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Author Topic:   Some states protect women's rights
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 6393
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.8


Message 256 of 283 (856616)
07-01-2019 9:14 PM
Reply to: Message 217 by Sarah Bellum
06-30-2019 4:12 PM


Re: Partial birth abortion is not an accurate term
I did dispute it.

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 217 by Sarah Bellum, posted 06-30-2019 4:12 PM Sarah Bellum has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 260 by Sarah Bellum, posted 07-01-2019 11:24 PM Theodoric has not yet responded

    
Sarah Bellum
Member
Posts: 224
Joined: 05-04-2019
Member Rating: 2.4


Message 257 of 283 (856629)
07-01-2019 10:48 PM
Reply to: Message 231 by ringo
07-01-2019 2:05 PM


Re: Is the fetus a human being? Is it a living creature that we allow you to kill?
On the other hand, although public support for legal abortion is quite high, substantial numbers think favorably of partial-birth abortion bans, so in thinking such laws are "dictatorial" there are many who disagree with you. You might disagree with whether or not such laws should be passed (I personally think they should not be), but calling them "dictatorial" and comparing them to forcing "somebody to carry around an unwanted (and potentially dangerous) body part" is clearly abuse of language.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 231 by ringo, posted 07-01-2019 2:05 PM ringo has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 264 by ringo, posted 07-02-2019 11:52 AM Sarah Bellum has responded

    
Sarah Bellum
Member
Posts: 224
Joined: 05-04-2019
Member Rating: 2.4


Message 258 of 283 (856631)
07-01-2019 10:53 PM
Reply to: Message 234 by AZPaul3
07-01-2019 2:48 PM


Re: Partial birth abortion is not an accurate term
True indeed.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 234 by AZPaul3, posted 07-01-2019 2:48 PM AZPaul3 has acknowledged this reply

    
Sarah Bellum
Member
Posts: 224
Joined: 05-04-2019
Member Rating: 2.4


Message 259 of 283 (856633)
07-01-2019 11:18 PM
Reply to: Message 255 by Theodoric
07-01-2019 9:14 PM


Re: No obligation to let others use your body.
You asked "Still waiting for someone to show a 39 week abortion happening". I gave you an instance. There are others. Sarah Louise Catt, for example (though that was self-induced). That you had to ask me for these examples instead of finding them yourself indicates you haven't really studied the issue, doesn't it?

Now mind you, I didn't say it was widespread. I didn't even say I disagreed with it. I'm just providing you with facts. Like the Casey decision and its implication for post-viability abortions.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 255 by Theodoric, posted 07-01-2019 9:14 PM Theodoric has not yet responded

    
Sarah Bellum
Member
Posts: 224
Joined: 05-04-2019
Member Rating: 2.4


Message 260 of 283 (856635)
07-01-2019 11:24 PM
Reply to: Message 256 by Theodoric
07-01-2019 9:14 PM


Re: Partial birth abortion is not an accurate term
Of course. And there's nothing wrong with your doing so.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 256 by Theodoric, posted 07-01-2019 9:14 PM Theodoric has not yet responded

    
ringo
Member
Posts: 16806
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 3.4


Message 261 of 283 (856711)
07-02-2019 11:39 AM
Reply to: Message 228 by Sarah Bellum
07-01-2019 11:52 AM


Re: Partial birth abortion is not an accurate term
Sarah Bellum writes:

The article says, "In a widely-publicized interview with The New York Times in 1997, Ron Fitzsimmons, executive director of the National Coalition of Abortion Providers, estimated that in the majority of cases, the procedure is performed on a healthy mother and healthy fetus that is 20 weeks or more along in development."


Why does this have to be like pulling teeth? We were talking about partial birth abortions. 20 weeks is nowhere near birth.

I'll get out the vise-grips and try one more time: Is there such a thing as an abortion of a healthy fetus at 39 weeks? That's the only question you're being asked here.


All that are in Hell, choose it. -- CS Lewis
That's just egregiously stupid. -- ringo

This message is a reply to:
 Message 228 by Sarah Bellum, posted 07-01-2019 11:52 AM Sarah Bellum has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 265 by Sarah Bellum, posted 07-02-2019 4:56 PM ringo has responded

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 16806
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 3.4


(2)
Message 262 of 283 (856712)
07-02-2019 11:46 AM
Reply to: Message 249 by Faith
07-01-2019 7:26 PM


Re: Law, Bill promoting late term abortions
Faith writes:

And you don't get to tell me my beliefs are nonsensical, unscriptural, unchristlike and unbiblical.


