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Author Topic:   strange experience at confession
Stile
Member
Posts: 3846
From: Ontario, Canada
Joined: 12-02-2004
Member Rating: 1.7


(1)
Message 16 of 49 (860943)
08-14-2019 9:28 AM
Reply to: Message 15 by Thugpreacha
08-13-2019 3:48 PM


Re: A Sidenote To Stile
Thugpreacha writes:

This makes me think that if you ever found God, you would accept Him only if He worked for you.

That's right.
If God wanted to do terrible things to good people - that doesn't work for me and I would not accept Him.

Are you saying that would actually work for you?
You would do terrible things to good people just because a God told you too?

That makes me worry for your soul.

The whole idea of you working for Him seems tyrannical in many minds.

Only if He wants to do terrible things to good people.
Who wouldn't agree with that?

I guess what I see as a point of contention is your argument regarding equality of "spirits".

If the Holy Spirit requires submitting to do terrible things to good people - then I whole-heartedly contend that the secular-human-Spirit is waaaaaaay above the Holy Spirit.

One side touts an absolute while the other side advocates "whatever work" or whatever it takes to achieve peace.

I don't advocate "whatever works" or whatever it takes to achieve peace.
I advocate all people living together in harmony.

If anyone's on the side of doing terrible things to good people - I'm against them.
Otherwise, I'm sure we can figure a way to live together.

Under normal circumstances your argument makes sense.

That's a good start

We believe that we are in a spiritual war because many societal values are changing, in our opinion, for the worse.

Can you name one? We may agree more than you think.
Of course - if you think "gays shouldn't get married."
Then you're doing terrible things to good people - and I think you have some soul searching to do. Perhaps you should pray on it.

Critics will ask us why we are being authoritarian, judgemental, and warlike. We may well argue that satan is a clever pied piper that is leading the majority down a destructive path which seems good but is not.

Sounds like you have good intentions.
The road to hell is paved with good intentions - is it not?

I don't care about what you intend.
I care about what you do.

And, if you do terrible things to good people, regardless of your intentions - then my Spirit is obviously much better than yours.
If not - then we have equal Spirits.

Equal Spirits are a good thing.

The dogma that we have been taught suggests that satan is an angel of light and will attempt to seduce the world through ideologies that seem liberal and progressive but are in reality poisoning humanity.

I think it's good (and required) to be vigilant.
Just make sure you're not the one being poisoned.

Many feel that the last days will see the rise of antichrist and that the Body of Christ---the church---will itself be persecuted for taking a hardline stand and not changing with the culture.

Again - if "the culture changes" include doing less terrible things to good people - I'm all for them.
If you're against such things - we will have issues.
If you're all-for such things as well - then we'll get along just fine.

We will not compromise simply to achieve peace, because we are afraid that the wrong spirit will be in charge.

Sounds like a huge, open wound just waiting to be poisoned.
I suggest you pray on it and try to be vigilant on watching for terrible things happening to good people.

There is, after all, a possibility I may be wrong. I only wish that my opponents would acknowledge that obedience to a Messiah may be the right path.

As long as it includes not doing terrible things to good people - I'll be the first to submit!!

Unless one believes that personified evil does not exist any more than God does

I don't really care if "personified" evil exists or not.
I just care if "regular evil" exists - which it does.

Sometimes people do terrible things to good people.
I think this should be fought against wherever and whenever.

If you agree - then we have equal Spirits.
If you disagree - then I'll be watching you very carefully.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 15 by Thugpreacha, posted 08-13-2019 3:48 PM Thugpreacha has acknowledged this reply

    
ringo
Member
Posts: 17292
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 2.5


Message 17 of 49 (860947)
08-14-2019 11:25 AM
Reply to: Message 15 by Thugpreacha
08-13-2019 3:48 PM


Re: A Sidenote To Stile
Phat writes:

We believe that we are in a spiritual war because many societal values are changing, in our opinion, for the worse. Critics will ask us why we are being authoritarian, judgemental, and warlike. We may well argue that satan is a clever pied piper that is leading the majority down a destructive path which seems good but is not.


"We're at war," is often an excuse for throwing morality out the window.

"Come all of you cowboys and don't ever run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns"
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 15 by Thugpreacha, posted 08-13-2019 3:48 PM Thugpreacha has acknowledged this reply

  
a servant of Christ
Inactive Member


Message 18 of 49 (861098)
08-16-2019 11:57 PM


I prayed the rosary under a giant crucifixion scene statuary at the Divine Mercy Shrine.

being around praying priests.

ill-lit national shrine of our lord of divine mercy at 5pm. yet Christ is always illumined.

