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Author Topic:   strange experience at confession
a servant of Christ
Inactive Member


Message 1 of 49 (860734)
08-10-2019 10:48 PM


the priest spoke to my sensibilities and the Christ I believe in and worship. However, I was so messed up because of many factors, I merely soaked in his beautiful poetry about Listening to God and and loving yourself and how Christ is love.

he made everybody meditate on the gospel and other readings during mass

i came up with an idea for a gospel-oriented novella.

future is bright i guess

i just wasn't expecting to talk to a "real" priest.

this guy is cerebral, spent time thinking on Christ, and he dispenses the Sacrament of Confession how it's supposed to be done, which is odd and unusual.

i don't know what to say or do.

Confession as a sacrament of Loving Forgiveness, and I'm trying to understand how to grow my relationship to Christ.

There's no plausible reason why I am still on this planet. My life was more fucked than most.

Yet Christ has redeemed my life, and given me active purpose, he's a friend and God has purposefully chosen me.

When Christ says he sifts among the riff-raff for his chosen, he's not kidding.

The Holy Spirit dispensed the sacrament tonight.

the human is a soul that can heal.

evolutionary science negates the human soul, more important than fleshy shells we inhabit.

i have experienced real healing from a religion that is considered primitive and pagan.

Christ has taken me to a place of profound healing and negated the wounds of my past.

i serve the servant God for eternity.

you find happiness when you negate your ego and serve God.

when you love yourself and love others as that too.

when you become smaller than Paul

God has made me great

and I was not meant to be this great.


Replies to this message:
 Message 5 by Stile, posted 08-12-2019 9:52 AM a servant of Christ has responded

  
Adminnemooseus
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Posts: 3894
Joined: 09-26-2002


Message 2 of 49 (860736)
08-10-2019 11:41 PM


Thread Copied from Proposed New Topics Forum
Thread copied here from the strange experience at confession thread in the Proposed New Topics forum.

    
a servant of Christ
Inactive Member


(1)
Message 3 of 49 (860787)
08-11-2019 10:28 PM


of course I came down from the cloud i was on when i wrote this.

i will say that the sacrament of confession is being practiced incorrectly by many priests, and is causing ruination among the faithful.

priests that seem to be correctly dispensing the sacrament are third world priests, especially African priests, and priests connected to an order, like the Marians, for example.

i've had some atrocious confessions at local parishes, which would have caused a lesser man to turn heel on religion in general.

I noticed a user made a thread about the Sacrament.

a common misconception is the "only confess your sins to Christ" argument. although this argument is untrue: James told us to confess to others, the priest's role in confession is that of a representative for God the Father and Christ, and the Spirit has to be present to enable the priest to enact the forgiveness. I am not being forgiven by a priest but by God, through the Divine Mercy of the Son, and the Mysterious conveyance of grace from the Spirit.

Edited by a servant of Christ, : No reason given.

Edited by a servant of Christ, : No reason given.

Edited by a servant of Christ, : No reason given.


Replies to this message:
 Message 4 by Faith, posted 08-11-2019 11:09 PM a servant of Christ has responded

  
Faith
Member
Posts: 32922
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 4 of 49 (860791)
08-11-2019 11:09 PM
Reply to: Message 3 by a servant of Christ
08-11-2019 10:28 PM


We are told to confess "to one another," not to a priest. And historically the confessional has been badly misused as all kinds of personal information is given to priests who don't respect it and can use it against people. And the idea that God needs a human representative is already a horrible violation of the truth. God is there to hear us, no intermediary is required.

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 3 by a servant of Christ, posted 08-11-2019 10:28 PM a servant of Christ has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 7 by Thugpreacha, posted 08-12-2019 10:40 AM Faith has not yet responded
 Message 10 by a servant of Christ, posted 08-12-2019 7:52 PM Faith has responded

    
Stile
Member
Posts: 3846
From: Ontario, Canada
Joined: 12-02-2004
Member Rating: 1.7


(2)
Message 5 of 49 (860805)
08-12-2019 9:52 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by a servant of Christ
08-10-2019 10:48 PM


a servant of Christ writes:

the priest spoke to my sensibilities and the Christ I believe in and worship.

