his "faults" (far too weak a term for qualities like dishonesty, xenophobia, misogyny and racism, to mention a few) doesn't mean they aren't real.

These are what matter, and if they continue to matter this is what will continue to keep him in the position of the strongest opposition to the Loony Left we've ever had.

If it weren't for Giuliani, Dotty Donald would be the looniest person in government.

The Left has been working feverishly to invent calumnies against him for more than two years now.

Yes, we know you've had your head in the sand for a while now.

We know it is all lying propaganda,...

Yet every time you're asked to describe this "lying propaganda" without lying yourself you come up dry. Your posts have been remarkably fact free, brimming with ad hominem, disdain and error and not much else.

That will be the end of America but we've been expecting it for years anyway. Some are predicting civil war but I don't see the conservative side having that mentality myself.

We survived Nixon, and hopefully we'll survive Trump.

--Percy


This message is a reply to:
 Message 512 by Faith, posted 01-19-2019 11:08 AM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 519 by Faith, posted 01-19-2019 6:14 PM Percy has responded
 Message 520 by Faith, posted 01-19-2019 6:23 PM Percy has acknowledged this reply

    
Faith
Inactive Member


Message 519 of 1055 (847241)
01-19-2019 6:14 PM
Reply to: Message 518 by Percy
01-19-2019 5:20 PM


Re: George Will misses the point
No I have no interest in contradicting anyone's "characterizations" of Trump, what difference would it make? And as I said it's irrelevant to my side of this.

Not sure why it matters that you found the piece too harsh either. And yes I know Will is a "conservative." "So what?" to that too.

I don't care what anyone has to say about what they dislike about Trump's character.

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 518 by Percy, posted 01-19-2019 5:20 PM Percy has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 521 by Percy, posted 01-19-2019 7:39 PM Faith has responded

  
Faith
Inactive Member


Message 520 of 1055 (847242)
01-19-2019 6:23 PM
Reply to: Message 518 by Percy
01-19-2019 5:20 PM


Re: George Will misses the point
We survived Nixon, and hopefully we'll survive Trump.

I don't think we've even actually survived Obama. Trump is a finger in the dike but the damage is great and the incessant pounding of lies and propaganda by Trump's enemies could well finish us off.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 518 by Percy, posted 01-19-2019 5:20 PM Percy has acknowledged this reply

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 18263
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 4.1


Message 521 of 1055 (847249)
01-19-2019 7:39 PM
Reply to: Message 519 by Faith
01-19-2019 6:14 PM


Re: George Will misses the point
Faith writes:

Not sure why it matters that you found the piece too harsh either.

I didn't call it "too harsh." I called it "the most harsh I ever recall him writing." I called this to your attention because you said I "applauded" the piece, which is just you being wrong yet again.

And yes I know Will is a "conservative." "So what?" to that too.

It means Will's criticisms are not based upon political differences.

I don't care what anyone has to say about what they dislike about Trump's character.

Will is yet another conservative calling attention to Trump's character shortcomings, which you are turning a blind eye to.

From your next Message 520:

We survived Nixon, and hopefully we'll survive Trump.

I don't think we've even actually survived Obama. Trump is a finger in the dike but the damage is great and the incessant pounding of lies and propaganda by Trump's enemies could well finish us off.

These are just more fact-free messages from you, long on complaints and totally free of any facts. I notice you didn't respond to how Trump doesn't care about you or the 800,000 unpaid federal workers, indicative of just one of his many character flaws that you somehow don't seem to recognize.

