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Author Topic:   Being offended.
PaulK
Member
Posts: 15370
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 3.3


Message 49 of 381 (845589)
12-17-2018 3:05 PM
Reply to: Message 46 by Stile
12-17-2018 2:52 PM


Re: Respectful Offense
I’ll give you an example. Trump’s assertion that Mexico was

...sending people that have lots of problems, and they’re bringing those problems with us. They’re bringing drugs. They’re bringing crime. They’re rapists...

Some people describe that as stirring up xenophobia. Faith may point out that Trump added “and some, I assume are good people” - but that hardly lessens the demonisation of Mexican immigrants.

I hardly think that an honest person could agree with Faith.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 46 by Stile, posted 12-17-2018 2:52 PM Stile has acknowledged this reply

Replies to this message:
 Message 50 by Faith, posted 12-17-2018 3:12 PM PaulK has responded
 Message 97 by riVeRraT, posted 12-18-2018 11:20 PM PaulK has responded

    
PaulK
Member
Posts: 15370
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 3.3


Message 51 of 381 (845592)
12-17-2018 3:16 PM
Reply to: Message 50 by Faith
12-17-2018 3:12 PM


Re: Respectful Offense
You mean that it is hardly relevant that Trump was encouraging xenophobia ? I think it is highly relevant that you complain about people telling the truth.

Not to mention the fact that Trump was more complimentary about the Nazis and their allies who marched in Charlottesville.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 50 by Faith, posted 12-17-2018 3:12 PM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 54 by Faith, posted 12-17-2018 3:58 PM PaulK has responded
 Message 98 by riVeRraT, posted 12-18-2018 11:23 PM PaulK has responded

    
PaulK
Member
Posts: 15370
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 3.3


Message 60 of 381 (845605)
12-17-2018 4:17 PM
Reply to: Message 54 by Faith
12-17-2018 3:58 PM


Re: Respectful Offense
quote:

Please, go live in Mexico.

And there goes your xenophobia again.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 54 by Faith, posted 12-17-2018 3:58 PM Faith has not yet responded

    
PaulK
Member
Posts: 15370
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 3.3


(1)
Message 106 of 381 (845706)
12-19-2018 12:15 AM
Reply to: Message 97 by riVeRraT
12-18-2018 11:20 PM


Re: Respectful Offense
quote:

Paulk, you are part of the problem.

In other words it isn’t that “PC” culture has gone too far - you want to defend obvious and actual bigotry.

quote:

Your Trump quote is incomplete,

I acknowledged the half-hearted attempt to soften the message in my post.

quote:

you are fake news

You mean that I am telling truths you want suppressed.

quote:

Also, that is not all he has said about the border.

Which really doesn’t matter. The point is not about Trump’s position on the border. The point is that Trump is happy to stir up xenophobia and that many of his supporters lap it up.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 97 by riVeRraT, posted 12-18-2018 11:20 PM riVeRraT has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 128 by riVeRraT, posted 12-21-2018 7:33 AM PaulK has responded

    
PaulK
Member
Posts: 15370
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 3.3


Message 107 of 381 (845707)
12-19-2018 12:22 AM
Reply to: Message 98 by riVeRraT
12-18-2018 11:23 PM


Re: Respectful Offense
quote:

Actually no, both statements were equal, almost to the letter.

Really ? I had in mind Trump’s statement that there were “fine people” on both sides at Charlottesville. That’s more positive than “some, I assume, are good people” - without all the preceding negatives.

And remember that Trump applied the latter to Mexican immigrants in general. I would think that Mexican immigrants, considered as a group, would be rather better than the far right-protestors at Charlottesville.

So, which statement were you thinking of ?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 98 by riVeRraT, posted 12-18-2018 11:23 PM riVeRraT has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 129 by riVeRraT, posted 12-21-2018 7:40 AM PaulK has responded

    
PaulK
Member
Posts: 15370
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 3.3


Message 108 of 381 (845708)
12-19-2018 12:24 AM
Reply to: Message 94 by riVeRraT
12-18-2018 11:06 PM


quote:

I never said I told them about my God. I said I was sharing love

Got any actual examples? After all, you said it happened here.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 94 by riVeRraT, posted 12-18-2018 11:06 PM riVeRraT has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 130 by riVeRraT, posted 12-21-2018 7:41 AM PaulK has responded

    
PaulK
Member
Posts: 15370
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 3.3


(3)
Message 145 of 381 (845813)
12-21-2018 8:54 AM
Reply to: Message 128 by riVeRraT
12-21-2018 7:33 AM


Re: Respectful Offense
quote:

No, I want to defend the RIGHT to be a bigot. That's because it's freedom of speech.

