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Author Topic:   White skin and blue eyes origin.
Theodoric
Member (Idle past 6 days)
Posts: 7051
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005


(1)
Message 9 of 73 (866466)
11-11-2019 5:01 PM
Reply to: Message 8 by RAZD
11-11-2019 4:37 PM


Thread done. Time to close.

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 8 by RAZD, posted 11-11-2019 4:37 PM RAZD has acknowledged this reply

Replies to this message:
 Message 10 by Phat, posted 11-12-2019 4:43 AM Theodoric has responded

Theodoric
Member (Idle past 6 days)
Posts: 7051
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005


Message 17 of 73 (866493)
11-12-2019 9:36 AM
Reply to: Message 10 by Phat
11-12-2019 4:43 AM


Re: Impatience Is Not A Virtue
It was simple question, that should have been probably put into the question no debate thread, and it was answered. It is a waste of a thread.
His hypothesis is utterly wrong on so many levels. A simple web search would have found an answer.
"Caucasians" did not come from the breeding and inbreeding of albinos. Case closed.

Ski is a grizzled old atheist like you are, which you would discover had you the patience to stick around his topic long enough to listen.

What does that have to do with anything? His pet theory is wrong he is being shown it is wrong. 15 minutes doing a web search he would have learned he is wrong. Atheists are not one big homogeneous group. I am an equal opportunity critic.
Atheists are not all scientifically literate. They are not all critical thinkers. His FBook post clearly shows he is not a follower of the scientific method.

The question has been answered, he has no more to add to it. If he presents data and evidence to support his pet theory then the thread should continue. Want to bet on whether he presents any?

Now I see he is whining that people put him down. Where is that
? I am reading the thread right now and do not see anyone putting him down. He is being criticized because his pet theory does not stand up to scrutiny. I did not put him down. I simple stated that the thread had been completed very quickly. He obviously did not get the answers he wanted. Did he think he had some sort of epiphany that the scientific community had never thought of?

Our apologies, Ski. This forum does have a heart, but we often fuss and feud like a huge dysfunctional family.

Don't you dare apologize for me for something I did not do. All I stated was the question was answered and no need to continue the thread. If you want to read more into that, then that is your problem not mine.
You need to decide if you are going to be a participant or a moderator. It doesn't work when you play both in a thread.

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 10 by Phat, posted 11-12-2019 4:43 AM Phat has not yet responded

Theodoric
Member (Idle past 6 days)
Posts: 7051
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005


Message 35 of 73 (866554)
11-12-2019 3:09 PM
Reply to: Message 31 by Faith
11-12-2019 2:48 PM


Re: Impatience Is Not A Virtue
And then the New England colonists committed genocide against them.

Here is the only first hand account of this feast, which was not called a thanksgiving.
http://mayflowerhistory.com/letter-winslow-1621

And yes, later on the natives were subject to genocide by the colonists.


Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 31 by Faith, posted 11-12-2019 2:48 PM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 38 by Faith, posted 11-12-2019 3:13 PM Theodoric has responded

Theodoric
Member (Idle past 6 days)
Posts: 7051
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005


Message 36 of 73 (866555)
11-12-2019 3:10 PM
Reply to: Message 33 by PaulK
11-12-2019 3:07 PM


Re: Impatience Is Not A Virtue
Refresh your browser

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 33 by PaulK, posted 11-12-2019 3:07 PM PaulK has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 40 by PaulK, posted 11-12-2019 3:20 PM Theodoric has not yet responded

Theodoric
Member (Idle past 6 days)
Posts: 7051
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005


Message 41 of 73 (866561)
11-12-2019 3:20 PM
Reply to: Message 38 by Faith
11-12-2019 3:13 PM


Re: Impatience Is Not A Virtue
The letter I linked to is the only contemporary record of the event. You can not deny that because it is factually true. The only other mention is by Gov. Bradford in his history, 20 years after the event.
If it is not mentioned in the letter then it is a historical myth. There are no other first hand sources to the event. None. Zip. Zero.