Yes I do.

Just like you get to tell me I'm an evil leftist liar. But I can show the lurkers that I am not an evil leftist liar.

You could hypothetically show the lurkers that your beliefs are not nonsensical, unscriptural, unchristlike and unbiblical - if they weren't. But they are.

Faith writes:

Sorry, they are what Christians act on and get punished for by this law that requires us to accept gay marriage.


No law forces you to accept gay marriage. The law prescribes what happens if you don't behave in a socially-responsible way.

Your beliefs are entirely your own, no matter how stupid they are, Nobody can force you to accept reality or to be a decent human being. But we will sanction you if you act badly.


All that are in Hell, choose it. -- CS Lewis
That's just egregiously stupid. -- ringo

This message is a reply to:
 Message 249 by Faith, posted 07-01-2019 7:26 PM Faith has not yet responded

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 16806
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 3.4


Message 263 of 283 (856713)
07-02-2019 11:47 AM
Reply to: Message 251 by Faith
07-01-2019 7:34 PM


Re: Law, Bill promoting late term abortions
Faith writes:

God ordained marriage as the union between male and female as one flesh.


No He didn't. You have never been able to back up that claim scripturally.

All that are in Hell, choose it. -- CS Lewis
That's just egregiously stupid. -- ringo

This message is a reply to:
 Message 251 by Faith, posted 07-01-2019 7:34 PM Faith has not yet responded

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 16806
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 3.4


(1)
Message 264 of 283 (856714)
07-02-2019 11:52 AM
Reply to: Message 257 by Sarah Bellum
07-01-2019 10:48 PM


Re: Is the fetus a human being? Is it a living creature that we allow you to kill?
Sarah Bellum writes:

... although public support for legal abortion is quite high, substantial numbers think favorably of partial-birth abortion bans, so in thinking such laws are "dictatorial" there are many who disagree with you.


So what?

Sarah Bellum writes:

You might disagree with whether or not such laws should be passed (I personally think they should not be), but calling them "dictatorial" and comparing them to forcing "somebody to carry around an unwanted (and potentially dangerous) body part" is clearly abuse of language.


Nonsense. I oppose anti-abortion laws because they're dictatorial. Power over a person's body is about as total as it can get, so I definitely stand by the word "dictatorial".

All that are in Hell, choose it. -- CS Lewis
That's just egregiously stupid. -- ringo

This message is a reply to:
 Message 257 by Sarah Bellum, posted 07-01-2019 10:48 PM Sarah Bellum has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 266 by Sarah Bellum, posted 07-02-2019 4:57 PM ringo has responded

  
Sarah Bellum
Member
Posts: 224
Joined: 05-04-2019
Member Rating: 2.4


Message 265 of 283 (856753)
07-02-2019 4:56 PM
Reply to: Message 261 by ringo
07-02-2019 11:39 AM


Re: Partial birth abortion is not an accurate term
From across the pond
quote:
https://www.express.co.uk/...-MP-outrage-at-39-week-abortion

EXCLUSIVE: MP outrage at 39-week abortion

SHOCKED MPs have called for a change to Britain’s “medieval and cruel” abortion laws after a termination was carried out on a baby only days before it was due to be born By Caroline Wheeler PUBLISHED: 00:00, Sun, Jul 13, 2014

It was aborted 39 weeks into pregnancy under guidelines that allow termination where there is a “significant risk” the child will be disabled.

Department of Health figures show that last year a further three abortions were carried out on mothers who were 38 weeks pregnant and two more on women 37 weeks into pregnancy.

Conservative MP Fiona Bruce, co-chair of the All-Party Parliamentary Pro-life Group, said: “I do not understand how we can have a law which allows the life of a baby with a disability to be ended at full term. It is a graphic illustration of society’s inconsistency on disability.

“After birth we work hard to ensure equality, but before birth we have laws to prevent the disabled taking their first breath. This medieval, cruel, discriminatory law must change.”

Labour MP Rob Flello added: “We have a Jekyll and Hyde approach to disability. One one hand the entire country can be united in praise of paralympians. On the other we can permit the abortion of children at nine months simply for the crime of having a disability.

NHS guidelines consider a baby is full-term at 37 weeks, though most women go into labour between 38 and 42 weeks into their pregnancy.

