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Author Topic:   Coronavirus and Pandemics
Hyroglyphx
Inactive Member


Message 1 of 952 (871386)
02-01-2020 5:57 PM


Seems to me that modern understandings about virology and efforts to contain viruses have recently been able to curb outbreaks when compared to levels that have been previously seen in pandemics such as Spanish Flu, Polio, Tuberculosis, Plague, etc.

And this is not for lack of trying on the part of viruses... SARS, Ebola, MERS, Avian Flu, etc. With how much international travel occurs in between the time of contracting a disease, the incubation period, and when one becomes infectious with or without showing symptoms seems like a global pandemic is inevitable.

And I think if it were not for organizations like the WHO, CDC, and other international equivalents that do nothing else but plan and train for this that we would have already had another pandemic rivaling the size and scope of a the Spanish Flu.

Even with all of our safeguards and modern medicine its too easy for an epidemic to reach the level of a pandemic. There's plenty of reason to be concerned about Coronavirus. While the death rate is marginally low compared to other diseases, the rate has enormous potential to be extremely problematic whether you contract it and die, contract it and live, or never contract it at all. Early estimates have it at about 2-4% rate of death. Low, compared to other strains but its said to be extremely transmittable. Its also a virus so it mutates fairly easily. Probably wouldn't be extraordinary that multiple strains arise from it so that even the people who previously contracted a form it may not have the antibodies to fight the next strain 2-3 years down the line. That's why the Flu is a problem year after year. You may be fortunate enough to have a defense to 2 or 3 versions of it, but not 6 or 7 that have mutated enough to where your body is no longer resistant.

You don't need millions and millions of people to die from it to be a huge problem. Imagine if 30 million people are essentially sick within the span of 6 months. Hospitals would be overwhelmed, supplies low and in some cases out indefinitely, and inadequate treatment would actually increase the death toll. Now think of the impact it has on global commerce and work productivity. Wuhan is shut down. Work is almost nil, they are rationing food and supplies, and everyone is terrified. China is just about the worst place on earth you would want a pandemic to form. They are the largest exporter of goods and international travel comes and goes with one of the highest frequencies on earth. What happens in China reverberates around the globe. If their economy shudders, so does everyone else's.

If travel restrictions and mandatory quarantines aren't seriously and aggressively in place, other nations will face the same challenges.

In any event, I don't need to sell you on why it needs to be curbed... the question for you is how bad do you realistically think this will get? Will it fizzle out like the Ebola scare or is this one going to take longer and infect many more? Is this the big one or just another scare?

Edited by Hyroglyphx, : No reason given.

Edited by Hyroglyphx, : No reason given.


"Reason obeys itself; and ignorance submits to whatever is dictated to it" -- Thomas Paine

  
jar
Member
Posts: 32967
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 2.4


Message 2 of 952 (871388)
02-01-2020 6:14 PM


Corona Virus seems to be very hard to transmit and very seldom fatal.

Do you have any idea of how many people in the US have been sickened during this 2019-2020 Common Flu season?

Take a look at that first before getting worked up over Corona Virus. Right now the most serious symptom of Corona Virus is not having limes.


My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios     My Website: My Website

Replies to this message:
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Hyroglyphx
Inactive Member


(1)
Message 3 of 952 (871393)
02-01-2020 10:13 PM
Reply to: Message 2 by jar
02-01-2020 6:14 PM


Corona Virus seems to be very hard to transmit and very seldom fatal.
Do you have any idea of how many people in the US have been sickened during this 2019-2020 Common Flu season?

Take a look at that first before getting worked up over Corona Virus. Right now the most serious symptom of Corona Virus is not having limes.

The scaremongering headlines are often misleading, but I wouldn't take it lightly either. If virtually all virologists are saying that it poses a considerable health risk than I think that is telling. As to influenza, nobody takes it lightly. Its responsible annually for way more deaths than coronavirus at this point but its also been around a lot longer and more manageable with vaccines to thin out the number of cases.

But I take it you are hedging your bets that it will fizzle out?