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 38 by Faith, posted 11-12-2019 3:13 PM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 44 by Faith, posted 11-12-2019 3:28 PM Theodoric has responded

Theodoric
Member (Idle past 6 days)
Posts: 7051
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005


Message 42 of 73 (866562)
11-12-2019 3:21 PM
Reply to: Message 37 by Faith
11-12-2019 3:11 PM


Re: Skin Color is inherited and mutated.
This is a science thread. Please take your religion and preaching to the faith forums. It has no place here.

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 37 by Faith, posted 11-12-2019 3:11 PM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 43 by Faith, posted 11-12-2019 3:26 PM Theodoric has not yet responded

Theodoric
Member (Idle past 6 days)
Posts: 7051
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005


Message 46 of 73 (866568)
11-12-2019 3:49 PM
Reply to: Message 44 by Faith
11-12-2019 3:28 PM


Re: Impatience Is Not A Virtue
All I was doing was presenting the original source to all knowledge we have about the celebration that is no referred to as the first Thanksgiving. It was not called that at the time.
I don't give a rat's ass if you read it. It is a very interesting historical nugget that I chose to share. All the ideas we have about what was eaten, what was said and even who was there are for the most part wrong. Any painting you see of this event is wrong.
Use the info if you want or ignore it. I don't care.

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 44 by Faith, posted 11-12-2019 3:28 PM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 47 by Faith, posted 11-12-2019 4:02 PM Theodoric has not yet responded
 Message 49 by Percy, posted 11-12-2019 5:31 PM Theodoric has responded

Theodoric
Member (Idle past 6 days)
Posts: 7051
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005


(1)
Message 50 of 73 (866575)
11-12-2019 5:57 PM
Reply to: Message 49 by Percy
11-12-2019 5:31 PM


Willful ignorance is not a virtue
The persecution complex is large in that group of people and Faith in particular. I was attempting to give some historical background explaining why natives do not get so misty eyed over Thanksgiving. Which in reality is a made up holiday and in reality has nothing to do with the feast at Plimouth plantation.
Faith is proud of her ignorance. She revels in it. She has no desire to rise above her ignorance. But there are a lot of lurkers. If I can help them remove some of their ignorance, I will and I will feel good about it.
I have learned a lot of things I was profoundly ignorant of by participating on this forum. I hope others that participate here have also. I also hope the lurkers have removed some of their own ignorance and have learned from what I and others have posted.

Thank you for providing such a wonderful forum to discuss the myriad of ideas we discuss. At times it feels like I am stepping into a tavern and meeting with the locals when I come here.


Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 49 by Percy, posted 11-12-2019 5:31 PM Percy has acknowledged this reply

Replies to this message:
 Message 51 by Faith, posted 11-12-2019 6:17 PM Theodoric has not yet responded

Theodoric
Member (Idle past 6 days)
Posts: 7051
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005


(2)
Message 60 of 73 (866592)
11-12-2019 8:20 PM
Reply to: Message 58 by Hyroglyphx
11-12-2019 7:44 PM


Re: American Genocide
You are portraying an incorrect fictional view of native tribes pre contact. Most of the native peoples had been knocked back to a brutal stone age existence by disease that was caused by white contact. The Europeans did not make contact with most natives until well after the devastation by disease. Probably the only non tainted contact was Columbus and the first Spanish to land on the mainland. Most native societies pre contact were quite sophisticated. Not only is the concept of noble savage quite in correct, the concept of native american being savages at all is white ethnocentric concept that is probably not true at all.

A very good general book that explores this is
1491: New Revelations of the Americas Before Columbus - Wikipedia

As far as reservations you make big misrepresentation. Land was not given to them. The land they were put on was all that was left to them. It was usually the most inhospitable, least productive and most remote place the government could find. A lot if reservations were not even in the tribes traditional place of living. For this and other reasons it is no wonder why reservations are poverty stricken.

You make some good points about peoples mistaken beliefs, but your beliefs are based on myths and inaccurate information also.

I want to make clear. I am not attacking you or your post. All I am doing is pointing out inaccuracies in your post.


Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 58 by Hyroglyphx, posted 11-12-2019 7:44 PM Hyroglyphx has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 61 by Hyroglyphx, posted 11-12-2019 8:44 PM Theodoric has not yet responded

Theodoric
Member (Idle past 6 days)
Posts: 7051
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005


(2)
Message 69 of 73 (866619)
11-13-2019 9:15 AM
Reply to: Message 64 by Phat
11-13-2019 2:08 AM


Why are not a political moderate
That being said, I remain a moderate because I have personal issues with the collective attitudes of both ideologies.

You are only a moderate compared to people like Faith. You are in actuality very far right. You expect your religion to be granted special privileges, you think you should have more rights than other people and you discriminate against those with more liberal views than your own. You are hard right. The only thing you support that is not right wing is Unions. But I think your beliefs in that are more right than left. You seem to view the union as a means of what does it do for you personally. You do not seem to embrace the overall union ideal of a collective voice to uphold and expand the rights of all workers. It is more of what can it do for you.
Soon, even the poor oppressed terrorists of Islam will be granted rights

Yes even islamic terrorists have rights. The most heinous murderer you can think of has rights. Do christian terrorists have rights? If a person is in the United States of America, no matter who they are, where they come from or what nationality they are, they have rights. Those rights may be different than all the rights a US citizen has, but they have rights.
If they do not have any rights than we are no better than barbarians.

I was quite disappointed how our newest Forum Member was dissuaded from sticking around due to the egos involved here at EvC> You liberals think you own this place. I could boot out any dissident to your approval or close a topic that you deem unworthy, but I'm tired of the lot of you.

Screw you. Show us how the "liberals" mistreated him. Following and understanding basic scientific concepts is not "liberal". You, sir, have gone off the rails. He presented a flawed argument that probably did not deserve it's own thread. He had a wild ass idea with no backing at all. Three posts later it had been answered and shown to be lacking in logic. He himself stated before you even promoted the thread.
I don't have any sources for my assertion

Are we supposed to continue to discuss something that was addressed and dealt with?

How about I propose a thread stating that I think large human feet are the result of human's keeping Neanderthal women as breading stock. My evidence? None. I just think it is cool and makes sense. Would you promote that drivel?
If being an elitist and egoist is not being the dumbest person in the room, than I am guilty. I am an elitist and egoist using those parameters.

Oppression or Seduction through humanism? Neither way is the way that people must learn to form consensus and co-exist.

This is a false dilemma. Those are not the only choices and presenting Humanism as some sort of bogey man is just more of you poisoning the well.

Finally, about my source on "thanksgiving". The source I used does not matter. What is the provenance of the original source material? That is what matters. The most preeminent scholar in the world could post bogus shit on the web. If we want to use that as support for an argument it is important that we understand where that person got that info. My link was to the original writings of a mayflower colonist. The site I linked to does not matter, what matters is I did enough legwork to be satisfied that this is in fact representative of the original letter. The mayflowerhistory site is very reputable, but it's sources must also be vetted. How did I vet the letter? I have known about this letter for years and I am very familiar with the information contained in it. It would be very easy for me to vet it now if I knew nothing about it. Corroborating evidence is the most important. Just like we will see in the impeachment proceedings. I can corroborate this letter on multiple sources. I can see that historians have talked about this letter for many years.
Vetting sources and information takes time. Corroborating take times. If you want the information you present to be respected and considered you must vet and corroborate all the information.
Rant over.


Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 64 by Phat, posted 11-13-2019 2:08 AM Phat has acknowledged this reply

Theodoric
Member (Idle past 6 days)
Posts: 7051
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005


Message 70 of 73 (866620)
11-13-2019 9:17 AM
Reply to: Message 65 by Phat
11-13-2019 2:27 AM


Re: Anti-American Propaganda,
The dollar bill pyramid explains it well.
Jesus was the capstone that the builders (of society) rejected. In its place, they want a capstone of global consensus and unified human wisdom. Which I predict will fail. Thus we have two losing ideologies fighting for control on this planet. Both of them are flawed.

More preaching. Do you have any clue about the rules for the science forums?

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 65 by Phat, posted 11-13-2019 2:27 AM Phat has acknowledged this reply

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