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Author Topic:   Biden Our Time: All things Joe Biden
dwise1
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Posts: 4478
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 5.6


(1)
Message 126 of 271 (880389)
08-04-2020 1:02 PM
Reply to: Message 125 by Sarah Bellum
08-04-2020 9:40 AM


I suppose there are lies coming from all parts of the political spectrum. Just as it always has been in politics. Don't you agree?

Not really the same thing, unless you completely ignore a little matter of scale.

In the 2016 campaigns and debates, most prospective candidates and then candidates lied about a quarter of the time. Trump lied at least three-quarters of the time. IOW, Trump lied far more bigly than anybody else, which makes sense because his entire life and "business" career were based almost entirely on constant lies.

During the 2016 debates between Trump and Clinton, I caught a talk radio show (on the Sirius XM Insight channel, most of which has now moved to their Progressive channel) in which the host described having some friends over for a debate-watching party. They played a drinking game in which everybody had to take a drink whenever Trump lied. They very nearly died of alcohol poisoning.

A few of Trump's tells (in poker, a mannerism or tick that exposes your bluff):

  • "That's fake news." That means that it's true.
  • "Witchhunt" That means that he's guilty as sin.
  • He says or tweets something. That means that he's lying.

And the closer we get to the elections, the more he will open up his fire hose of lies.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 125 by Sarah Bellum, posted 08-04-2020 9:40 AM Sarah Bellum has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 127 by Sarah Bellum, posted 08-04-2020 1:21 PM dwise1 has responded
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dwise1
Member
Posts: 4478
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 5.6


(1)
Message 128 of 271 (880398)
08-04-2020 5:59 PM
Reply to: Message 127 by Sarah Bellum
08-04-2020 1:21 PM


Uh, it's an objective and demonstrated fact that Trump lies his ass off constantly. And that the GOP supports him fully in all his illegal and corrupt activities.

Let's turn the question around: who is being truthful?

Our folks face the facts, deal with the facts, and tell us the truth the majority of the time.

Their folks only do so a very small minority of the time.

Who do you want in charge during a crisis?

And I am not a party loyalist, but rather an American who would be willing to vote for whom I believe to be best for the job regardless of party. For decades, I have not seen a single Republican candidate whom I could vote for. For that matter, many life-long Republican voters now feel the same way, so it is not a question of party loyalty, but rather loyalty to the country.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 127 by Sarah Bellum, posted 08-04-2020 1:21 PM Sarah Bellum has acknowledged this reply

  
dwise1
Member
Posts: 4478
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 5.6


Message 144 of 271 (880684)
08-09-2020 12:14 PM
Reply to: Message 141 by Trump won
08-07-2020 5:00 PM


scorched earth policy

That is exactly what we fear, that when Trump loses the election (especially if it's really bigly) and all his attempts to invalidate the results so that he can steal the election fail (also bigly) then he will respond by destroying the country and the world far more than he already has.

We've profiled his mental illness, so we know that he cannot deal with losing like he will -- indeed, we are seeing that play out in real time as his prospects for re-election continue to plummet. He has proven to be a psychopath who does not care what he does in retaliation -- every possible social norm that no sane person would ever even dream of violating, he violates without a single thought three times before breakfast. There are no limits to what he might do. Declare martial law? Order the arrest of his opponents? Launch a nuke at one of his favorite enemies? -- though whether it would be Iran, Angela Merkel, or California, or New York is a toss-up.

The very best that we could hope for would for Trump to pull another Sharpie reality change and plead "sour grapes", that he did not want to be re-elected anyway. Of course, the White House will shift into overdrive destroying as much of the evidence of their criminality as possible. Also, since he will be vulnerable to arrest for his many crimes on Inauguration Day (what are the Las Vegas odds on him not even attending the ceremony?), it is very likely that he will flee the country to escape prosecution. Very likely before Inauguration Day, maybe one last overseas trip that ends with Air Force One landing and staying in Russia (no doubt with as much classified material as Trump could lay his grubby tiny hands on to make a nice present for his beloved Puti).