"Reason obeys itself; and ignorance submits to whatever is dictated to it" -- Thomas Paine

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 Message 2 by jar, posted 02-01-2020 6:14 PM jar has responded

Replies to this message:
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Coragyps
Member
Posts: 5548
From: Snyder, Texas, USA
Joined: 11-12-2002
Member Rating: 3.9


(3)
Message 4 of 952 (871394)
02-01-2020 10:29 PM


For what it’s worth, Google searches on “Corona beer virus” have apparently been at noticeable levels lately. I prefer Tecate anyway, myself.
Was it George Carlin who made a comment about the intelligence of the “average American”, and that 50% of the population is, by definition, dumber than that?

  
jar
Member
Posts: 32967
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 2.4


Message 5 of 952 (871405)
02-02-2020 10:13 AM
Reply to: Message 3 by Hyroglyphx
02-01-2020 10:13 PM


No, my opinion is based on what little evidence we do have coming from the most effected places. So far even in China the major threat seems to be public reaction rather than the virus itself. The other issue is the utter stupidity of so many Americans and that is the bigger threat. We have had somewhat effective flu vaccines for decades yet there are still utterly stupid Americans that just don't get a shot.

The threat is simply *********.


My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios     My Website: My Website

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RAZD
Member (Idle past 69 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


(1)
Message 6 of 952 (871410)
02-02-2020 11:12 AM


US capability to fight virus jeopardised by Trumpski
quote:
Trump Has Sabotaged America’s Coronavirus Response

As it improvises its way through a public health crisis, the United States has never been less prepared for a pandemic.

For the United States, the answers are especially worrying because the government has intentionally rendered itself incapable. In 2018, the Trump administration fired the government’s entire pandemic response chain of command, including the White House management infrastructure. In numerous phone calls and emails with key agencies across the U.S. government, the only consistent response I encountered was distressed confusion. If the United States still has a clear chain of command for pandemic response, the White House urgently needs to clarify what it is.

In the spring of 2018, the White House pushed Congress to cut funding for Obama-era disease security programs, proposing to eliminate $252 million in previously committed resources for rebuilding health systems in Ebola-ravaged Liberia, Sierra Leone, and Guinea. Under fire from both sides of the aisle, President Donald Trump dropped the proposal to eliminate Ebola funds a month later. But other White House efforts included reducing $15 billion in national health spending and cutting the global disease-fighting operational budgets of the CDC, NSC, DHS, and HHS. And the government’s $30 million Complex Crises Fund was eliminated.

In May 2018, Trump ordered the NSC’s entire global health security unit shut down, calling for reassignment of Rear Adm. Timothy Ziemer and dissolution of his team inside the agency. The month before, then-White House National Security Advisor John Bolton pressured Ziemer’s DHS counterpart, Tom Bossert, to resign along with his team. Neither the NSC nor DHS epidemic teams have been replaced. The global health section of the CDC was so drastically cut in 2018 that much of its staff was laid off and the number of countries it was working in was reduced from 49 to merely 10. Meanwhile, throughout 2018, the U.S. Agency for International Development and its director, Mark Green, came repeatedly under fire from both the White House and Secretary of State Mike Pompeo. And though Congress has so far managed to block Trump administration plans to cut the U.S. Public Health Service Commissioned Corps by 40 percent, the disease-fighting cadres have steadily eroded as retiring officers go unreplaced.


Trump's reason? Because Obama ...

Now I'm not too worried about Corona ... yet. The question is what happens when it mutates to a more lethal form -- we already know it is human/human transmittable -- can the US handle it or will they get help from China ...

Just askin

But Mob Boss Trump will not be concerned about it, he will be busy building his wall ...

Enjoy


we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
Rebel•American•Zen•Deist
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Replies to this message:
 Message 8 by PaulK, posted 02-02-2020 1:39 PM RAZD has responded

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 18801
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 7 of 952 (871416)
02-02-2020 1:33 PM


In Canada we seem to be more concerned about racism against Chinese people. Racists are often not the sharpest tools in the box to begin with but they don't seem to understand that Chinese people who have not been to China recently are less dangerous than non-Chinese people who have not.

"I'm Fallen and I can't get up!"

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 16585
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.5


Message 8 of 952 (871417)
02-02-2020 1:39 PM
Reply to: Message 6 by RAZD
02-02-2020 11:12 AM


Re: US capability to fight virus jeopardised by Trumpski
Don’t worry, you can drink bleach!

I wish I was kidding but apparently the QAnon loons are promoting “Miracle Mineral Solution” as a cure. Which is basically bleach.

This sort of lunacy is dangerous.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 6 by RAZD, posted 02-02-2020 11:12 AM RAZD has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 9 by Hyroglyphx, posted 02-02-2020 10:45 PM PaulK has not yet responded
 Message 10 by Coragyps, posted 02-03-2020 8:33 AM PaulK has not yet responded
 Message 12 by caffeine, posted 02-03-2020 9:32 AM PaulK has responded
 Message 14 by RAZD, posted 02-03-2020 11:57 AM PaulK has not yet responded

  
Hyroglyphx
Inactive Member


Message 9 of 952 (871441)
02-02-2020 10:45 PM
Reply to: Message 8 by PaulK
02-02-2020 1:39 PM


Re: US capability to fight virus jeopardised by Trumpski
Don’t worry, you can drink bleach!
I wish I was kidding but apparently the QAnon loons are promoting “Miracle Mineral Solution” as a cure. Which is basically bleach.