"Jesus I Trust In You"

protestants create senseless dogmas while catholics bask in the apostolate of Our Lord of Divine Mercy.

Divine Mercy. we have the vocabularly of The Word. protestants are intellectually more vacuous than Christ's tomb

Divine Mercy grafted me to Christ, like a divine estuary, I've been kept alive by divine mercy.

no one on this forum understands divine mercy

and I understand it, but I lack the drive to personally practice its devotions

divine mercy

we exist to serve the less fortunate.

evolutionary science will never tell you that

there's no evolutionary benefit to keeping a mentally damaged person around, is there?

broodmare for future offspring.

grace wraps my soul with Divine Mercy

even under the light of Divine Mercy
Nietzche's Will to Power
maybe Nietzche was the greatest misunderstood Christian since Jesus Christ or Paul

here to serve the disabled

an apostolate of divine mercy to serve the disabled

Edited by a servant of Christ, : Nietzsche


  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 7068
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.5


(1)
Message 19 of 49 (861103)
08-17-2019 3:41 AM


I wonder why so many believers are total nutters?

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


Replies to this message:
 Message 20 by AZPaul3, posted 08-17-2019 4:59 AM Tangle has not yet responded
 Message 23 by Faith, posted 08-17-2019 12:13 PM Tangle has responded

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 4512
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 4.2


Message 20 of 49 (861104)
08-17-2019 4:59 AM
Reply to: Message 19 by Tangle
08-17-2019 3:41 AM


God done it.

Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 19 by Tangle, posted 08-17-2019 3:41 AM Tangle has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 21 by Thugpreacha, posted 08-17-2019 5:27 AM AZPaul3 has responded

  
Thugpreacha
Member
Posts: 12805
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 21 of 49 (861105)
08-17-2019 5:27 AM
Reply to: Message 20 by AZPaul3
08-17-2019 4:59 AM


My 2 cents
And some folks have the audacity to think they could do a better job!

Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. ~RC Sproul
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith

You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo

Subjectivism may very well undermine Christianity.
In the same way that "allowing people to choose what they want to be when they grow up" undermines communism.
~Stile


This message is a reply to:
 Message 20 by AZPaul3, posted 08-17-2019 4:59 AM AZPaul3 has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 22 by AZPaul3, posted 08-17-2019 5:47 AM Thugpreacha has responded

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 4512
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 4.2


(1)
Message 22 of 49 (861106)
08-17-2019 5:47 AM
Reply to: Message 21 by Thugpreacha
08-17-2019 5:27 AM


Re: My 2 cents
No, Thug, we all know nothing can make a person say/do nuttier things than the concept of god.

Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 21 by Thugpreacha, posted 08-17-2019 5:27 AM Thugpreacha has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 27 by Thugpreacha, posted 08-17-2019 2:54 PM AZPaul3 has responded

  
Faith
Member
Posts: 32922
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 23 of 49 (861111)
08-17-2019 12:13 PM
Reply to: Message 19 by Tangle
08-17-2019 3:41 AM


I don't think I understand a word Servant of Christ said.

What's a "nutter?" Someone who believes in the supernatural? Do you have a good definition?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 19 by Tangle, posted 08-17-2019 3:41 AM Tangle has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 24 by Tangle, posted 08-17-2019 12:37 PM Faith has responded

    
Tangle
Member
Posts: 7068
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.5


Message 24 of 49 (861114)
08-17-2019 12:37 PM
Reply to: Message 23 by Faith
08-17-2019 12:13 PM


Faith writes:

What's a "nutter?" [...] Do you have a good definition?

nutter
(nu-tter) n.

1. a crazy person
2. someone who is psychotic

Used in the U.K to describe f#@ked up people
Did you see that guy? What a nutter.


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 23 by Faith, posted 08-17-2019 12:13 PM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 25 by Faith, posted 08-17-2019 12:39 PM Tangle has responded

  
Faith
Member
Posts: 32922
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 25 of 49 (861115)
08-17-2019 12:39 PM
Reply to: Message 24 by Tangle
08-17-2019 12:37 PM


Yeah, well I knew that much. Can you be more specific about people who hold religious beliefs, or more specific yet: about servant of Christ's post?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 24 by Tangle, posted 08-17-2019 12:37 PM Tangle has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 26 by Tangle, posted 08-17-2019 1:25 PM Faith has not yet responded

    
Tangle
Member
Posts: 7068
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.5


Message 26 of 49 (861118)
08-17-2019 1:25 PM
Reply to: Message 25 by Faith
08-17-2019 12:39 PM


Not all people with religious beliefs are nutters - in fact very few of them are - just the real fundies. But my, we've got one here.