Remember that 03 November (plus to get all the counts in) will not be the end of this existential nightmare. After his resounding defeat, we will still have to survive nearly 80 days of the most massive and destructive public temper tantrum imaginable. And a scorched earth policy is exactly what a lunatic like Trump would deploy.

flame on, trump. flame on.

And you are going to cheer on the destruction that Trump will cause. Wow. You really have hit rock bottom and now you've started to dig. Why do you hate America so much?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 141 by Trump won, posted 08-07-2020 5:00 PM Trump won has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 145 by Hyroglyphx, posted 08-09-2020 5:39 PM dwise1 has responded
 Message 146 by Trump won, posted 08-10-2020 1:58 PM dwise1 has responded

  
dwise1
Member
Posts: 4478
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 5.6


(1)
Message 147 of 271 (880725)
08-10-2020 2:19 PM
Reply to: Message 146 by Trump won
08-10-2020 1:58 PM


How could you possibly love Jesus or the Christ and at the same time align with Trump who is of the Lord of Lies, thus aligning yourself with Satan?

By aligning with Trump and Satan, in your heart you actually hate God, Christ, and Jesus.

And above all you hate America. Why do you hate America so much that you would love to see it burn?

Who's the real "fake catholic" here? Look in the mirror.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 146 by Trump won, posted 08-10-2020 1:58 PM Trump won has responded

Replies to this message:
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dwise1
Member
Posts: 4478
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 5.6


(1)
Message 149 of 271 (880729)
08-10-2020 5:06 PM
Reply to: Message 145 by Hyroglyphx
08-09-2020 5:39 PM


Re: Catholic school is vicious as Roman Rule
If the Constitution wasn't around to suppress him he would absolutely be a Caligula.

The Constitution can do absolutely no good unless it is enforced, supported, and defended. For that, we need the very institutions that Trump has been systematically destroying.

For a historic example, consider the constitution for the Weimar Republic (1920-1945). It was one of the most enlightened and progressive constitutions and it officially remained in effect throughout the Nazi era (1933-1945). The reason why it did not stop the Nazis is because, once Hitler was able to invoke its emergency powers, it was not enforced.

Our Constitution cannot possibly protect us against Trump unless we enforce it.


This message is a reply to:
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dwise1
Member
Posts: 4478
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 5.6


(1)
Message 166 of 271 (880802)
08-11-2020 7:44 PM
Reply to: Message 145 by Hyroglyphx
08-09-2020 5:39 PM


Re: Catholic school is vicious as Roman Rule
["proudly roman catholic"] is Roman Catholic.... he thinks Roman rule still reigns supreme... you know, the people that murdered Jesus. The people that persecuted the early church? Yeah, those people....

Please bear with this first paragraph or skim through it; my point follows after it. I've been an atheist for about 57 years, ever since I, a recently baptized Protestant (still don't know what denomination it was), started reading the Bible in order to learn what I was supposed to believe, though with the naïve assumption that I was supposed to interpret it literally (which was most likely not part of my church's doctrine). I found what I was reading to be so unbelievable that, since I could not believe it then I should just leave -- which is why I warn parents to not leave their children alone with a bible. Ironically, half a decade later I became a "fellow traveler"of the Jesus Freak Movement whose fundamentalist doctrine was based on interpreting the Bible literally. Needless to say, I really could not believe that! Then about a decade later I discovered that creationism was still around so I started studying it in order to see what they had to say. The rampant dishonesty, falsehoods, lies, deceptions, and everything else that went completely against what I had learned as a Christian pretty much inoculated me against ever beginning to consider Christianity as a valid choice.

My opposition to "creation science" is for slightly complicated reasons: 1) the rude affront to honesty and truthfulness, 2) the unprincipled attack against science education basically for the purpose of destroying it (to quote Slartibartfast, I've always been a big fan of science), 3) the inevitable consequences for honest believers in "creation science" who actually believe that stuff and then learn that it's all nothing but lies (I've read many of their testimonials over the decades, plus I understand that several of our forum members are ex-creationists, having learned better). In addition, I see creationists as trying to walk a narrow tightrope in which they must avoid actually understanding the science that they are misrepresenting, lest they lose their faith to the truth.