Freedom of speech, then, would seem to include the right to call a bigot a bigot.

quote:

Not to mention, your idea of bigotry, and the actual definition are 2 different things. So it is a fact that what is considered bigotry is subjective, not objective.

Please explain how my idea of bigotry is different from the “actual definition”

quote:

The only ones stiring up xenophobia is the left. Very few people in the US are actually xenophobic. Again, that subjectiveness (more like stupidness) is at play here.

And yet we both know perfectly well that Trump did it, and at least some of his base lapped it up. Are they on the left?

And as we have seen there is an unfortunate amount of racism still around in the US.

quote:

The whole point of this thread is about the subjective differences in what is considered offensive. For years and years, progressives and liberals would always fight against such ideas. What happened? Are we that brainwashed?

Perhaps you should consider the notion that there is more to it than mere offence. That the reason for offence matter. Perhaps also you should consider the faults of those on the Right. Faith takes offence very, very easily - and it hurts her. But apparently you are more interested in a one-sided narrative attacking the Left with little regard for the truth.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 128 by riVeRraT, posted 12-21-2018 7:33 AM riVeRraT has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 190 by riVeRraT, posted 12-21-2018 6:31 PM PaulK has responded

    
PaulK
Member
Posts: 15370
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 3.3


(2)
Message 149 of 381 (845817)
12-21-2018 9:05 AM
Reply to: Message 129 by riVeRraT
12-21-2018 7:40 AM


Re: Respectful Offense
quote:

Can't you even see what you did there?

That is funny coming from you.

quote:

This why the left are being called hypocrites every single day.

Because liars like you want to attribute your faults to those who dare disagree with you.

quote:

You have presumed in every one of your assertions about Trump that he is a xenophobe, a racist, etc. etc.

That is simply false. For all I know Trump is just cynically appealing to xenophobes and racists.

quote:

How is there not a preceding negative this time? Oh I know, because it doesn't suit your narrative and suddenly it's time to throw logic out the window. I would love to make a TV show, "when scientists become witch doctors". Trump also denounced the KKK and white supremacists on multiple occasions, so a preceding negative is a precedent.

In other words there was none. Not in that statement.

quote:

This is why you are fake news. You take things out of context to suit your narrative. To people like me it plays out like a bad "B" movie, and I can no longer take anything you say seriously. Thank God I taught myself how not to be offended.

And so we are back with your lies and hypocrisy.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 129 by riVeRraT, posted 12-21-2018 7:40 AM riVeRraT has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 191 by riVeRraT, posted 12-21-2018 6:34 PM PaulK has responded

    
PaulK
Member
Posts: 15370
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 3.3


Message 150 of 381 (845818)
12-21-2018 9:07 AM
Reply to: Message 130 by riVeRraT
12-21-2018 7:41 AM


In other words, no.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 130 by riVeRraT, posted 12-21-2018 7:41 AM riVeRraT has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 192 by riVeRraT, posted 12-21-2018 6:35 PM PaulK has responded

    
PaulK
Member
Posts: 15370
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 3.3


Message 169 of 381 (845852)
12-21-2018 1:07 PM
Reply to: Message 160 by Faith
12-21-2018 12:27 PM


Re: No one?
quote:

The only legislation I'm aware of is the "legislation" forced on us not by the legislating body but by the Supreme Court that extended marriage to gays. And that has had the repercussion of persecuting Christians asked to provide services for a gay wedding and refuse to do so.

This is inaccurate. The actual prosecutions have been under State laws protecting homosexuals from discrimination. At least one prosecution under those laws preceded the Supreme Court decision, and where there are no such laws there are no prosecutions.

This has been discussed to death here so you can hardly claim ignorance. It seems that your opposition to Gay Rights is the real issue here.

quote:

But beyond legislation there is social persecution too. Tucker Carlson's talk show has been dropped by many advertisers because he said that illegal aliens are making the country "poorer and dirtier."

I suspect that that was just the straw that broke the camel’s back. However, advertisers can hardly be forced to spend money on a show and I very much suspect that you would be all for it if the host was a “Leftist”.

quote:

It's very real to conservatives and Christians, though the Left seems to remain quite blind to it.

