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Author Topic:   Coronavirus and Pandemics
Tangle
Member
Posts: 8093
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.4


Message 22 of 952 (873479)
03-16-2020 3:45 AM
Reply to: Message 21 by coffee_addict
03-16-2020 12:09 AM


Lammy writes:

If allowed to spread like the regular flu, it would be 70,000 x 20 people dead each year.

You are forgetting that this is a new virus which, unlike the flu virus, there is no immunity to either from prior infection or vaccination. So the entire global population is available to it not just a proportion of it.


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 21 by coffee_addict, posted 03-16-2020 12:09 AM coffee_addict has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 23 by jar, posted 03-16-2020 8:33 AM Tangle has not yet responded

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 8093
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.4


Message 107 of 952 (873903)
03-21-2020 6:25 AM
Reply to: Message 106 by Phat
03-21-2020 5:22 AM


Re: My Trip to the Grocery Store
Phat writes:

Could the rapture be far off?

Yes.


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 106 by Phat, posted 03-21-2020 5:22 AM Phat has not yet responded

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 8093
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.4


(1)
Message 124 of 952 (873951)
03-21-2020 6:41 PM


To get back to basics, this is a new virus which H.sapiens have no immunity to. This means that all of us are likely to get it eventually - without intervention.

Here we are being told that 60% will get in the next 12 months and 80% eventually. The question is really about timing. Ideally I would have got it a week or so ago so that if I needed hospital care I'd get it.

Alternatively, I'd go for about 6 months hence when we'd have hit and gone beyond the peak, beds and ventilators are available again and some drugs have been found to be effective. After that it's another 6-12 months hoping for the vaccine.

So, given that option one has already been missed and I have to live my life, I'd go for reasonable and pragmatic precautions and hope for a bit of luck. Getting it is almost certain, getting life threatening symptoms is more unlikely than not getting it at all. We need luck part more than the chance of not getting it and we need the good timing part probably more than either.


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 8093
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.4


Message 142 of 952 (873990)
03-23-2020 9:02 AM
Reply to: Message 141 by Percy
03-23-2020 8:12 AM


Re: Accurate Terminology
Percy writes:

But if the German figure can be confirmed, if coronavirus actually has a far lower mortality rate than currently thought, it would be a major game changer. Business and industry could reopen. Normal life could resume. Depression could be avoided.

Not really.

It's not just the direct mortality rate that's important it's the serious illness rate. If everyone gets this thing within a few months of everyone else, our emergency services will fail and more will die for lack of treatment. Most countries are introducing movement restrictions to slow down the rate of infection in order to protect our health systems.


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 141 by Percy, posted 03-23-2020 8:12 AM Percy has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 145 by Percy, posted 03-23-2020 9:36 AM Tangle has not yet responded

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 8093
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.4


Message 153 of 952 (874025)
03-23-2020 4:45 PM


As of now, the UK is in lockdown.

Wish I'd bought some jigsaws


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


Replies to this message:
 Message 154 by vimesey, posted 03-23-2020 5:37 PM Tangle has not yet responded
 Message 155 by Faith, posted 03-23-2020 5:42 PM Tangle has not yet responded

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 8093
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.4


Message 204 of 952 (874108)
03-25-2020 3:34 AM


If anything good comes out of this at all, it might be that even the Trumpian deluded masses will notice that Trump made a total horlicks of this. Well those that survive it.

This virus doesn't read his tweets or care what garbage he utters, it's got its own agenda and only total isolation can stop it. We're hearing now that New York is now likely to become the epicentre of the disease.

quote:
Today New York Governor Andrew Cuomo said the COVID-19 pandemic case count is doubling every 3 days in his state, as the World Health Organization (WHO) warned that the United States could become the next epicenter of the novel coronavirus, given that the country accounted for 40% of new cases recorded globally over the past 24 hours.

Meanwhile Trump surrounds himself with people that just nod and fiddles as Rome burns - he wants the country "opened up and raring to go by Easter Sunday," He really is a dangerous, self-serving arsehole.


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


Replies to this message:
 Message 206 by Faith, posted 03-25-2020 6:12 AM Tangle has responded
 Message 216 by Percy, posted 03-25-2020 11:03 AM Tangle has not yet responded

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 8093
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.4


Message 208 of 952 (874112)
03-25-2020 7:36 AM
Reply to: Message 206 by Faith
03-25-2020 6:12 AM


Faith writes:

Trump is a great leader, too bad the Left can't see it.