My problems with fundamentalism is that I just cannot buy that stuff and I see them misleading themselves in ways that could cost them their faith. In addition, they keep trying to impose their religion on others, which has led to them trying to use the government in that endeavor. My concern with that grew over time and is a large part of my point here.

In the 1980's, Bill Moyers did a PBS show on the Christian Constructionists whose goal was to reconstruct America from a Constitutional Republic to an Old Testament theocracy. The kicker on this was their postmillennialism (Jesus' Thousand Year Rule would come before his Second Coming, hence that 1,000 years would be to prepare the world for His Arrival) versus fundamentalists' premillennialism (Jesus' Thousand Year Rule would come after his Second Coming, hence that event would initiate the Thousand Year Rule ("das Tausandjährige Reich" as per Hitler?)). The fundamentalists (eg, the Radical Religious Right which came into ascendancy in the early years of Reagan and thus sparked the fears of those interested in religious liberty) adopted the political goals of the Christian Reconstructionists, but perverted them to fit their own agenda. For example, the postmillennialist Christian Reconstructionists saw that 1,000 years as a transitional period to educate everybody and bring them around to the point of accepting Old Testament theocracy. For that reason, they invested resources into homeschooling materials in order to raise the next generations of Christian Reconstructionists. OTOH, the premillennialist fundamentalists wanted to immediately seize political power in order to bring about the Second Coming. No gradual educational effort, but rather a raw naked grab for political power. Their support for Israel is along the same lines: set up the "prophesized" conditions for the End of the World (eg, establishing the state of Israel, moving the capital to Jerusalem) and then increase the political instability in the region all in order to bring about Armageddon and the Second Coming.

OK, here's the kicker (which I learned last year is a poker term). All this time I was worried about those crazy fundamentalist Christians, the furthest thing possible from Catholics. But now the problem turns out to be Catholics.

We caught the first whiffs from the Kavanaugh hearings, in which his conservative Catholic views which are antithetical to American values started to come to light.

Now we have the proclamations of William Barr, a reconstructionist Catholic who is doing his utmost to promote the absolute power of the Presidency far beyond what's allowed by the Constitution, all to serve his own Catholic religious agenda.

I had always been so worried about fundamentalist Christians, and now it's the f*cking CATHOLICS who want to destroy America.


This message is a reply to:
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dwise1
Member
Posts: 4478
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 5.6


(2)
Message 168 of 271 (880810)
08-11-2020 8:14 PM
Reply to: Message 150 by Trump won
08-10-2020 11:27 PM


Re: Doing the Job
Biden is patriotic ? I guess to Libs selling out the country is patriotic.

Oh, really?

Trump owes his position to Vladimir Putin. It was Russian interference in the 2016 election that got him into office. And it is Russian interference in the 2020 election that Trump is counting on so desperately.

So just who is selling out his country?

Almost immediately in office, Trump personally handed over classified information to the Russians in the Oval Office. For that very reason, absolutely NOBODY, including foreign intelligence, wants Trump to have any access to classified information at all.

At every single point, Trump has supported Putin against American interests. At every single point.

Biden calls for American elections, et al. Trump calls for supporting Russia in every way possible. Just who is selling out the country here? Duh?

Or are Catholics so completely and utterly anti-American that it is impossible to even begin to try to talk with them?


This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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dwise1
Member
Posts: 4478
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 5.6


Message 201 of 271 (881841)
09-01-2020 5:36 PM
Reply to: Message 196 by Phat
09-01-2020 3:18 PM


Re: Is This True?
I recently was shown by my sister why it is so important that Trump not get back in.
Social Security Cuts Could Happen in 3 Years If Trump's Payroll Tax Break Is Made Permanent.

. . .

If this is part of the Republican Agenda, I wont support it. I need social security or else I will be the homeless guy asking for spare change!

