Register | Sign In


Understanding through Discussion


EvC Forum active members: 65 (9162 total)
1 online now:
Newest Member: popoi
Post Volume: Total: 915,819 Year: 3,076/9,624 Month: 921/1,588 Week: 104/223 Day: 2/13 Hour: 0/1


Thread  Details

Email This Thread
Newer Topic | Older Topic
  
Author Topic:   Bible Inerrancy stands against all objections
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1445 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 195 of 232 (847983)
01-30-2019 12:00 AM
Reply to: Message 193 by AZPaul3
01-29-2019 11:30 PM


Re: death penalty and value of life
Well, when things get this upside down there isn't much hope left.
This has nothing to do with any god. This has to do with the blackened heart of the devout.
The black heart in this discussion is yours.
The disturbing thing is how easily a thinking caring loving human being can be turned to evil. Your religion makes it so easy to justify killing another human being and yet call it an act of "love".
Yes, justice is an act of love. To the survivors at least.
Burn the witches at the stake in an act of love to save their mortal souls.
True witchcraft brings demons into our midst, which is a horrific crime. Since the seventies we've probably had millions dropped into our midst from the Eastern religions that flooded in after the sins of the Sixties. However, death doesn't save anyone's soul, only repentance does that. All sinners who repent and put their trust in Christ will be saved for eternity. But murderers nevertheless have to die for their crime as God decreed to Noah, which I quoted above.
Stone the disobedient child/spouse in the name of an eternally loving god.
It is clear from the context I believe you are referring to that the child was a young adult who was a terror to his parents. The priest Eli had disobedient adult sons (an understatement: they raped the women bringing sacrifices to the temple among other thigns) whom he refused to discipline and he lost his own life in consequence. But I can't think of a case of stoning a spouse.
The excuses have been legendary and far to often used. Kill the slayer to avenge the slayer having killed an image of god is just another excuse to shed yet more blood.
Ugh what a disgusting accusation. edit: The Bible isn't the only source of legal reasoning for the death penalty. The Image of God is the Biblical explanation given to Noah, but many other societies have had the death penalty for murder among other things, and I don't know the reasons they give but the value of a human life is probably one of them.
Your religion has made excuses that killed hundreds of millions of people over the centuries and there appears to be no respite in the future.
Wow what a lie. Or just a gross miscalculation based on prejudice? Roman Catholicism did murder fifty million true Christians, however, along with a few million Jews and others. But the nonreligious Communists have killed many more than that and in a lot less time too. It took six hundred years for the Inquisition to rack up the above numbers but only one century for the "utopian" dreams to kill off many more than that.
Your religion, as do all such religions, need to end.
Mine is the true religion. And we know it will never end. Even if you murder all of us on Earth it will not end and you will find yourself facing our God, the true God, at the end of the world.
That won't stop the killing.
Of course not. The Communists outdo all others at murder.
Humans will search out other excuses to do this evil.
Communists kill to get rid of threats to their power, they don't need to search for excuses.
To compares such self-serving murders to the execution of justice shows the typical upside down morality of today's Left.
But religion makes turning love into bloody death far to easy.
Sad how little you know. If you'd stop saying "religion" by which you include Christianity and said "Islam" instead, or "Roman Catholicism," you'd have some justification, but still nothing that comes close to Communism.
I'm certainly sorry to discover how twisted your mind is.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 193 by AZPaul3, posted 01-29-2019 11:30 PM AZPaul3 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 199 by AZPaul3, posted 01-30-2019 8:11 PM Faith has not replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1445 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 200 of 232 (848050)
01-31-2019 4:49 AM
Reply to: Message 172 by GDR
01-28-2019 6:59 PM