The thing about great leaders is that pretty much everyone agrees that they're great leaders. Otherwise they're just partisan wannabes.

Another prophesy for you Faith, your country will be in a bigger crisis at Easter than it is now. He's a total jerk.


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 206 by Faith, posted 03-25-2020 6:12 AM Faith has not yet responded

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 8093
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.4


Message 232 of 952 (874138)
03-25-2020 5:19 PM
Reply to: Message 231 by Percy
03-25-2020 5:03 PM


Re: interesting article:
My daughter has it.

She was in the front line as a teacher looking after the children of critical workers, so it was as near inevitable as it gets but it's still a shock and a worry. 7 days now to wait.


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 231 by Percy, posted 03-25-2020 5:03 PM Percy has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 233 by Percy, posted 03-25-2020 5:26 PM Tangle has not yet responded
 Message 234 by jar, posted 03-25-2020 5:28 PM Tangle has not yet responded
 Message 236 by vimesey, posted 03-25-2020 6:33 PM Tangle has not yet responded
 Message 237 by AZPaul3, posted 03-25-2020 7:19 PM Tangle has not yet responded
 Message 238 by Faith, posted 03-25-2020 7:29 PM Tangle has not yet responded

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 8093
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.4


Message 247 of 952 (874169)
03-26-2020 9:09 AM
Reply to: Message 245 by Percy
03-26-2020 8:50 AM


Re: interesting article:
This is our guidance

How long to self-isolate

If you have symptoms

If you have symptoms of coronavirus, you'll need to self-isolate for 7 days.

After 7 days:

if you do not have a high temperature, you do not need to self-isolate
if you still have a high temperature, keep self-isolating until your temperature returns to normal

You do not need to self-isolate if you just have a cough after 7 days. A cough can last for several weeks after the infection has gone.

Self-isolation advice - Coronavirus (COVID-19)

Edited by Tangle, : No reason given.


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 245 by Percy, posted 03-26-2020 8:50 AM Percy has acknowledged this reply

Replies to this message:
 Message 248 by Tangle, posted 03-26-2020 9:25 AM Tangle has not yet responded

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 8093
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.4


Message 248 of 952 (874172)
03-26-2020 9:25 AM
Reply to: Message 247 by Tangle
03-26-2020 9:09 AM


Re: interesting article:
The problem we have here is that without the test, we've no way of knowing whether this is COVID or not. The symptoms are similar to colds and flu.

The first symptom was loss of sense of taste and smell and a sniffle - which was enough for the doctor to say highly likely COVID: isolate.

But this was followed later by a running nose, which is not necessarily COVID - in normal times we'd just say it's a cold.

Just have to see what happens next.


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 247 by Tangle, posted 03-26-2020 9:09 AM Tangle has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 249 by Hyroglyphx, posted 03-26-2020 10:30 AM Tangle has not yet responded

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 8093
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.4


Message 260 of 952 (874225)
03-27-2020 7:43 AM


So, now our glorious leader Boris has it and is self-isolating in 10 Downing Street. Probably means a lot of others in our government and senior civil service have too: it's all very democratic.

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 8093
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.4


Message 274 of 952 (874240)
03-27-2020 12:10 PM


My daughter has no fever and no cough, sniffle has gone but still has total lack of taste and smell. Doctor reckons that she's highly likely to have a very mild form of C19. If correct, she's a very, very lucky girl and is now hopefully safe.

She's a bit stir crazy though as she's in solitary confined to her bedroom trying not to infect her partner. Or to expose him as little as possible.

Dr said something interesting - the less exposure the milder the illness. I can think of scenarios of how that might work but I'm sceptical.


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


Replies to this message:
 Message 275 by vimesey, posted 03-27-2020 1:16 PM Tangle has not yet responded
 Message 276 by Coragyps, posted 03-27-2020 1:22 PM Tangle has not yet responded
 Message 278 by jar, posted 03-27-2020 3:26 PM Tangle has not yet responded

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 8093
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.4


(5)
Message 344 of 952 (874377)
03-30-2020 3:36 PM
Reply to: Message 343 by jar
03-30-2020 1:30 PM


Re: Chloroquin and Hydroxychloroquin
My daughter comes out of isolation tomorrow. She still has no smell or taste but for the first time reckons tooth paste tastes of something. She had this loss of smell without a cold - a weird thing. It's not being officially called a symptom that's definitive, but it's becoming clear that it may very well be one.

quote:
By now you will probably be well aware that a cough, shortness of breath or high temperature are warning signs of Covid-19, and anyone who gets them needs to self-isolate for seven days. But another odd symptom seems to be a calling card: a sudden loss of smell, which is not caused by a blocked nose.