Social Security was created as an anti-poverty program. My understanding of the history is that support for the elderly and disabled was supplied by their extended families (eg, such as existed in farm families), but that social safety net was untangling through a combination of shifting demographics (the predominantly rural US population was moving to the cities, a trend which greatly accelerated in many parts of the world after WWII), farm failures and foreclosures, savings and investments lost in the Crash and the bank failures and the Depression, etc. So Social Security was created to alleviate that problem. Medicare was created in 1965. Both programs are supported solely through payroll taxes completely independent on any other taxes plus the expenses of these programs are not part of the general budget and do not have any effect on the deficit.

And yet the Republicans keep trying to kill these programs (including making such massive cuts in benefits and payroll taxes as to effectively kill them). When Speaker of the House, Paul Ryan frequently railed against and tried to cut these "entitlement programs" (primarily Social Security and Medicare). Right after the Great Republican Tax Scam of 2017, both Ryan and McConnell started freaking out in public over this enormous deficit that we were "suddenly" faced with and both called out for massive cuts to Social Security and Medicare in order to reduce that deficit -- remember that both programs are self-funded and have almost absolutely nothing to do with the deficit*.
 




FOOTNOTE *:

Both Social Security and Medicare are paid for out of payroll taxes. What's left over in both separate programs (even though both are administered by the Social Security Administration) goes into two separate trust funds. The trustees of those funds are required to invest those funds in sound, safe investments, such as US government bonds.

So in effect, the federal government has been borrowing from those two trust funds by selling them bonds. As a result, the federal government owes money to those trust funds which shows up as debt. Government debt shows up in the general budget and hence as part of the deficit. As far as I know, that is the only connection between Social Security & Medicare and the deficit.



Now for the typically Republican self-serving money-grubbing. At a monthly skeptics breakfast (which we've been doing through ZOOM for six months now), one guest was a corporate financial officer (CFO) so I asked him about payroll taxes, specifically how much of is matched by the company. He told me that the company matches each employee's FICA contribution 100% (these payroll taxes are listed on your pay stub either separately as Social Security and Medicare or combined as Federal Insurance Contributions Act tax (FICA) ). That means that when the employee pays 6.2% to FICA (as per your quoted source, though another source below says 7.65%) then the company also pays that same percentage of your pay.

And it does that for each and every employee, which adds up quickly. If you're a large company with hundreds of employees, that can be a lot to pay. If you're a major employer with thousands of employees, then that's easily millions of dollars that you, the cold-blooded capitalist only interested in showing more profit, would love to be able to instead move into the profit column.

So why are the Republicans trying to kill Social Security and Medicare? For purely ideological reasons? If the GOP in the Time of Trump has taught us nothing else, it's that they have no ideology but rather its all about seizing and holding power and money. The big money donors who have bought those politicians want to see FICA go away, so that's what they push for and that's what their politicians push for. That fact that many millions will end up in poverty means nothing to them just so long as they can show a larger profit in the next quarter.

Trump won't do anything unless he will profit from it personally or politically. In the MICE list of ways to recruit and manage espionage assets (Money, Ideology, Coercion, Ego), they will have hooked Trump on money and ego (he has zero ideology and he has no shame so the only coercion they can exert on him would be financial or exposing his criminal and potentially traitorous acts). Since he refused to place his holdings in a blind trust, Trump knows full well which contracts, tax cuts, etc would benefit himself financially and so those are what he pushes or signs in by fiat.

By deferring payroll taxes, Trump stands to personally benefit from millons of dollars in tax cuts. And if he can get reelected, then he can avoid ever paying those deferred taxes back. That's the bottom line: money.

 
This YouTube video explains that: Trump Signs Executive Order To Give Himself Massive Tax Cut, 10 Aug 2020:

Whenever the GOP or Trump are involved, always follow the money.

 




FOOTNOTE **:

One of my university classes was Russian History, which is where I learned about this.