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 25 by Faith, posted 08-17-2019 12:39 PM Faith has not yet responded

  
Thugpreacha
Member
Posts: 12805
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 27 of 49 (861120)
08-17-2019 2:54 PM
Reply to: Message 22 by AZPaul3
08-17-2019 5:47 AM


Re: My 2 cents
And someday when people have failed without God, the secular humanists will blame the behavior of the humans in bringing about the tough times rather than the idea that it is a spiritual war and must happen. Yeah I have nutty beliefs. If God didn't exist and if there were no deceiving spirits, your position would be most rational.

Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. ~RC Sproul
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith

You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo

Subjectivism may very well undermine Christianity.
In the same way that "allowing people to choose what they want to be when they grow up" undermines communism.
~Stile


This message is a reply to:
 Message 22 by AZPaul3, posted 08-17-2019 5:47 AM AZPaul3 has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 28 by AZPaul3, posted 08-17-2019 3:12 PM Thugpreacha has responded
 Message 30 by dwise1, posted 08-18-2019 3:24 AM Thugpreacha has acknowledged this reply
 Message 31 by Tangle, posted 08-18-2019 4:13 AM Thugpreacha has acknowledged this reply

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 4512
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 4.2


Message 28 of 49 (861122)
08-17-2019 3:12 PM
Reply to: Message 27 by Thugpreacha
08-17-2019 2:54 PM


Re: My 2 cents
Then my position is most rational.

Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 27 by Thugpreacha, posted 08-17-2019 2:54 PM Thugpreacha has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 29 by Thugpreacha, posted 08-18-2019 2:31 AM AZPaul3 has responded

  
Thugpreacha
Member
Posts: 12805
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 29 of 49 (861146)
08-18-2019 2:31 AM
Reply to: Message 28 by AZPaul3
08-17-2019 3:12 PM


Re: My 2 cents
So you claim, but all you can argue is that there is a lack of evidence, not considering that not everything can be evidenced objectively by everyone. Thus you say we are nutters. Unfortunately, many of us are crazy, carnal, and undisciplined, so we shoot our credibility in the foot...

Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. ~RC Sproul
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith

You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo

Subjectivism may very well undermine Christianity.
In the same way that "allowing people to choose what they want to be when they grow up" undermines communism.
~Stile


This message is a reply to:
 Message 28 by AZPaul3, posted 08-17-2019 3:12 PM AZPaul3 has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 32 by AZPaul3, posted 08-18-2019 10:31 AM Thugpreacha has acknowledged this reply
 Message 49 by ringo, posted 08-19-2019 12:17 PM Thugpreacha has not yet responded

  
dwise1
Member
Posts: 3712
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 4.6


(1)
Message 30 of 49 (861148)
08-18-2019 3:24 AM
Reply to: Message 27 by Thugpreacha
08-17-2019 2:54 PM


Re: My 2 cents
And someday when people have failed without God, ...

And someday when people have failed without Zeus, ...

And someday when people have failed without Wotan (AKA "Odin", who literally gave his right eye in order to learn the secret of the Runes (just for you), ...

And someday when people have failed without Ahura Mazda, the Lord of Light, ...

And someday when people have failed without Krishna, ...

And someday when people have failed without the Tao, ...

And someday when people have failed without Vishnu, ...

And someday when people have failed without Bel and Anu (the actual divine sources of Mosaic Law), ...

And someday when people have failed without any one of the more than thousands of gods that have ever existed (because Man has created them all), ...

 
In your paradigm, you the theist would need to have chosen the one correct god. Because if you were so fuelish as to choose one of the thousands-minus-one of the thousands of possible gods, then your version of the "secular humanist" scenario would never ever come into play. Rather, what would be playing would be your own scenario of people failing without the proper god. And you are completely unable to truly choose that one proper god.

... , the secular humanists will blame the behavior of the humans in bringing about the tough times rather than the idea that it is a spiritual war and must happen.

Of course, you can offer no alternative, since you have to weigh in which to determine which one of the thousands of gods to choose to follow.

But think about this for a moment. In your scenario, the secular humanist is trying to analyze the problem, to determine its cause, and to propose a solution. You instead call for spiritual war and want no other outcome than horrendous bloodshed. Wouldn't it be more rational to try to seek a solution?

Edited by dwise1, : Farking icehole of a censor!

Edited by dwise1, : Damned homophones!


This message is a reply to:
 Message 27 by Thugpreacha, posted 08-17-2019 2:54 PM Thugpreacha has acknowledged this reply

    
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