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Author Topic:   The Trump Post-Presidency
LamarkNewAge
Member
Posts: 1819
Joined: 12-22-2015


Message 76 of 152 (884128)
01-23-2021 11:58 AM
Reply to: Message 75 by Percy
01-23-2021 11:38 AM


Re: The big legal issue I wonder about:
I just wrote down some scattered parts. I will type those in.

I need you to paste a much more clustered area for me.

Let me give you the first and last sentences of an entire multi-paragraph cluster. Then I want you to paste everything in between.

(My spell check caused the spelling issue)


This message is a reply to:
 Message 75 by Percy, posted 01-23-2021 11:38 AM Percy has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 78 by AZPaul3, posted 01-23-2021 12:07 PM LamarkNewAge has not yet responded
 Message 85 by Percy, posted 01-23-2021 12:58 PM LamarkNewAge has not yet responded

  
LamarkNewAge
Member
Posts: 1819
Joined: 12-22-2015


Message 77 of 152 (884129)
01-23-2021 12:05 PM
Reply to: Message 75 by Percy
01-23-2021 11:38 AM


Re: The big legal issue I wonder about:
My phone needs charging. My other phone has a loose sim card that boots me from the internet.

Here is one quote, but I have a cluster that covers your post 73 quote. I would have already pasted your post 73 quote if I could. I actually wanted to comment on its referent yesterday. Before you quoted it today.

Here is one scattered quote:

And we got to remember, in a year from now, you're going to start working on Congress. And we got to get rid of the weak congresspeople, the ones that aren't any good, the Liz Cheney's of the world. We got to get rid of them

(I will have more later, phone is at 4% power left)


This message is a reply to:
 Message 75 by Percy, posted 01-23-2021 11:38 AM Percy has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 79 by Phat, posted 01-23-2021 12:30 PM LamarkNewAge has not yet responded
 Message 86 by Percy, posted 01-23-2021 1:03 PM LamarkNewAge has not yet responded

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 5582
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 5.1


Message 78 of 152 (884130)
01-23-2021 12:07 PM
Reply to: Message 76 by LamarkNewAge
01-23-2021 11:58 AM


Re: The big legal issue I wonder about:
(My spell check caused the spelling issue)

Seriously? You believe that? Another reality disconnect?


Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 76 by LamarkNewAge, posted 01-23-2021 11:58 AM LamarkNewAge has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 81 by Phat, posted 01-23-2021 12:34 PM AZPaul3 has not yet responded

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 14955
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 79 of 152 (884131)
01-23-2021 12:30 PM
Reply to: Message 77 by LamarkNewAge
01-23-2021 12:05 PM


Re: The big legal issue I wonder about:
speaking from the peanut gallery, I noticed that you were presenting Percy with a list of excuses. Spellcheck is a legit one... I could never comment on EvC were it not for my trusty desktop typewriter....the smartphone is a torture device from hell.

"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
***
“…far from science having buried God, not only do the results of science point towards his existence, but the scientific enterprise itself is validated by his existence.”- Dr.John Lennox

“The whole war between the atheist and the theist comes down to this: the atheist believes a 'what' created the universe; the theist believes a 'who' created the universe.”
- Criss Jami, Killo

“The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” — Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You
(1894).


This message is a reply to:
 Message 77 by LamarkNewAge, posted 01-23-2021 12:05 PM LamarkNewAge has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 87 by Percy, posted 01-23-2021 1:08 PM Phat has not yet responded

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 19957
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 4.7


(6)
Message 80 of 152 (884132)
01-23-2021 12:34 PM
Reply to: Message 66 by LamarkNewAge
01-22-2021 10:52 PM


Re: The big legal issue I wonder about:
LamarkNewAge writes:

Liz Cheney voted for impeachment because she was a major target in Trump's Jan6 call to March.

This is incorrect. Liz Cheney was barely mentioned at all. She was used as a sort of adjective inclusive of Republicans who don't support Trump, and he said she never wanted to bring soldiers home:

quote:
And we got to get rid of the weak congresspeople, the ones that aren’t any good, the Liz Cheneys of the world, we got to get rid of them. We got to get rid of them. She never wants a soldier brought home.

That's it. In nearly 11,000 words that's all he had to say about Liz Cheney.

No Democrats were not a target, just Republicans like her.

Democrats were the most significant target of the speech. Trump's enumeration of Democrat misdeeds was practically half the nearly 11,000 word speech. Here's what he accused them of, all of it false:

  • Playing musical drop boxes
  • Fake mail-in ballots
  • Fake absentee ballots
  • Dead people voting
  • Illegally and/or unconstitutionally changing voting rules to accommodate the pandemic
  • Running the same ballots through voting machines multiple times
  • being crooked and corrupt
  • Lack of signature verification
  • Allowing tens of thousands of illegitimate mail-in votes in Georgia
  • The Georgia vote was fraudulent
  • Republican poll watchers were excluded
  • They faked a water main burst so that they could surreptitiously carry out fraudulent activity
  • Felons cast 2500 votes in Georgia
  • 36,000 illegal ballots were cast in Arizona
  • 150,000 people registered in Maya Copa Country are the deadline
  • 103,000 ballots were sent for electronic adjudication with no Republican observers
  • ...and on and on

I had to stop, there are just too many accusations against Democrats and too little time to type them all. I'll just refer you back to the speech in Message 28.