Medieval serfdom was the way of life in Russia for long after it ended in Western Europe. But then in 1861 the Tsar freed the serfs, a move that was comparable to the US' freeing of the slaves.

Part of freeing the serfs was to give them the land that they had been working for their masters. Well, actually their masters sold them that land with special government mortgages that did not require any payments until a final balloon payment came due 60 years later. The idea was that the former serfs would save their profits from farming in order to make that final payment. But what really happened was that their former masters were given all the water rights, and so they would sell water to their former serfs at rates that wiped out any profits from farming.

And now in 1917 that balloon payment that nobody would be able to pay was coming due in another few years, so it was looming very large. Our professor, who had just returned from a 1.5 year sabbatical in the Soviet Union in order to research the Revolution, maintained that this was a contributing factor to support for the Revolution among farmers.

Also note that the Revolution didn't start out Bolshevik (Russian for "majority" because in one minor issue they got a majority vote in the Duma, so they started calling themselves the Majority Party, kind of like our own "Moral Majority"). After the Tsar abdicated, the Duma consisted of a broad spectrum of political groups, each of which had to try to broker a peace with Germany who was making exorbitant demands that no sane government could agree to (the Brest-Litovsk Treaty). When the Bolsheviks' turn came, they agreed to Germany's terms with no intention of honoring the treaty, but rather used the respite it provided to consolidate their power in Russia. Germany's eventual defeat made that treaty moot, though our professor suggested that it was part of the motivation for the exorbitant demands made on Germany in the Treaty of Versailles. Subsequent history research suggests to me that instead it was France's chance for revenge against Germany for the exorbitant reparations that they were forced to pay for the Franco-Prussian War of 1871 in which the Prussians occupied Versailles, from which they both observed Paris tearing itself apart and they announced the formation of the German Empire. While these events created a bitter culture of revenge in the French, the Prussian demands for war reparations were the same ones that Napoleon had imposed upon them, so that was Prussian revenge.



 


This message is a reply to:
 Message 196 by Phat, posted 09-01-2020 3:18 PM Phat has acknowledged this reply

  
dwise1
Member
Posts: 4478
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 5.6


(1)
Message 202 of 271 (881842)
09-01-2020 5:51 PM
Reply to: Message 200 by Taq
09-01-2020 4:24 PM


Re: Is This True?
An anti-socialist Republican afraid of socialism going away. Wow!

Another such anti-socialist Republican afraid of socialism going away is Walmart (hey, corporations are people too, right?). I gleaned this from a radio interview with Ralph Nader a few years ago.

Walmart, one of the most hard-core capitalists around, depends entirely on socialism in the form of direct local government support and social programs.

When they move into a town, they get concessions from the local county and city governments to get cuts in business taxes and other incentives to open there. Then they depend on state and local welfare programs. Part of new employee training is how to fill out applications for food stamps and other welfare programs. Nobody is allowed to work enough hours a week in order for the company to keep from providing medical or other worker benefits, so not only do workers get no benefits, but they also make much less because they have to work fewer hours at minimum wage -- I don't know whether that also helps Walmart avoid payroll taxes.

If social programs (what they call "socialism") were to go away, Walmart could not operate in the US as it does. And yet the Walmart stores in Canada, where they cannot get away with that crap and where workers must be paid decent wages, are making a profit just fine.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 200 by Taq, posted 09-01-2020 4:24 PM Taq has not yet responded

  
dwise1
Member
Posts: 4478
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 5.6


Message 207 of 271 (881860)
09-02-2020 12:48 PM
Reply to: Message 204 by Trump won
09-02-2020 6:09 AM


please remember that is mortal sin voting for joe Biden and because you have not received the sacrament of reconciliation you will very likely go to hell for voting for joe Biden

And yet voting for The Beast (AKA Trump) and through him for the Anti-Christ (arguably Putin) will help get you into heaven? Really? I thought you told us that Catholics are also taught about those things (ie, Revelation and End Times), so how could you be so gravely mistaken?

Screw Russia and Putin's puppets! Vote for America!

Edited by dwise1, : And Putin's little dog too!


