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Author Topic:   Testing The Christian Apologists
jar
Member
Posts: 32031
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 661 of 666 (869461)
12-30-2019 5:11 PM
Reply to: Message 660 by Thugpreacha
12-30-2019 4:18 PM


forgive does not mean forget
Phat writes:

Secular people are tougher on people who lie or harm others, never again giving them an opportunity to repent or be redeemed.

Not so Phat, but there are steps involved in the act of Confession; first is acknowledging but that is also just the beginning; you must also apologize to those harmed, commit to not making the same error AND also making amends. Ravi and the rest of the Apologists will continue to be known by their fruits and so far there is no evidence that they are marketing some new improved snake oil.


My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios     My Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 660 by Thugpreacha, posted 12-30-2019 4:18 PM Thugpreacha has not yet responded

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 6953
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 2.6


Message 662 of 666 (869462)
12-30-2019 5:41 PM
Reply to: Message 660 by Thugpreacha
12-30-2019 4:18 PM


Re: Who is On The Throne?
Amazing how Ravi never really apologized or took responsibility for his lying. Yet you "forgive" him. How about listening to people that don't lie so you don't have to forgive them for lying to you.

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 660 by Thugpreacha, posted 12-30-2019 4:18 PM Thugpreacha has not yet responded

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 7296
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 2.6


(1)
Message 663 of 666 (869477)
12-31-2019 4:04 AM
Reply to: Message 660 by Thugpreacha
12-30-2019 4:18 PM


Re: Who is On The Throne?
Phat writes:

I'll be honest with you. If Jesus really ment those specific words "sell all you have: for every Christian, I would not follow Him.

Why would he say something he didn’t mean? In an entire life he would have said hundreds of thousands of things, we can reasonably suppose that those few that got written down for posterity - guided by god himself you tell us - are to be taken seriously.

The spirit being weak is always the excuse, us being fallen an’ all, but it truth all that’s happening is a that you’ve hit on an inconvenience in the comforting message that you’d rather wasn’t there so you’ll put it to one side and pretend it’s not really meant.

Just like you push the impossibility of a loving god that allows his children to suffer and die to one side. He moves in mysterious ways my arse.

Humankind has created a god shaped comfort blanket covered in thorns that have to be flattened before it’s of any use. But they keep popping back up don’t they?”


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 660 by Thugpreacha, posted 12-30-2019 4:18 PM Thugpreacha has not yet responded

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 17835
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 2.5


(1)
Message 664 of 666 (869488)
12-31-2019 11:09 AM
Reply to: Message 660 by Thugpreacha
12-30-2019 4:18 PM


Re: Who is On The Throne?
Phat writes:

If Jesus really ment those specific words "sell all you have: for every Christian, I would not follow Him.


If?

If there is an argument against what Jesus said, for God's sake, tell us what it is. If the apologists have a "better" version, tell us what it is.

I'll repeat what I've said many times before:

1. Elijah told the widow to give him the last of her food, even though she believed she and her son would die as a result.

2. Jesus pointed out the widow who gave her last two mites and He applauded her for it.

3. Jesus told the rich man to sell what he had and give to the poor; the rich man responded exactly as you do.

4. The early church at Rome believed that Jesus meant what He said; they pooled all of their resources - and Ananias and Sapphira were struck down by God for holding back.

There is a definite trend in the Bible.

The only counter-argument that you have presented is that Zacchaeus offered half of what he had. (We are not told whether he got away with it.) Do the apologists have a better argument?

Phat writes:

Apologists indeed do get us off the hook, but then we are faced with answering the charges that we have made up our own religion.


You can be as annoyed as you like but I suppose you won't be able to deny it any more.

Phat writes:

Christians forgive their brothers and sisters and an indictment is not a forever thing.


Forgiveness requires repentance. We don't forgive Charles Manson serially every time he murders somebody. He has to stop.

Ravi Zaccharias lies about what the Bible says. You continue to believe his lies. There is no place for forgiveness there.


"If you can keep your head when all about you
Are losing theirs and blaming it on you...."
-- Rudyard Kipling

This message is a reply to:
 Message 660 by Thugpreacha, posted 12-30-2019 4:18 PM Thugpreacha has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 665 by Thugpreacha, posted 01-01-2020 10:29 AM ringo has responded

  
Thugpreacha
Member
Posts: 13571
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.2


Message 665 of 666 (869539)
01-01-2020 10:29 AM
Reply to: Message 664 by ringo
12-31-2019 11:09 AM


Faith Based Reply To Mike The Wizard
Happy New Year, Mike! This coming from Thugzy to "The Wiz". (Shall we research the word, "Wiz"? ) Of course I am not involved in some ancient Indian Blood Cult, but how thoughtful that you noticed! I am up bright and early on this New Years' day primarily because I believe that it is better to start a new year fresh, sober, and enthusiastic rather than end a year high as a kite, sleeping in late on the morning of the New Year. And before we go any further in this reply, I want everyone to note that I am transferring this post and this discussion from a Science Topic, where Stile lays out a basic evidence-based argument on God to the Apologetic Thread. This post will appear in both threads, but I want to draw a clear line between evidence-based thinking and Biblical Inspiration, which our fascinating friend jar trashes as a PT Barnum Circus sideshow.
***************************************************************
To all who seek to reply to this post, I shall offer you two choices.
Faith Based & Apologetic Responses here.
ringo writes:

If there is an argument against what Jesus said, for God's sake, tell us what it is.


***************************************************************
I am replying to you, Ringo but also to Mike The Wiz from our science topic, Here.

Edited by Thugpreacha, : No reason given.


Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. ~RC Sproul
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
~"We, humans, are engaged in an ongoing war of ideologies. I see it in this microcosm of EvC Forum just as I see it in the governments and attitudes of people throughout the world. Take your pick: Oppression or Seduction .
"~Thugpreacha

You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo

“As the fear of God is the beginning of wisdom, so the denial of God is the height of foolishness.”
? R.C. Sproul, Essential Truths of the Christian Faith
"You may not like it, but the dog bites both ankles."~Tangle


This message is a reply to:
 Message 664 by ringo, posted 12-31-2019 11:09 AM ringo has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 666 by ringo, posted 01-01-2020 12:03 PM Thugpreacha has not yet responded

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 17835
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 2.5


Message 666 of 666 (869547)
01-01-2020 12:03 PM
Reply to: Message 665 by Thugpreacha
01-01-2020 10:29 AM


Re: Faith Based Reply To Mike The Wizard
Phat writes:

I am replying to you, Ringo but also to Mike The Wiz from our science topic, Here.


There is no response to me over there.

"I'm Fallen and I can't get up!"

This message is a reply to:
 Message 665 by Thugpreacha, posted 01-01-2020 10:29 AM Thugpreacha has not yet responded

  
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