The symptom appears to be incredibly common even though it is not yet widely discussed in the UK. More than two-thirds of those with coronavirus in Germany have lost their sense of smell, and 30 per cent of sufferers in South Korea have had anosmia as their main symptom, according to a report from ENT UK, an organisation which represents ear, nose and throat surgeons.

The smell loss associated with coronavirus is different to that which you might get with a normal cold, says Professor Claire Hopkins, president of the British Rhinological Society. “Typically when you have a cold your nose is congested, and therefore no-one is surprised you can’t smell”, she says. “But what’s happening here is there is no nasal obstruction so people are really surprised.”

The best guess of experts so far seems to be that Covid-19 is affecting the smell nerves in the nose. “We have seen evidence showing how the virus has the ability to affect the nerves, and the smell nerves are the only bits that are exposed in a way that no other nerves are”, says Professor Carl Philpott, professor of rhinology at the University of East Anglia. He believes that the virus causes neuronitis, or inflammation of the nerves in the nose, which stops them from performing as they should.

Professor Hopkins adds that the virus could even enter into the brain and cause further effects on the sense of smell, although this is not necessarily something to worry about: “Viral invasion is common but it sounds worse than it is.” She says that many rhinoviruses and coronaviruses which cause the common cold do this.

But no-one is yet completely sure for the reasons for the smell loss. Doing further research at present is difficult, says Professor Philpott: “We would need to examine the noses, and that’s what we’re telling people not to do as it puts the doctor at massive risk.”

Some patients who are reporting smell loss are also saying that they have lost their ability to taste. The likelihood is they are mistaking smell for taste, says Professor Philpott. “When you’re eating 80 per cent of what you appreciate of flavour is the smell, so people think they can’t taste even though they can still get salty, sweet, bitter and sour.”

Some patients are even experiencing dysgeusia: things tasting different to normal. Most people suffering this are describing a “metallic taste”, says Professor Hopkins. “That does suggest other neurological manifestations as you should retain sweet, salty and so on. It suggests there is something going on in your brain potentially.”

The good news is that the coronavirus-induced anosmia looks like it will be temporary; most patients who have reported it so far describe their sense of smell returning within a fortnight says Professor Hopkins.

It could be that smell loss is not the only symptom of coronavirus that the UK is not yet picking up on. Many other countries are not focusing as narrowly on cough and temperature as we are: France’s diagnostic test asks 23 questions which cover sore throat, tiredness and aches, as well as loss of smell and taste. Professor Hopkins has seen some more unusual symptoms herself: “I’ve had a couple of colleagues say they had hearing loss or a burning sensation in their nose.”

The most important thing is to take smell loss seriously as a potential symptom of coronavirus. If you have suddenly lost your sense of smell, you should follow the recommendations for those with a new cough or temperature, says Professor Kumar, and isolate yourself for at least seven days. “For social distancing to work we need to make sure people are not spreading it around”, he says.



Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 343 by jar, posted 03-30-2020 1:30 PM jar has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 345 by jar, posted 03-30-2020 3:41 PM Tangle has not yet responded
 Message 346 by Faith, posted 03-30-2020 4:05 PM Tangle has not yet responded
 Message 348 by Coragyps, posted 03-30-2020 4:09 PM Tangle has not yet responded

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 8093
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.4


Message 458 of 952 (874563)
04-06-2020 8:22 AM


Boris Johnson our Prime Minister was admitted to hospital last night.

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 8093
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.4


(1)
Message 483 of 952 (874698)
04-08-2020 11:10 AM
Reply to: Message 482 by Faith
04-08-2020 10:48 AM


Re: How can countries reopen?
You're not going to die Faith, there's no way god would want you his side of the fence.

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 482 by Faith, posted 04-08-2020 10:48 AM Faith has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 487 by Percy, posted 04-09-2020 7:32 AM Tangle has not yet responded

  
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