This sort of lunacy is dangerous.

Sounds like a self-correcting problem a la natural selection


"Reason obeys itself; and ignorance submits to whatever is dictated to it" -- Thomas Paine

This message is a reply to:
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Coragyps
Member
Posts: 5548
From: Snyder, Texas, USA
Joined: 11-12-2002
Member Rating: 3.9


Message 10 of 952 (871447)
02-03-2020 8:33 AM
Reply to: Message 8 by PaulK
02-02-2020 1:39 PM


Re: US capability to fight virus jeopardised by Trumpski
MMS is sodium chlorite (notice that t) solution. It gets used some in the oilfield as a cleaner-upper for iron sulfide scale, which can be a pretty big problem out here in West Texas. Aside from the usual safety warnings on this product, users are cautioned to not spill it on dry vegetation. Once the water in the product dries, sodium chlorite can set dry grass on fire. This is typically thought of as Bad Form right next to oil wells.

But as medicine? No problem, apparently.


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jar
Member
Posts: 32967
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 2.4


Message 11 of 952 (871448)
02-03-2020 9:17 AM
Reply to: Message 10 by Coragyps
02-03-2020 8:33 AM


Re: US capability to fight virus jeopardised by Trumpski
Well sodium chloride (notice that d) is just table salt so the only difference is one letter. Do you think folk are to dumb to not notice that they are just different spellings?

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios     My Website: My Website

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caffeine
Member
Posts: 1799
From: Prague, Czech Republic
Joined: 10-22-2008


(2)
Message 12 of 952 (871449)
02-03-2020 9:32 AM
Reply to: Message 8 by PaulK
02-02-2020 1:39 PM


Re: US capability to fight virus jeopardised by Trumpski
I wish I was kidding but apparently the QAnon loons are promoting “Miracle Mineral Solution” as a cure. Which is basically bleach.

For what it's worth, I saw the article you're referencing, and it was a shitty piece of half-arsed journalism. It cited two people, one of whom only mentioned MMS in a quick side connect which, in context, it was not clear whether it was supposed to be taken seriously.

And that's news? A crazy man on Twitter who believes that Hillary Clinton is dead said something crazy? As far as I can tell Q-Anon was mentioned only to use up for paragraphs explaining what it is.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 8 by PaulK, posted 02-02-2020 1:39 PM PaulK has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 13 by PaulK, posted 02-03-2020 11:06 AM caffeine has responded

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 16585
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.5


Message 13 of 952 (871452)
02-03-2020 11:06 AM
Reply to: Message 12 by caffeine
02-03-2020 9:32 AM


Re: US capability to fight virus jeopardised by Trumpski
Jason Sather has quite an online presence and seems to have already been an MMS booster. So, I don’t doubt his part in it.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 12 by caffeine, posted 02-03-2020 9:32 AM caffeine has responded

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RAZD
Member (Idle past 69 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 14 of 952 (871456)
02-03-2020 11:57 AM
Reply to: Message 8 by PaulK
02-02-2020 1:39 PM


Re: US capability to fight virus jeopardised by Trumpski
Don’t worry, you can drink bleach!

I wish I was kidding but apparently the QAnon loons are promoting “Miracle Mineral Solution” as a cure. Which is basically bleach.

Could be one way to reduce stupid in the gene pool ... can they get a blanket Darwin Awards: Evolution In Action

For the greater good?


we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
Rebel•American•Zen•Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 8 by PaulK, posted 02-02-2020 1:39 PM PaulK has not yet responded

  
caffeine
Member
Posts: 1799
From: Prague, Czech Republic
Joined: 10-22-2008


(1)
Message 15 of 952 (871474)
02-03-2020 4:03 PM
Reply to: Message 13 by PaulK
02-03-2020 11:06 AM


Re: US capability to fight virus jeopardised by Trumpski
Jason Sather has quite an online presence and seems to have already been an MMS booster. So, I don’t doubt his part in it.

Couldn't bring myself to dig further to find out his views on the matter. One video was depressing enough. Watching him justify how, when Trump said sane things, it was because he was just lying to appease the ignorant; and when he said something vague it was subtly implying the whackjob nonsense Sather believes in; destroyed my will to continue.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 13 by PaulK, posted 02-03-2020 11:06 AM PaulK has not yet responded

  
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