But the crowd believed this list of malfeasance and was fired up into a frenzy by the sheer magnitude and unabashed shamelessness of Trump's telling of it, none of it true. And apparently, we now learn, in private conversations he's acknowledged that it wasn't true. He's also expressed privately that part of his motivation for running for reelection was that continuing as president would keep his legal exposure to a minimum.

The Jan 6 call to march speech is NOT a reason for any sort of rational impeachment and/or conviction.

This conclusion is in stark contrast to the facts. You need more than just a few of Trump's literal words as you choose to interpret them in isolation. You need to stop closing yourself off from the information and instructions Trump communicated by a combination of words and tone and content in addition to the context of speeches that came before, such as Giuliani's "trial by combat" and Don Jr's "We’re coming for you." Once you have all the information at your command then you might be able to start building a case.

--Percy


This message is a reply to:
 Message 66 by LamarkNewAge, posted 01-22-2021 10:52 PM LamarkNewAge has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 82 by Phat, posted 01-23-2021 12:37 PM Percy has acknowledged this reply

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 14955
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 81 of 152 (884133)
01-23-2021 12:34 PM
Reply to: Message 78 by AZPaul3
01-23-2021 12:07 PM


Re: The big legal issue I wonder about:
all he(LNA) is really saying is that he has a lot more that he wants to say and that his patience is limited concerning his smartphones capability and the time it requires for him to effectively argue with you guys. I swear you liberals are on steroids when it comes to hanging Trump. Not that hanging him may not be a necessary lesson that God Himself has prepared for him.

"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
***
“…far from science having buried God, not only do the results of science point towards his existence, but the scientific enterprise itself is validated by his existence.”- Dr.John Lennox

“The whole war between the atheist and the theist comes down to this: the atheist believes a 'what' created the universe; the theist believes a 'who' created the universe.”
- Criss Jami, Killo

“The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” — Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You
(1894).


This message is a reply to:
 Message 78 by AZPaul3, posted 01-23-2021 12:07 PM AZPaul3 has not yet responded

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 14955
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 82 of 152 (884134)
01-23-2021 12:37 PM
Reply to: Message 80 by Percy
01-23-2021 12:34 PM


Re: The big legal issue I wonder about:
I love the detail and thoughtfully edited expression that you put into your posts. You surely don't type all of this on a smartphone, do you?

Edited by Phat, : No reason given.


"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
***
“…far from science having buried God, not only do the results of science point towards his existence, but the scientific enterprise itself is validated by his existence.”- Dr.John Lennox

“The whole war between the atheist and the theist comes down to this: the atheist believes a 'what' created the universe; the theist believes a 'who' created the universe.”
- Criss Jami, Killo

“The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” — Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You
(1894).


This message is a reply to:
 Message 80 by Percy, posted 01-23-2021 12:34 PM Percy has acknowledged this reply

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 19957
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 4.7


(2)
Message 83 of 152 (884135)
01-23-2021 12:48 PM
Reply to: Message 70 by LamarkNewAge
01-23-2021 10:34 AM


Re: I have an idea. The old critical thinking homework assignment.
LamarkNewAge writes:

Make a case for a position you disagree with.

I am going to ask the posters here to make a case that the Jan 6 speech is not a criminal act.

I didn't think that was the discussion with you. I thought we were discussing your belief that Trump didn't incite insurrection.

Your recollection of a supposed statement by Al Gore can't be considered and I don't know why you brought it up. You can't even read Trump's speech and discern the meaning, why should we accept your interpretation of your faded memory of something Gore may or may not have said. If you can find and reference what he actually said and if you think it in some way relevant, only then should you bring it up.

--Percy


This message is a reply to:
 Message 70 by LamarkNewAge, posted 01-23-2021 10:34 AM LamarkNewAge has not yet responded

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 19957
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 4.7


Message 84 of 152 (884136)
01-23-2021 12:54 PM
Reply to: Message 74 by LamarkNewAge
01-23-2021 11:16 AM


Re: Let's all say Trump called for violence. Then refuse to offer any evidence.
LamarkNewAge writes:

You offered a quote, in your post yesterday, that was very much near the end of his speech.

This, and what follows, sounds like you're confusing my Message 73 about one part of Trump's speech with things I've said in this and other messages about other parts of Trump's speech. I've going to ignore this message. If you think it makes an important point, please restate.

--Percy


This message is a reply to:
 Message 74 by LamarkNewAge, posted 01-23-2021 11:16 AM LamarkNewAge has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 89 by LamarkNewAge, posted 01-23-2021 2:01 PM Percy has responded

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 19957
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 4.7


Message 85 of 152 (884137)
01-23-2021 12:58 PM
Reply to: Message 76 by LamarkNewAge
01-23-2021 11:58 AM


Re: The big legal issue I wonder about:
LamarkNewAge writes:

I just wrote down some scattered parts. I will type those in.

