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Tangle
Member
Posts: 8769
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 2.8


(2)
Message 16 of 31 (851289)
04-22-2019 9:15 AM
Reply to: Message 14 by Stile
04-22-2019 8:26 AM


Re: The Rant That Faith Will Not Like
Stile writes:
Faith's beliefs, alone, should be respected.
I know that this is the traditional approach but it's really dumb. Faith's beliefs are stupid, superstitious, ignorant and wrong. If she keeps them to herself fine, if she starts pontificating about them they need to be ridiculed not respected.

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona
"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android
"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 14 by Stile, posted 04-22-2019 8:26 AM Stile has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 17 by Theodoric, posted 04-22-2019 9:39 AM Tangle has not replied
 Message 18 by Stile, posted 04-22-2019 9:47 AM Tangle has replied

Tangle
Member
Posts: 8769
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 2.8


(2)
Message 21 of 31 (851303)
04-22-2019 10:32 AM
Reply to: Message 18 by Stile
04-22-2019 9:47 AM


Re: The Rant That Faith Will Not Like
Stile writes:
And I respect...
...and defend .... everyone's ability to pontificate about anything. I think it's important.
Two different concepts.
Sure defend the right to say stupid things. But as far as I'm concerned there no right - or need - to respect either the words or the person saying them.
Notice the difference - here you are disrespecting the ideas that Faith is discussing.
But the line I picked out from Phat's post was accusing Faith of "falling for" her beliefs - that is, it was disrespecting Faith herself for holding beliefs.
I disagree, the words spoken are not independent of the speaker.
It's not possible to respect the speaker of words you find offensive, dangerous stupid or all three. You might respect his right to say them - whilst holding your nose - but you can't dissociate them from the speaker.

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona
"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android
"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 18 by Stile, posted 04-22-2019 9:47 AM Stile has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 23 by Stile, posted 04-22-2019 10:47 AM Tangle has not replied

Tangle
Member
Posts: 8769
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 2.8


(2)
Message 30 of 31 (851319)
04-22-2019 11:50 AM
Reply to: Message 29 by dwise1
04-22-2019 11:39 AM


Re: The Rant That Faith Will Not Like
Faith writes:
Personally held religious beliefs must be respected.
But what does that mean?
I think it means respect the person's right to hold whatever dumb belief they want; not respect the belief itself.

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona
"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android
"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 29 by dwise1, posted 04-22-2019 11:39 AM dwise1 has not replied

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