--Percy


This message is a reply to:
 Message 519 by Faith, posted 01-19-2019 6:14 PM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 522 by Faith, posted 01-19-2019 8:00 PM Percy has responded

    
Faith
Inactive Member


Message 522 of 1055 (847251)
01-19-2019 8:00 PM
Reply to: Message 521 by Percy
01-19-2019 7:39 PM


Re: George Will misses the point
I didn't get that you were criticizing Will for being so harsh. You tend to embrace all kinds of harsh stuff against Trump so that wouldn't occur to me. And his being a conservative is meaningless since Trump has lots of "conservative" enemies. Will is just another. They are willing to destroy him over what I consider to be irrelevancies, as I already said, which will destroy the only hope we've had in decades for the continuation of America. And your messages are usually fact-free opinion stuff too, big deal.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 521 by Percy, posted 01-19-2019 7:39 PM Percy has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 523 by Percy, posted 01-20-2019 8:31 AM Faith has responded

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 18263
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 4.1


(1)
Message 523 of 1055 (847264)
01-20-2019 8:31 AM
Reply to: Message 522 by Faith
01-19-2019 8:00 PM


Re: George Will misses the point
Faith writes:

I didn't get that you were criticizing Will for being so harsh.

I wasn't neither applauding nor criticizing Will. I was just noting that his piece was "the most harsh I ever recall him writing." I have now quoted portions criticizing both Trump and liberals. The piece was fairly balanced in its criticisms. You might try reading it sometime, here's the link again: The shabbiest U.S. president ever is an inexpressibly sad specimen

You tend to embrace all kinds of harsh stuff against Trump so that wouldn't occur to me.

I only criticize Trump for acts that deserve criticism, such as those involving racism, bigotry, misogyny, xenophobia, appointing scoundrels and lying. I probably forgot a few. If you'd like me to again provide examples of Trump exhibiting these qualities you need only ask.

And his being a conservative is meaningless since Trump has lots of "conservative" enemies.

Confusing the criticism is that Trump isn't a conservative. He shares a few positions with conservatives, such as anti-abortion, less regulation and lower taxes, but most of his positions are anti-conservative. For instance, he's anti-free trade, anti-NATO, and anti-low deficits. If you're a genuine conservative, what is there in Trump that you like?

Will is just another. They are willing to destroy him over what I consider to be irrelevancies, as I already said, which will destroy the only hope we've had in decades for the continuation of America.

What do you see in Trump that is hopeful?

And your messages are usually fact-free opinion stuff too, big deal.

That's the best you can come up with, an untrue, "Oh yeah! Well so do you!" My messages are full of facts, usually garnered from news articles (not opinion pieces), and often from Fox News so that "head in the sand" conservatives like yourself can't repeat your constant lie of Fake News.

--Percy


This message is a reply to:
 Message 522 by Faith, posted 01-19-2019 8:00 PM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 524 by Faith, posted 01-20-2019 8:49 AM Percy has responded

    
Faith
Inactive Member


Message 524 of 1055 (847265)
01-20-2019 8:49 AM
Reply to: Message 523 by Percy
01-20-2019 8:31 AM


Re: George Will misses the point
You only criticize what deserves being criticized? Gosh, what a concept. Me too. So much for facts, it's all opinion.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 523 by Percy, posted 01-20-2019 8:31 AM Percy has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 525 by Percy, posted 01-20-2019 11:26 AM Faith has responded

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 18263
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 4.1


Message 525 of 1055 (847277)
01-20-2019 11:26 AM
Reply to: Message 524 by Faith
01-20-2019 8:49 AM


Re: George Will misses the point
Faith writes:

You only criticize what deserves being criticized?

Not quoting what I said and instead giving your own truncated version gives a strong misimpression of my meaning. When you say things that create in people's mind an untrue impression, that is lying. Here, again, is what I actually said in Message 523:

quote:
I only criticize Trump for acts that deserve criticism, such as those involving racism, bigotry, misogyny, xenophobia, appointing scoundrels and lying. I probably forgot a few. If you'd like me to again provide examples of Trump exhibiting these qualities you need only ask.

You next say:

So much for facts, it's all opinion.

As you can see, I offered to again provide (because they've been provided before over and over again) the evidence showing how we know Trump is a racist, bigoted, misogynist, xenophobic, lying scoundrel. Would you like me to do that? I'll even use Fox News as my source, assuming their old stuff is searchable.

--Percy


This message is a reply to:
 Message 524 by Faith, posted 01-20-2019 8:49 AM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 526 by Faith, posted 01-20-2019 11:58 AM Percy has responded

    
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