I think it's something you should investigate, then.

Just remember that because something-works-for-you doesn't mean it works for everyone.

In a general sense - I think the idea of confession (talking about the things you did and feel remorse about) is a very human thing to do.
We are a social species.
Because of this we have a very strong sense of "I did something right" or "I did something wrong."
When we feel we have somethings wrong - we often pursue a sense of atonement - a correction for the thing we did wrong.
Confession is a way to provide this for some people.

There are other ways, too.

Finding one that works great for you is excellent.
I think it's an important aspect of mental health.

evolutionary science negates the human soul, more important than fleshy shells we inhabit.

Uh - no, it doesn't.
It simply doesn't focus on the human soul - because it's attempting to focus on evolutionary science.

But it doesn't "negate it" in any sense.
There are plenty of therapeutic "methods of atonement" that take shape based on information we've become aware of due to evolutionary sciences.
They work together.

They may not work for you - but they certainly work for many.

Just find the one that works best for you, and be happy about it.
No need to make false accusations about other things that help other people in different ways to reach the same state of mental health.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by a servant of Christ, posted 08-10-2019 10:48 PM a servant of Christ has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 6 by Thugpreacha, posted 08-12-2019 10:28 AM Stile has responded
 Message 11 by a servant of Christ, posted 08-12-2019 8:04 PM Stile has responded

    
Thugpreacha
Member
Posts: 12805
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 6 of 49 (860810)
08-12-2019 10:28 AM
Reply to: Message 5 by Stile
08-12-2019 9:52 AM


A Sidenote To Stile
Believers...many of them anyway...believe that the best medicine for the human soul is Holy Communion with God. Since you *know* that God doesn't exist, you can preach this whole "works for some but not everyone" mantra. And normally it makes good logical sense. But to some believers it is as if you are preaching/teaching that the secular spirit has every bit as much right to exist in life (in us) as does the Holy Spirit. Which to some is offensive, for it speaks of spiritual dualism rather than Monotheism. But I doubt you understand what I mean. Chris likely does.

Part of the upcoming and ongoing spiritual war on this planet is going to be one side claiming that Jesus is the only way, while the other side essentially says that whatever works for you is cool. If we are wrong that a spiritual war even exists, you have a logical argument. If, on the other hand, we are correct (which you currently have *no* evidence for) You will see the reality intensify. You likely will someday get your evidence that you seek.


Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. ~RC Sproul
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith

You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo

Subjectivism may very well undermine Christianity.
In the same way that "allowing people to choose what they want to be when they grow up" undermines communism.
~Stile


This message is a reply to:
 Message 5 by Stile, posted 08-12-2019 9:52 AM Stile has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 8 by Stile, posted 08-12-2019 10:43 AM Thugpreacha has responded

  
Thugpreacha
Member
Posts: 12805
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


(1)
Message 7 of 49 (860811)
08-12-2019 10:40 AM
Reply to: Message 4 by Faith
08-11-2019 11:09 PM


My 2 cents
Faith writes:

We are told to confess "to one another," not to a priest.

Would you rather confess to the half drunk guy in the last pew who is struggling to find his own way with God?

While I agree that confession should be directed at God, it has been my experience that confessing to another human causes me to open up and get deeper with my own confessions, perhaps because someone is listening. Isn't the priest another human? Likely one who has studied more than I have. And one wouldn't get very far confessing to a secular scientist. They would simply refer you to a psychologist.

Look, I know your misgivings about the Roman Catholic Church. Chris has a brother who is very evangelical...I look forward to having a conversation with them one day soon. Also keep in mind that God has many of his believers in the RCC as well. There is no perfect church. Many Protestant ones are far too political and worldly. They think America is the new Israel.


Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. ~RC Sproul
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith

You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo

Subjectivism may very well undermine Christianity.
In the same way that "allowing people to choose what they want to be when they grow up" undermines communism.
~Stile


This message is a reply to:
 Message 4 by Faith, posted 08-11-2019 11:09 PM Faith has not yet responded

  
Stile
Member
Posts: 3846
From: Ontario, Canada
Joined: 12-02-2004
Member Rating: 1.7


(2)
Message 8 of 49 (860812)
08-12-2019 10:43 AM
Reply to: Message 6 by Thugpreacha
08-12-2019 10:28 AM


Re: A Sidenote To Stile
Thugpreacha writes:

Believers...many of them anyway...believe that the best medicine for the human soul is Holy Communion with God.

This belief, when focused on themselves, can be extremely powerful and beneficial.
I fully support such a belief used in such a way.

This belief, when focused on others, can be extremely powerful - but negative.
I fully denounce such a belief used in such a way.

Since you *know* that God doesn't exist...

Eh - I'd leave this in the other thread where it's context is more easily explained.
I Know That God Does Not Exist
In general, I wouldn't go around saying such a thing. Not that I think it's wrong - but I find it very rude, especially in the presence of believers.

...you can preach this whole "works for some but not everyone" mantra.

Preach?
I don't preach it.
I use it until someone shows to me that it isn't true.
So far - that seems rather impossible. Since, in reality: different strokes for different folks - have you never heard? Do you think it isn't true where religion is concerned?
If you do think it isn't true - the very existence of different religions believed by so many different people disagrees with you.

But to some believers it is as if you are preaching/teaching that the secular spirit has every bit as much right to exist in life (in us) as does the Holy Spirit.

That's exactly what I'm saying.

Which to some is offensive, for it speaks of spiritual dualism rather than Monotheism. But I doubt you understand what I mean. Chris likely does.

I think I understand what you mean - I'm just not sure if you actually understand what you mean.

Don't you think that, maybe, the idea that Monotheism is better than spiritual dualism (or even "non-Monotheism") is offensive to those who don't follow Monotheism?

Why should one group's "feelings of being offended" be taken as higher than another group's?

Why shouldn't we all be focusing on finding a way to live together, in harmony?

Part of the upcoming and ongoing spiritual war on this planet is going to be one side claiming that Jesus is the only way, while the other side essentially says that whatever works for you is cool.

If this happens, then one side will be saying: "Do it our way or it's war!!!!"
And the other side will be saying: "Why can't we all focus on finding a way to live together, in harmony???"

Which side do you find yourself on, again?

If we are wrong that a spiritual war even exists, you have a logical argument. If, on the other hand, we are correct (which you currently have *no* evidence for) You will see the reality intensify.

The war will certainly exist if one side continues to push "Do it our way or it's war!!!!"

Why do you think such a way should be supported over a way of peace?

You likely will someday get your evidence that you seek.

I do not seek war.
I'm on the side of trying to find a way for everyone to live in harmony... not just a select few that believe a select method is best.
I simply won't stand for tyranny - as it only leads to worse wars in the future.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 6 by Thugpreacha, posted 08-12-2019 10:28 AM Thugpreacha has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 9 by a servant of Christ, posted 08-12-2019 7:37 PM Stile has responded
 Message 15 by Thugpreacha, posted 08-13-2019 3:48 PM Stile has responded

    
a servant of Christ
Inactive Member


Message 9 of 49 (860877)
08-12-2019 7:37 PM
Reply to: Message 8 by Stile
08-12-2019 10:43 AM


Re: A Sidenote To Stile
Hebrews 11:1-3 Living Bible (TLB)
11 What is faith? It is the confident assurance that something we want is going to happen. It is the certainty that what we hope for is waiting for us, even though we cannot see it up ahead. 2 Men of God in days of old were famous for their faith.