I need you to paste a much more clustered area for me.

Let me give you the first and last sentences of an entire multi-paragraph cluster. Then I want you to paste everything in between.

Say what? I very much want to help people do things they can't do themselves, like upload a document to the website, but this sounds like mere cut-n-pasting.

--Percy


This message is a reply to:
 Message 76 by LamarkNewAge, posted 01-23-2021 11:58 AM LamarkNewAge has not yet responded

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 19957
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 4.7


(1)
Message 86 of 152 (884138)
01-23-2021 1:03 PM
Reply to: Message 77 by LamarkNewAge
01-23-2021 12:05 PM


Re: The big legal issue I wonder about:
LamarkNewAge writes:

My phone needs charging. My other phone has a loose sim card that boots me from the internet.

You're using a phone to participate here? Wow! Kudos to your patience and tenacity, and to that of some of the others here who I know also use their phones.

Phones are only good for texting, short emails, and short message board posts. For longer contributions a real computer with a real screen and a real keyboard and a real plugged-in power cord should be used. I sympathize with your plight, but it's of your own making and I'm not going to help you.

--Percy


This message is a reply to:
 Message 77 by LamarkNewAge, posted 01-23-2021 12:05 PM LamarkNewAge has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 90 by vimesey, posted 01-23-2021 2:26 PM Percy has acknowledged this reply

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 19957
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 4.7


Message 87 of 152 (884139)
01-23-2021 1:08 PM
Reply to: Message 79 by Phat
01-23-2021 12:30 PM


Re: The big legal issue I wonder about:
Phat writes:

....the smartphone is a torture device from hell.

--Percy


This message is a reply to:
 Message 79 by Phat, posted 01-23-2021 12:30 PM Phat has not yet responded

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 19957
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 4.7


(3)
Message 88 of 152 (884140)
01-23-2021 1:27 PM


Statements From Two Capitol Rioters
Taken from Supporters' words may haunt Trump at impeachment trial:

Jenna Ryan, Texas real estate agent:

quote:
I feel like I was basically following my president. I was following what we were called to do. He asked us to fly there. He asked us to be there.

Jacob Chansley, painted horned hat man:

quote:
[I traveled] at the request of the president that all ‘patriots’ come to D.C. on January 6, 2021,...

Chansley's lawyer:

quote:
[Chansley] felt like he was answering the call of our president.

--Percy


  
LamarkNewAge
Member
Posts: 1819
Joined: 12-22-2015


Message 89 of 152 (884141)
01-23-2021 2:01 PM
Reply to: Message 84 by Percy
01-23-2021 12:54 PM


Post 73 disambiguation.
I am on a phone that boots me at least once every hour. My post can't be long.

I prefer to take these things one issue at a time, and the bronco gallops will prevent any clarity.

You quoted my response to your post 45.

You clearly understood that there is going to be a big debate over who Trump is referring to when he talks about a need to show strength: marchers or Senators. It will gave legal repercussions ( though the Senate will be so political , that its vote to remove should be deemed irrelevant to the actual legal arguments. The witnesses and lawyers will be held in high esteem by myself, with exceptions, of course)

I can see you understood because, in the post 73 we are discussing, you put in another quote ( from much earlier in the speech) which represented your attempt to present evidence that Trump was talking about marchers using strength toward something or somebody working at the Capitol.

Keep in mind I was still in a mode-of-operation which thought which felt we needed to cover the post 45 (your first selected quote, aside from the big post 28 quote of the entire speech) quote, but let me put that slightly aside, for a moment.

Your new post 73 quote, which you felt was evidence, in and of itself, for Trump telling marchers to show strength (further stretched by you to mean physical violence), was the opposite of what I wanted to demonstrate in a future post. This is the quote that I earlier said that I wanted to be able to paste & comment on yesterday, BEFORE YOU POSTED IT TODAY.

I feel like your new post 73 quote is going to require debate as to who the ones are Trump wants to be strong. I strongly feel he is referring to members of Congress.

Back to your post 45 quote.

I dont feel like we spent enough time on this.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 84 by Percy, posted 01-23-2021 12:54 PM Percy has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 92 by Percy, posted 01-23-2021 3:48 PM LamarkNewAge has responded

  
vimesey
Member
Posts: 1216
From: Birmingham, England
Joined: 09-21-2011
Member Rating: 5.6


(1)
Message 90 of 152 (884142)
01-23-2021 2:26 PM
Reply to: Message 86 by Percy
01-23-2021 1:03 PM


Re: The big legal issue I wonder about:
Hi Percy- I'm using my phone right now - not a big problem, quite easy and no real issues :-)

Edited by vimesey, : No reason given.


Could there be any greater conceit, than for someone to believe that the universe has to be simple enough for them to be able to understand it ?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 86 by Percy, posted 01-23-2021 1:03 PM Percy has acknowledged this reply

  
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