Tenets of the faith
It is the Bible that prescribes the death penalty for murder, as I quote above in Message 164, and it is the Bible that also affirms the high value of human life. If you all can't put those two facts together in one coherent philosophy there is something wrong with your heads.
This is simply another example of disregarding Jesus in order to believe in an inerrant Bible.
Would you please explain where you get this kind of thinking? That is, where do you get this idea that Bible inerrancy is really "bibliolatry" and so on. Does N T Wright teach it? The pastor of your church?
I'm sure that your beliefs have all been described here but I don't think I could name them myself so I thought I'd ask. What do you believe about the following:
  • Substitutionary Atonement: That Jesus died on the cross to pay for our sins.
  • That Jesus is God Himself incarnate.
  • That He was conceived of the Holy Spirit and born from the womb of a virgin?
  • That God is a Trinity of One God in Three Persons, Father, Son and Holy Spirit, all one God.
  • Resurrection: That He rose from the dead on the third day and was seen by many of his disciples in a new sort of body.
  • That his resurrection body could go through walls.
  • Ascension: That he actually rose into the air into a cloud. (I think you've pretty clearly said you think this is metaphorical for his going to be with the Father? So you don't think the disciples actually saw him rise into the air?)
  • That Jesus will return to judge the earth.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 172 by GDR, posted 01-28-2019 6:59 PM GDR has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 201 by GDR, posted 01-31-2019 6:35 PM Faith has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1445 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 202 of 232 (848144)
01-31-2019 9:18 PM
Reply to: Message 201 by GDR
01-31-2019 6:35 PM


Re: Tenets of the faith
Would you please explain where you get this kind of thinking? That is, where do you get this idea that Bible inerrancy is really "bibliolatry" and so on. Does N T Wright teach it? The pastor of your church?
Essentially I get it from the Bible.
I wasn't clear. I would like to know what authorities you are acquainted with who believe as you do about the Bible. Is Wright one? Your pastor? Any others?
If we actually respect what God has to say to us through the Scriptures instead of understanding it as if God essentially dictated it, then we understand a coherent narrative that IMHO makes sense of my life and the world.
Only the inerrant Bible can do that.
The ability to reason is a gift from God and I have no doubt that we are intended to use that gift in understanding the scriptures.
Certainly we are to use our reasoning ability but the scriptures are unique in being authored by God so using our reasoning ability to reject what he says is a misuse of our reasoning ability.
  • I don't think you answered my question about substitutionary atonement: Did Jesus' death on the cross pay for the sins of those who believe in Him so that we no longer have to suffer for them ourselves beyond this life, or not? A simple yes or no is all I ask. All the rest may be true or not, all I want is a yes or no to my question. Thanks.
  • that Jesus is God himself incarnate. Please give me a simple yes or no to this one too. thank you.
  • Please also answer whether you believe the man Jesus was born a human being of a virgin mother through the power of God.
  • You appear to be saying "no" to the question of the Trinity but let me be more specific: Is Jesus the Son of the same stuff or "substance" as the Father? What a son would be if begotten by a father? I think what you said about the Holy Spirit is clear enough that you don't even believe he is a person, is that true?
  • Resurrection: check.
  • You SEEM TO be saying you agree that Jesus in his resurrected body did walk through walls. Would you please say yes or no to this. Thank you.
  • Seems to be a "no" to the disciples seeing Jesus bodily rise into a cloud since you say you have no idea what they saw.
  • So I'll put you down for a "no" about the traditional view of Jesus' returning bodily to this earth to judge it all and bring it to an end.
    Actually I find the scriptures to be very ambiguous, requiring a lot of knowledge to understand them.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 201 by GDR, posted 01-31-2019 6:35 PM GDR has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 203 by GDR, posted 02-01-2019 12:52 AM Faith has replied
 Message 232 by GDR, posted 06-26-2019 5:10 PM Faith has not replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1445 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 204 of 232 (848156)
02-01-2019 1:04 AM
Reply to: Message 203 by GDR
02-01-2019 12:52 AM


Re: Tenets of the faith
That's a pretty weasely way of getting out of giving the simple yes or no answers my questions ask for. They do happen to be standard orthodox beliefs that can be answered that simply. "Let your yes be yes and your no be no. All else is of the devil" said Jesus.
Oh, and why does Wright have to know the OT better than the average bear in order to answer my simple questions?
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 203 by GDR, posted 02-01-2019 12:52 AM GDR has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 205 by ringo, posted 02-01-2019 11:06 AM Faith has not replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1445 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 207 of 232 (848294)
02-02-2019 7:17 PM
Reply to: Message 206 by Phat
02-02-2019 4:00 PM


Re: The Road Not Taken
Just a remainder, Phat. We can't be like God the way Satan wanted to be, of course, meaning with His powers, but we ARE told in scripture "Be ye perfect even as your Father in heaven is perfect..." so MORALLY we are to work to be like Him. I know you know this, but in ringo's context it would easily get lost.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 206 by Phat, posted 02-02-2019 4:00 PM Phat has not replied

  
Newer Topic | Older Topic
Jump to:


Copyright 2001-2023 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved

™ Version 4.2
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2024