If those are the “best” examples you have it’s hardly a serious problem.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 160 by Faith, posted 12-21-2018 12:27 PM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 171 by Faith, posted 12-21-2018 1:09 PM PaulK has responded

    
PaulK
Member
Posts: 15370
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 3.3


Message 174 of 381 (845859)
12-21-2018 1:18 PM
Reply to: Message 171 by Faith
12-21-2018 1:09 PM


Re: No one?
Fighting against the wrong thing is hardly productive. You have made it very clear that you are far more concerned with getting rid of gay marriage than ending the “persecution”.

Which certainly blunts your claim.

As for the advertising boycott of Tucker Carlson, well consider what has happened over the “take a knee” protests. There are many on the Right who object strongly to those, and Trump himself has demanded action to stop the protests. There were even calls to boycott Nike products when they used Colin Kaepernick in an advert. Surely that all counts as Free Speech.

What do you say about that ?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 171 by Faith, posted 12-21-2018 1:09 PM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 176 by Faith, posted 12-21-2018 1:26 PM PaulK has responded

    
PaulK
Member
Posts: 15370
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 3.3


Message 183 of 381 (845869)
12-21-2018 1:42 PM
Reply to: Message 176 by Faith
12-21-2018 1:26 PM


Re: No one?
quote:

Yes it's possible to use freedom of speech in the service of tyranny, that may be the ultimate reason America will collapse and become just another third world cesspool governed by a murdering Antifa general.

What on Earth are you ranting about? Who is “using free speech in the service of tyranny”?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 176 by Faith, posted 12-21-2018 1:26 PM Faith has not yet responded

    
PaulK
Member
Posts: 15370
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 3.3


(2)
Message 197 of 381 (845903)
12-22-2018 12:34 AM
Reply to: Message 190 by riVeRraT
12-21-2018 6:31 PM


Re: Respectful Offense
quote:

Well duh. Just don't go making laws about your idea of bigotry.

That’s funny because your main concern seems to be about silencing any mention of bigotry on the right.

quote:

I already have.

No, you haven’t.

quote:

And there always will be. Racism was on decline from the 70s until Obama took office. It's hardly the problem it was, and the people fighting against it are pussies compared to fighting for it back when it wasn't popular to do so. I know because I have fought against it my whole life. Being against racism in the 70s and 80s was a lot different than today. It's a joke what I see today. Hardly worth the press it gets.

No, I don’t think that’s true. I think that there was a lot of racism there. The hate of a Black man winning the Presidency just made a lot of it more obvious.

quote:

I do.

You certainly haven’t discussed that. Trump stirring up hate against Mexicans is worrying because of the potential for harm - broadly considered - against anyone perceived as Mexican in the US. Offence is hardly the real issue.

quote:

I do. Stop using it as some kind of justification. 2 wrongs do not make a right

You don’t try to discuss the faults of the right. You try to bully me into silence over them with your lies and your hate and your false accusations. And calling for honest discussion rather than political propaganda is hardly claiming that “two wrongs make a right”.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 190 by riVeRraT, posted 12-21-2018 6:31 PM riVeRraT has not yet responded

    
PaulK
Member
Posts: 15370
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 3.3


Message 198 of 381 (845904)
12-22-2018 12:39 AM
Reply to: Message 191 by riVeRraT
12-21-2018 6:34 PM


Re: Respectful Offense
quote:

You really didn't address any of my points with fact. You are just name calling, what you do best and why you aren't taken seriously by me.

Your sole point was to falsely attack me with your hypocritical lies. None of them supported by fact.

Now certainly you may run away because your nasty bullying tactics don’t work, but the very fact that you had to resort to them shows that you take me very seriously.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 191 by riVeRraT, posted 12-21-2018 6:34 PM riVeRraT has not yet responded

    
PaulK
Member
Posts: 15370
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 3.3


(1)
Message 199 of 381 (845905)
12-22-2018 12:42 AM
Reply to: Message 192 by riVeRraT
12-21-2018 6:35 PM


quote:

And again.

I think the fact that you can’t show anywhere that you were genuinely spreading love is proof enough. It’s pretty easy to find examples of hate in your posts here - but not love..


This message is a reply to:
 Message 192 by riVeRraT, posted 12-21-2018 6:35 PM riVeRraT has not yet responded

    
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