Morality without God is impossible

This brings up the question as to what you believe that God *does* have anything to do with. I understand that you believe that the "God characters" in the Bible were simply products of human interpretation. I also have heard you say a time or two that you are a believer and that you believe in GOD, God, and god. (Differing aspects of one reality.) But the question, unanswerable in absolute terms, is what we humans believe about what aspects of our lives, interactions, goals, and struggles does God have to do with?

I feel it.(Him) Critics will say that it is all in my imagination, so I have no way of clarifying my point any better. I believe that I can tell a presence (or the perception of this presence) apart from my own imagination. You do have a point though as to how it would ever be proven.

And I bet that you think that every single member of any church who claims to belong to the club does in fact share in the learned behavior and emotion. I personally do not believe this. many don't get it (yet) which I can only conclude that it is(was) not their time. I *do* know that I had been in churches for years before I had my personal epiphany. The fact that the new awareness/feeling lasted strong for at least a year before being defined by me as an inner awareness confirms its reality to me at least. I suppose were I a good scientist I would try and disprove it but there is nothing to be gained through doing that.Unbelief is for me a liability.

Tell that to the Moses character as he stepped out in Faith and parted the sea. Tell that to Abraham as he sacrificed his son. Tell it to Jesus as He allowed Himself to be arrested.You may argue that only actions are connected to reality and that beliefs CAN lead to actions. We shall see.

I trust your learned explanation. I always have trusted your wisdom. You bring up an interesting line of thought, though.
People always hear of the violent cultures of the early Jews and how God commanded them to kill everyone--men, women, and children alike. To me, it was always more about the morality of that culture at that time and in (and at) that point of development rather than it was about blaming the booming voice of God.Why is that not so obvious to these jokers who use such scriptures to point out the fact that the God of our belief is not moral?

I know that you love to point this out as you endlessly criticize the apologists and the preachers within Biblical Christianity--which you call out as fantasy-driven.But in examining your own church (club, if you will) are you also saying that whenever anyone mentions the name of God or even of Jesus that they are at best praying corporately about a fantasy?And I notice that you ducked some of my questions (by calling them irrelevant and thus framing this issue the way that YOU wanted it framed)
so I will ask them again:

... the question as to what you believe that God *does* have anything to do with. And more specifically what your church...your club...believes regarding what God has anything to do with. Is He interactive? Can He listen? Does He ever answer prayer? Or is He like a proud Papa figure...standing silent (symbolically) and watching His children learn to play together, help each other, and grow more spiritually (and practically) mature? In other words, is God simply a figurehead?

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The only way I know to drive out evil from the country is by the constructive method of filling it with good.Calvin Coolidge
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
As the fear of God is the beginning of wisdom, so the denial of God is the height of foolishness.-RC Sproul, Essential Truths of the Christian Faith

- You can safely assume that you've created God in your own image when it turns out that God hates all the same people you do. Anne Lamott
Believe those who are seeking the truth. Doubt those who find it.~Andre Gide

I would add to this question. The early books of the Bible were written by authors reflecting the interpreted reality of those times, correct?
I brought this up to RAZD in Message 26So a followup question would be whether the "chosen people" would have developed any differently had they not centered so much of their cultural expression around the Temple of Yahweh?And would a less proactive God have sufficed? Perhaps a smiling harmless figurehead, such as other cultures have had.

By extension, you could say that the only important thing within the goal(s) of a belief are the actions generated. I just wanted to emphasize the idea (which you taught me) that Morality is an action rather than a belief and that even in your club no God is required.

So would you say that (many) Episcopalians have eliminated religion and attempt to embrace reality?

The only reason your argument carries any weight is if the people of that time were judged through human-centrism. The fact is, they were Theo-centric. You cant snap cuffs on your own sociological conscience. Your problem is that you view these events from a human-centric perspective.

But this is an assumption made by secular humanists. While the ideas about God were written by humans, God the concept is Himself Creator of all things---including humans. God was testing Abraham, so the story goes. If human justice places God no higher of an authority than humans, your argument has merit. Critics would argue that God by definition represented the main authority in those times. Just as presidents enjoy diplomatic immunity for a season, so would God.

You really need to stop exaggerating. "The Bible" can say otherwise. For every genesis 3 scripture that you show me, I can show you 5 scriptures that place God in a unique category above humans. You love your pet arguments, though.Remember "my ways are higher than your ways? Remember "God is not a man that He should lie?"and no, I have not read the Bible thoroughly lately...but it appears that it is you doing the cherry-picking this time.

But that's the character in the book. I'm talking about the real Deity.You cant be a believer simply by testing content. You have to accept the source.

So how are you going to test the "Source" when the book is full of many sources?
How do you construct a God whom you can believe in when you are presented with so many different characters?

By the way, I have been listening to a Bible teacher who has, in fact read the Bible and who talks about Morality and God.
Dr.Joseph Garwood On Morality