Abortion beyond 24 weeks can only legally be carried out if there is a grave risk to the life of the mother or there is severe foetal abnormality.

Such a procedure routinely involves giving the baby an injection, usually of potassium, into its heart so it dies before the process starts.

Last year there were 190 abortions beyond the 24-week limit, almost 20 per cent up on the previous year.

Most were carried out under a legal definition known as Ground E, where there is “substantial risk that if the child were born it would suffer from such physical or mental abnormalities as to be seriously handicapped”.

Last year a parliamentary commission called for change in the law after hearing rules even allowed abortions at 40 weeks on grounds of disability.

It learned that abortions can be carried out on babies with a cleft lip or club foot, conditions that can be rectified after birth. One doctor reported that on some occasions a wrong diagnosis had been given and the dead foetus was found to have no disability.

So far there has been no official Government response to the report.
IPSO Regulated Copyright ©2019 Express Newspapers. "Daily Express" is a registered trademark. All rights reserved.



This message is a reply to:
 Message 261 by ringo, posted 07-02-2019 11:39 AM ringo has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 267 by ringo, posted 07-02-2019 10:11 PM Sarah Bellum has responded

    
Sarah Bellum
Member
Posts: 224
Joined: 05-04-2019
Member Rating: 2.4


Message 266 of 283 (856755)
07-02-2019 4:57 PM
Reply to: Message 264 by ringo
07-02-2019 11:52 AM


Re: Is the fetus a human being? Is it a living creature that we allow you to kill?
Yes, we're all aware that you stand by your story.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 264 by ringo, posted 07-02-2019 11:52 AM ringo has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 268 by ringo, posted 07-02-2019 10:16 PM Sarah Bellum has responded

    
ringo
Member
Posts: 16806
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 3.4


Message 267 of 283 (856785)
07-02-2019 10:11 PM
Reply to: Message 265 by Sarah Bellum
07-02-2019 4:56 PM


Re: Partial birth abortion is not an accurate term
What part of "healthy" do you not understand? I keep asking for an example of a god damn healthy fetus being aborted at 39 weeks and you keep posting the same thing over and over again about a severely disabled fetus.

All that are in Hell, choose it. -- CS Lewis
That's just egregiously stupid. -- ringo

This message is a reply to:
 Message 265 by Sarah Bellum, posted 07-02-2019 4:56 PM Sarah Bellum has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 269 by Sarah Bellum, posted 07-02-2019 10:36 PM ringo has responded
 Message 271 by vimesey, posted 07-03-2019 6:17 AM ringo has responded

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 16806
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 3.4


Message 268 of 283 (856786)
07-02-2019 10:16 PM
Reply to: Message 266 by Sarah Bellum
07-02-2019 4:57 PM


Re: Is the fetus a human being? Is it a living creature that we allow you to kill?
Sarah Bellum writes:

Yes, we're all aware that you stand by your story.


And "we all" seem to understand the meaning of "dictatorial" - except you.

All that are in Hell, choose it. -- CS Lewis
That's just egregiously stupid. -- ringo

This message is a reply to:
 Message 266 by Sarah Bellum, posted 07-02-2019 4:57 PM Sarah Bellum has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 270 by Sarah Bellum, posted 07-02-2019 10:37 PM ringo has responded

  
Sarah Bellum
Member
Posts: 224
Joined: 05-04-2019
Member Rating: 2.4


Message 269 of 283 (856790)
07-02-2019 10:36 PM
Reply to: Message 267 by ringo
07-02-2019 10:11 PM


Re: Partial birth abortion is not an accurate term
Read the article again. "One doctor reported that on some occasions a wrong diagnosis had been given and the dead foetus was found to have no disability"
This message is a reply to:
 Message 267 by ringo, posted 07-02-2019 10:11 PM ringo has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 272 by ringo, posted 07-03-2019 12:13 PM Sarah Bellum has responded

    
Sarah Bellum
Member
Posts: 224
Joined: 05-04-2019
Member Rating: 2.4


Message 270 of 283 (856791)
07-02-2019 10:37 PM
Reply to: Message 268 by ringo
07-02-2019 10:16 PM


Re: Is the fetus a human being? Is it a living creature that we allow you to kill?
Like I said, you're standing by your story.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 268 by ringo, posted 07-02-2019 10:16 PM ringo has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 273 by ringo, posted 07-03-2019 12:17 PM Sarah Bellum has responded

    
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