3 By faith—by believing God—we know that the world and the stars—in fact, all things—were made at God’s command; and that they were all made from things that can’t be seen.[a]


This message is a reply to:
 Message 8 by Stile, posted 08-12-2019 10:43 AM Stile has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 13 by Stile, posted 08-13-2019 8:46 AM a servant of Christ has not yet responded

  
a servant of Christ
Inactive Member


Message 10 of 49 (860878)
08-12-2019 7:52 PM
Reply to: Message 4 by Faith
08-11-2019 11:09 PM


God works through the Sacraments. You must eat my flesh and drink my blood. does this scandalize you?

the catholic church has a monopoly on the body and blood

catholic church is the priesthood of melchizedek, the priests have authority to forgive sins as the apostles were given the authority to forgive sins: “Whose soever sins ye forgive, they are forgiven unto them; whose soever sins ye retain, they are retained” (Jn. 20:23).

of course the catholic church believes in direct confession to God. one can make a perfect act of contrition, we use sacraments because they have authority and power, and because Christ's Divine Mercy lives in the confessional, where burdens are laid to rest.

how can you get better without holding yourself accountable to man and God?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 4 by Faith, posted 08-11-2019 11:09 PM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 12 by Faith, posted 08-12-2019 8:50 PM a servant of Christ has not yet responded

  
a servant of Christ
Inactive Member


Message 11 of 49 (860880)
08-12-2019 8:04 PM
Reply to: Message 5 by Stile
08-12-2019 9:52 AM


evolutionary science can only guess at how, never the whys of existence

This message is a reply to:
 Message 5 by Stile, posted 08-12-2019 9:52 AM Stile has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 14 by Stile, posted 08-13-2019 8:51 AM a servant of Christ has not yet responded

  
Faith
Member
Posts: 32922
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 12 of 49 (860881)
08-12-2019 8:50 PM
Reply to: Message 10 by a servant of Christ
08-12-2019 7:52 PM


Protestants have no problem with the flesh and blood of Jesus, which is given to us in our communion services. Not taken literally of course as it is in the Catholic service.

According to scripture, Melchizedek was a type of Christ Himself, who is called our High Priest, with the same authority. Human priests do not have that same authority.

Isn't it true that only the bread was given to Catholics and not the wine? At least for some period of time?

Protestants also confess, but to each other and to God, not to a priest.

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 10 by a servant of Christ, posted 08-12-2019 7:52 PM a servant of Christ has not yet responded

    
Stile
Member
Posts: 3846
From: Ontario, Canada
Joined: 12-02-2004
Member Rating: 1.7


(1)
Message 13 of 49 (860904)
08-13-2019 8:46 AM
Reply to: Message 9 by a servant of Christ
08-12-2019 7:37 PM


Re: A Sidenote To Stile
a servant of Christ writes:

What is faith? It is the confident assurance that something we want is going to happen. It is the certainty that what we hope for is waiting for us, even though we cannot see it up ahead.

I agree.

Men of God in days of old were famous for their faith.

Sure.
Although I would not mention this - it's not really something to be proud of.
Faith should be a personal thing - not something to become famous for.

By faith—by believing God—we know that the world and the stars—in fact, all things—were made at God’s command; and that they were all made from things that can’t be seen.

This is just wrong.
We have seen how this world (and others) were made.
We have seen how stars were made.
By all checks - everything would proceed and exist just as it does now regardless of whether God exists or not. God isn't required to command anything.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 9 by a servant of Christ, posted 08-12-2019 7:37 PM a servant of Christ has not yet responded

    
Stile
Member
Posts: 3846
From: Ontario, Canada
Joined: 12-02-2004
Member Rating: 1.7


(1)
Message 14 of 49 (860905)
08-13-2019 8:51 AM
Reply to: Message 11 by a servant of Christ
08-12-2019 8:04 PM


a servant of Christ writes:

evolutionary science can only guess at how, never the whys of existence

Of course evolutionary science looks at the whys of existence.

