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Author Topic:   strange experience at confession
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 5840
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 4.6


Message 20 of 49 (861104)
08-17-2019 4:59 AM
Reply to: Message 19 by Tangle
08-17-2019 3:41 AM


God done it.

Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 19 by Tangle, posted 08-17-2019 3:41 AM Tangle has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 21 by Phat, posted 08-17-2019 5:27 AM AZPaul3 has responded

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 5840
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 4.6


(1)
Message 22 of 49 (861106)
08-17-2019 5:47 AM
Reply to: Message 21 by Phat
08-17-2019 5:27 AM


Re: My 2 cents
No, Thug, we all know nothing can make a person say/do nuttier things than the concept of god.

Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 21 by Phat, posted 08-17-2019 5:27 AM Phat has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 27 by Phat, posted 08-17-2019 2:54 PM AZPaul3 has responded

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 5840
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 4.6


Message 28 of 49 (861122)
08-17-2019 3:12 PM
Reply to: Message 27 by Phat
08-17-2019 2:54 PM


Re: My 2 cents
Then my position is most rational.

Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 27 by Phat, posted 08-17-2019 2:54 PM Phat has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 29 by Phat, posted 08-18-2019 2:31 AM AZPaul3 has responded

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 5840
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 4.6


(1)
Message 32 of 49 (861186)
08-18-2019 10:31 AM
Reply to: Message 29 by Phat
08-18-2019 2:31 AM


Re: My 2 cents
but all you can argue is that there is a lack of evidence,

When does a null result become evidence? When do a thousand null results become a thousand data points of evidence?

not considering that not everything can be evidenced objectively by everyone.

The only consideration is the requirement for objective evidence from those making the claim of god. So far there has been none.

And as above, I contend that the lack of any such evidence spanning literally thousands of years, culture by culture, is itself a most telling body of evidence.

If God didn't exist and if there were no deceiving spirits, your position would be most rational.

Until the requirement for objective evidence of any gods and their deceiving spirit alter egos is shown there can only be the one rational position.

Having said all that let me add...

I am happy for 'a servant of Christ' having found what appears to be some comfort in his deep religious experience.

People find all kinds of solace in all kinds of unevidenced irrational unrealistic ways. Thus is the human condition.

But when, outside there own heads, they use that unevidenced irrational unrealistic way to insistently deny the reality we know with scientific certainty exists in this universe ... then they have entered deeply into Tangle's "nutter" territory.


Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.

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 Message 29 by Phat, posted 08-18-2019 2:31 AM Phat has acknowledged this reply

Replies to this message:
 Message 33 by Faith, posted 08-18-2019 10:35 AM AZPaul3 has responded
 Message 34 by Faith, posted 08-18-2019 11:10 AM AZPaul3 has acknowledged this reply

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 5840
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 4.6


(1)
Message 35 of 49 (861211)
08-18-2019 1:19 PM
Reply to: Message 33 by Faith
08-18-2019 10:35 AM


Re: My 2 cents
The Bible is chock full of such objective evidence.

BS. No such stuff.

All sorts of miracles ...

Hearsay, myth and embellished fairy tales. There is *no* objective evidence in your bible or anywhere else.

If there was you would show us all. You can't.


Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 33 by Faith, posted 08-18-2019 10:35 AM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 36 by Faith, posted 08-18-2019 2:42 PM AZPaul3 has responded

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 5840
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 4.6


(1)
Message 37 of 49 (861236)
08-18-2019 4:18 PM
Reply to: Message 36 by Faith
08-18-2019 2:42 PM


Re: My 2 cents
I don’t have a problem with “objective evidence”. You have the problem with “objective evidence”.

You have not yet grasped the concept that objective evidence is independent of the protagonist. Evidence of any events in your bible can not be objectively verified by any other sources *within* that same bible. “Objective” requires sources outside and independent of your bible.

Millions of people wandering as one large group hither and yon across the Sinai for 40 years would leave marks, clues, evidence of their encampments and travels that should have been found by those archeologists looking for such over the last 200 years and still be there today. THAT would be objective evidence. There is none. The Exodus story is suspect.

If the parting of the Red Sea was real the physical evidence of such a massive movement of water, dry land and the swallowing of Pharaoh’s army would be there. It isn’t. Further, given the geopolitical climate of the times this is supposed to have occurred there would be stories written in numerous other cultures about how Pharaoh got his butt kicked at the Red Sea. Chronicles would have shown up in the histories of the Hittites who just loved recording the foibles of their favorite enemy. THAT would be objective evidence. There is none. The entire Exodus story is bunk.

You think you can dismiss it all because it was written down, but that's nonsensical.

Your bible stories are dismissed as myth and fairy tales not because they are written in your bible, written by the far from disinterested priests, well after the (supposed) events by centuries, but because they are *not* written anywhere else by those who would have written of such miracles had they actually occurred. They are dismissed as myth and fairy tales not because they are written in your bible by your far from disinterested priests well after the (supposed) events by centuries but because the long term physical evidence that would necessarily accompany such miracles have never been found.

Objective evidence is far more restrictive than the willie-nillie treatment you are so moved to support your shaky myths.


Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 36 by Faith, posted 08-18-2019 2:42 PM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 38 by Faith, posted 08-18-2019 5:39 PM AZPaul3 has responded

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 5840
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 4.6


Message 39 of 49 (861243)
08-18-2019 6:22 PM
Reply to: Message 38 by Faith
08-18-2019 5:39 PM


Re: My 2 cents
I kind of think any clues to the encampments in the desert would long since have been erased after almost four thousand years.

Then you would be wrong. That desert preserves everything.

Har Karkom

"Far from disinterested" doesn't mean they lie ...

Not only willfully lie but embellish the past lies of their ancient predecessors. It's human. We have seen it again and again in "far from disinterested" histories from Herodotus to Caesar, Josephus to Ussher.

And "the Fear of God" only serves to exacerbate their delusions.

I realize that isn't going to change your mind.

From reality to fantasy? No thank you.


Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 38 by Faith, posted 08-18-2019 5:39 PM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 40 by Faith, posted 08-18-2019 11:32 PM AZPaul3 has responded

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 5840
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 4.6


(1)
Message 47 of 49 (861260)
08-19-2019 3:38 AM
Reply to: Message 40 by Faith
08-18-2019 11:32 PM


Re: My 2 cents
... and make no mention of evidence of encampments either.

Did you see the list of items they did find on the mountain?

quote:
Following this theory, Emmanuel Anati excavated at the mountain, and discovered that it was a major paleolithic cult centre, with the surrounding plateau covered with shrines, altars, stone circles, stone pillars, and over 40,000 rock engravings.

The paleolithic era ended more than 10,000 years ago. If this desert could preserve stone aged artifacts it most certainly would have preserved the artifacts from the massed wanderings of millions of people only 4000 years ago.

They couldn't mention any evidence of the Exodus encampments because there is none when there should have been. It didn't happen.

Fear of God means fear to violate God's commandment against lying.

That doesn't stop religious people from lying today. Why would you think it would have worked back then?


Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 40 by Faith, posted 08-18-2019 11:32 PM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 48 by Faith, posted 08-19-2019 7:05 AM AZPaul3 has acknowledged this reply

  
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