This message is a reply to:
 Message 204 by Trump won, posted 09-02-2020 6:09 AM Trump won has not yet responded

  
dwise1
Member
Posts: 4478
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 5.6


(1)
Message 262 of 271 (882604)
09-30-2020 2:17 PM
Reply to: Message 261 by Tangle
09-30-2020 12:48 PM


The version of that quote that I've encountered says:
quote:
"Debating creationists on the topic of evolution is rather like trying to play chess with a pigeon; it knocks the pieces over, craps on the board, and flies back to its flock to claim victory."

And since this topic has defaulted to comments about the "debate", there's this Lincoln Project ad, "A Zoo Story": A Zoo Story (for some reason, the utube code wouldn't play, but this link will get you there). Apparently, Trump was once told about Desmond Morris' 1969 book, The Human Zoo, and its rules for a baboon king.

Malcolm Nance pointed out this morning that Trump wasn't there to debate, but rather to deliver his stump speech. In that conversation, the host suggested that the next debate should be moderated either by SCPO Nance or by Samuel L. Jackson. Or perhaps by Matt Dillahunty (Atheist Experience) who has years of experience hitting the mute button to get a word in edgewise with a caller who's suffering from the Gallopin' Gish oral diarrhea disorder that Trump was presenting symptoms of.

And while some have suggested a mute switch for the microphones from here on out or even placing them in glass booths (at which point Trump would only bang on the glass and make faces -- {ABE: I just saw that was Diomedes in Message 258, though I did think about a kill switch for Trump's microphone last night and several on Facebook also brought up the same idea}), that cannot happen. The format and rules of the debate are negotiated with both sides and both sides must agree with all the rules. Trump's side would never agree to anything that would keep Trump from breaking all the rules that he had agreed to.

Edited by dwise1, : ABE: So that's where I saw it!


This message is a reply to:
 Message 261 by Tangle, posted 09-30-2020 12:48 PM Tangle has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
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dwise1
Member
Posts: 4478
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 5.6


(3)
Message 265 of 271 (882607)
09-30-2020 6:35 PM
Reply to: Message 263 by Coragyps
09-30-2020 4:44 PM


While watching the fiasco, I kept thinking that he should be fitted for a shock collar.

This message is a reply to:
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dwise1
Member
Posts: 4478
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 5.6


Message 266 of 271 (882608)
09-30-2020 6:44 PM
Reply to: Message 258 by Diomedes
09-30-2020 8:50 AM


Re: A Worthless Debate
I have no idea how the next debate will turn out, ...

It should be far more orderly since it's the VP debate, which will be between two adults instead of last night's an adult and a spoiled six-year-old.

But then the VP debate will probably be interrupted by one party losing his nerve when faced by a woman and start calling out for his "Mother".


This message is a reply to:
 Message 258 by Diomedes, posted 09-30-2020 8:50 AM Diomedes has not yet responded

  
dwise1
Member
Posts: 4478
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 5.6


Message 267 of 271 (882613)
10-01-2020 12:10 AM
Reply to: Message 258 by Diomedes
09-30-2020 8:50 AM


Re: A Worthless Debate
Trump was even more Trump than usual (which is saying a lot), but his antics and continued interruptions just turned the whole thing into a sideshow.

It has been said that one should not mistake stupidity for malfeasance. However, when Trump is concerned we should never mistake malfeasance for stupidity. His gross misconduct last night was deliberate and for a purpose. And it failed.

As stupid and incompetent as Trump is, he does have a genius for a few things. Such as finding an opponent's weakness and exploiting it. Biden grew up with a bad stutter, which he has learned to control through years of effort -- remember during the Democratic Convention when he helped a boy overcome his own stutter and that boy was then able to give a speech for the convention.

That is the weakness that Trump sought to exploit. Through his constant bullying he wanted to bring Biden's stuttering out in order to make him appear as a stammering fool. That failed.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 258 by Diomedes, posted 09-30-2020 8:50 AM Diomedes has not yet responded

  
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