Why are babies born?
Because parents had sex.

Why do parents have sex?
Because they evolved to do so and it allowed them to avoid extinction.

Other "whys" are better explained without evolutionary science or religion, for me.
Religion has never explained a why in it's history. It's provided guesses - but they have generally been overturned as we get more information or otherwise shown themselves to be ineffective.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 11 by a servant of Christ, posted 08-12-2019 8:04 PM a servant of Christ has not yet responded

    
Thugpreacha
Member
Posts: 12805
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 15 of 49 (860926)
08-13-2019 3:48 PM
Reply to: Message 8 by Stile
08-12-2019 10:43 AM


Re: A Sidenote To Stile
Stile writes:

There are plenty of therapeutic "methods of atonement" that take shape based on information we've become aware of due to evolutionary sciences.
They work together.
They may not work for you - but they certainly work for many.
Just find the one that works best for you, and be happy about it.
No need to make false accusations about other things that help other people in different ways to reach the same state of mental health.

This makes me think that if you ever found God, you would accept Him only if He worked for you. The whole idea of you working for Him seems tyrannical in many minds. I guess what I see as a point of contention is your argument regarding equality of "spirits".

To Wit:

thugpreacha writes:

But to some believers it is as if you are preaching/teaching that the secular spirit has every bit as much right to exist in life (in us) as does the Holy Spirit.

stile writes:

That's exactly what I'm saying.

TP writes:

Which to some is offensive, for it speaks of spiritual dualism rather than Monotheism. But I doubt you understand what I mean. Chris likely does.

stile writes:

I think I understand what you mean - I'm just not sure if you actually understand what you mean.

I understand what I believe. One side touts an absolute while the other side advocates "whatever work" or whatever it takes to achieve peace.

stile writes:

Don't you think that, maybe, the idea that Monotheism is better than spiritual dualism (or even "non-Monotheism") is offensive to those who don't follow Monotheism?

Why should one group's "feelings of being offended" be taken as higher than another group's?

Under normal circumstances your argument makes sense. We believe that we are in a spiritual war because many societal values are changing, in our opinion, for the worse. Critics will ask us why we are being authoritarian, judgemental, and warlike. We may well argue that satan is a clever pied piper that is leading the majority down a destructive path which seems good but is not.
Proverbs 14:12 writes:

There is a way that seems right to a man, but its end is the way to death.

The dogma that we have been taught suggests that satan is an angel of light and will attempt to seduce the world through ideologies that seem liberal and progressive but are in reality poisoning humanity. Counter citics will argue that it is our religious beliefs themselves which are the stumbling block towards progress. Many feel that the last days will see the rise of antichrist and that the Body of Christ---the church---will itself be persecuted for taking a hardline stand and not changing with the culture.

Stile writes:

Why shouldn't we all be focusing on finding a way to live together, in harmony?

We can work together. Some of us don't believe that whatever works will in fact be the best solution. We will not compromise simply to achieve peace, because we are afraid that the wrong spirit will be in charge.

Which is why I entertain all viewpoints in this matter. There is, after all, a possibility I may be wrong. I only wish that my opponents would acknowledge that obedience to a Messiah may be the right path. Both sides can imagine the world view of the other side. Our only common enemy would be personified hate/jealousy, greed for power that a potential antichrist would embody. Obedience to a Supreme Being is in now way repressive. (Unless one believes that personified evil does not exist any more than God does)


Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. ~RC Sproul
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith

You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo

Subjectivism may very well undermine Christianity.
In the same way that "allowing people to choose what they want to be when they grow up" undermines communism.
~Stile


This message is a reply to:
 Message 8 by Stile, posted 08-12-2019 10:43 AM Stile has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 16 by Stile, posted 08-14-2019 9:28 AM Thugpreacha has acknowledged this reply
 Message 17 by ringo, posted 08-14-2019 11:25 AM Thugpreacha has acknowledged this reply

  
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