|
QuickSearch
Thread ▼ Details |
|
Thread Info
|
|
|
Author | Topic: Atheists must appeal to an absolute moral standard when complaining about wrongs. | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
GDR Member (Idle past 97 days) Posts: 5409 From: Sidney, BC, Canada Joined: |
However, I would still go further than that because an even an "intent to help" can be self serving in that it might also be a benefit to the self making the act morally neutral. He has told you, O man, what is good ; And what does the LORD require of you But to do justice, to love kindness, And to walk humbly with your God. Micah 6:8
|
||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Tangle Member Posts: 8050 From: UK Joined: Member Rating: 5.5 |
Well you know, intent is assumed in a moral act. But so long as we agree then fine.
Couldn't care less personally, so long as the act adds to the sum of human wellbeing. In any case, as this is supposed to be about religion, the moral acts of religious people are to further their chances of a happy afterlife. Couldn't be more self-serving than that. At least with an atheist you know their actions are honest in that respect. Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona "Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android "Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
|
||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
GDR Member (Idle past 97 days) Posts: 5409 From: Sidney, BC, Canada Joined: |
I agree with the comment about atheism. In some cases I would agree with your statement about religious people. From a Christian perspective I would say that if someone performs a loving or helpful act to get themselves a benefit in the life to come then it is no longer a moral act. It is simply self serving. He has told you, O man, what is good ; And what does the LORD require of you But to do justice, to love kindness, And to walk humbly with your God. Micah 6:8
|
||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Taq Member Posts: 8460 Joined: Member Rating: 5.9 |
Still using the same definition. Billions of parents have the want and need to protect their children from sexual predators. We can also use our own self reflection and empathy to know that children don't want to be molested, and they lack the maturity to consent. The moral implications are pretty clear as they are based on human wants and needs.
|
||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Stile Member Posts: 4010 From: Ontario, Canada Joined: |
I agree with both blogs, just some clarifications for my own amusement:
I think this depends on your definition of "objective." The standard could be "if you say 'God made me do it' - then it's good. Otherwise, it's bad." The standard could be "if the person affected by the action deems it good - then it's good, if the person affected by the action deems it bad - then it's bad." Of course, if the definition of "objective" implies that the standard as well is provided by some universal law - you are correct. Therefore, I will assume this is what's intended by the phrase "objective morality" here... I just like to provide options and pick nits.
This, I agree with 100%. Just like a subjective wedding is extremely preferable over an objective (arranged..) one.
I think it stems from the revolution of identifying "objective truth" as better than "subjective truth" - the realization that we do not (and cannot) define reality with our thoughts or words. Reality is what it is. I think this sense of "objective truth about physical reality is greater than subjective truth about physical reality" turned into a generality of "objective is better than subjective" because of how pervasive and in-your-face "physical reality" is. But, well, it's something that's very large-scale, and widespread across history.
|
||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Taq Member Posts: 8460 Joined: Member Rating: 5.9 |
For it to be objective we would need to know that what God asks us to do is based on an objective moral code. If God is telling us what to do based on his own subjective judgment, then it is a subjective morality.
What is good or bad is based on the person's subjective needs and wants.
I agree. At the same time, we can also realize that subjective emotions are also important to us, and definitely have their place in the human experience. Requiring an objective reason for everything humans do is not a sustainable goal because we experience the world through our subjective senses and emotions. Being human is being both subjective and objective, and we should embrace that.
|
||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Stile Member Posts: 4010 From: Ontario, Canada Joined: |
Another good point that is always glossed over and not attended to by proponents of "objective morality."
Yes - pretty much the same thing, really. But I like my standard better. ...and this is also kind of required for your statement of the standard as well, really.
Exactly.
|
||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Omnivorous Member (Idle past 356 days) Posts: 3811 From: Adirondackia Joined:
|
Not obviously. Edited by Omnivorous, : No reason given. "If you can keep your head while those around you are losing theirs, you can collect a lot of heads." Homo sum, humani nihil a me alienum puto.
|
||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Theodoric Member (Idle past 65 days) Posts: 7051 From: Northwest, WI, USA Joined: |
I figured this would happen Gospel Preacher has not participated at all since this thread was opened. I would suggest that the thread gets closed down if he is not willing to respond.
Edited by Theodoric, : No reason given. Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts "God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness. If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?
|
||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
jar Member Posts: 33106 From: Texas!! Joined: Member Rating: 3.7 |
Guido is a good kid but likely another Hit-n-Run.
|
||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
AdminPhat Administrator Posts: 1976 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined:
|
If I don't hear from you by November 1st,2019 this topic will be retired.
|
|
|
Do Nothing Button
Copyright 2001-2018 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved
Version 4.0 Beta
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2021