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Author Topic:   Belief Versus The Scientific Method
drlove
Member
Posts: 146
Joined: 01-02-2022
Member Rating: 1.2


Message 421 of 480 (890969)
01-12-2022 8:59 PM
Reply to: Message 415 by nwr
01-11-2022 9:05 PM


Re: You love making up quotes
Guess we can add them to the list of places that cannot be relied on for credible...anything.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 415 by nwr, posted 01-11-2022 9:05 PM nwr has acknowledged this reply

  
DrJones*
Member
Posts: 2197
From: Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
Joined: 08-19-2004
Member Rating: 4.9


Message 422 of 480 (890970)
01-12-2022 9:08 PM
Reply to: Message 420 by drlove
01-12-2022 8:57 PM


Re: Forcing My Hand Towards Science
The part about several years comes to mind

the part that says:

and it usually requires 10 to 15 years of research before the vaccine is made available to the general public.

these aren't usual circumstances. There is no requirement for many years to pass for a vaccine to be made available to the public.


It's not enough to bash in heads, you've got to bash in minds
soon I discovered that this rock thing was true
Jerry Lee Lewis was the devil
Jesus was an architect previous to his career as a prophet
All of a sudden i found myself in love with the world
And so there was only one thing I could do
Was ding a ding dang my dang along ling long - Jesus Built my Hotrod Ministry
Live every week like it's Shark Week! - Tracey Jordan
Just a monkey in a long line of kings. - Matthew Good
If "elitist" just means "not the dumbest motherfucker in the room", I'll be an elitist! - Get Your War On
*not an actual doctor

This message is a reply to:
 Message 420 by drlove, posted 01-12-2022 8:57 PM drlove has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 423 by drlove, posted 01-12-2022 10:17 PM DrJones* has responded
 Message 425 by Theodoric, posted 01-13-2022 12:01 AM DrJones* has responded

  
drlove
Member
Posts: 146
Joined: 01-02-2022
Member Rating: 1.2


Message 423 of 480 (890972)
01-12-2022 10:17 PM
Reply to: Message 422 by DrJones*
01-12-2022 9:08 PM


making it up as they go along
So now you believe that you can dismiss usual test times. Then we consider that science?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 422 by DrJones*, posted 01-12-2022 9:08 PM DrJones* has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 424 by DrJones*, posted 01-12-2022 11:26 PM drlove has responded
 Message 427 by Theodoric, posted 01-13-2022 12:14 AM drlove has responded
 Message 429 by ringo, posted 01-13-2022 11:43 AM drlove has not yet responded
 Message 431 by AZPaul3, posted 01-13-2022 12:52 PM drlove has responded

  
DrJones*
Member
Posts: 2197
From: Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
Joined: 08-19-2004
Member Rating: 4.9


Message 424 of 480 (890973)
01-12-2022 11:26 PM
Reply to: Message 423 by drlove
01-12-2022 10:17 PM


Re: making it up as they go along
So now you believe that you can dismiss usual test times. Then we consider that science?

if the scientific method is being followed why wouldn't it be science? please give me the FDA regulation that requires that a vaccine take multiple years to come to market

It's not enough to bash in heads, you've got to bash in minds
soon I discovered that this rock thing was true
Jerry Lee Lewis was the devil
Jesus was an architect previous to his career as a prophet
All of a sudden i found myself in love with the world
And so there was only one thing I could do
Was ding a ding dang my dang along ling long - Jesus Built my Hotrod Ministry
Live every week like it's Shark Week! - Tracey Jordan
Just a monkey in a long line of kings. - Matthew Good
If "elitist" just means "not the dumbest motherfucker in the room", I'll be an elitist! - Get Your War On
*not an actual doctor

This message is a reply to:
 Message 423 by drlove, posted 01-12-2022 10:17 PM drlove has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 434 by drlove, posted 01-13-2022 4:02 PM DrJones* has responded

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 7149
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 5.1


Message 425 of 480 (890975)
01-13-2022 12:01 AM
Reply to: Message 422 by DrJones*
01-12-2022 9:08 PM


Re: Forcing My Hand Towards Science
Sorry DrJones*

Edited by Theodoric, : replied to wrong fake doctor


Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 422 by DrJones*, posted 01-12-2022 9:08 PM DrJones* has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 426 by DrJones*, posted 01-13-2022 12:08 AM Theodoric has not yet responded

  
DrJones*
Member
Posts: 2197
From: Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
Joined: 08-19-2004
Member Rating: 4.9


Message 426 of 480 (890976)
01-13-2022 12:08 AM
Reply to: Message 425 by Theodoric
01-13-2022 12:01 AM


Re: Forcing My Hand Towards Science
You do realize that mRNA vaccines have been tested for years.

I do realize that, I think you're replying to the wrong fake doctor.

It's not enough to bash in heads, you've got to bash in minds
soon I discovered that this rock thing was true
Jerry Lee Lewis was the devil
Jesus was an architect previous to his career as a prophet
All of a sudden i found myself in love with the world
And so there was only one thing I could do
Was ding a ding dang my dang along ling long - Jesus Built my Hotrod Ministry
Live every week like it's Shark Week! - Tracey Jordan
Just a monkey in a long line of kings. - Matthew Good
If "elitist" just means "not the dumbest motherfucker in the room", I'll be an elitist! - Get Your War On
*not an actual doctor

This message is a reply to:
 Message 425 by Theodoric, posted 01-13-2022 12:01 AM Theodoric has not yet responded

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 7149
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 5.1


(2)
Message 427 of 480 (890977)
01-13-2022 12:14 AM
Reply to: Message 423 by drlove
01-12-2022 10:17 PM


Re: making it up as they go along
You do realize that mRNA vaccines have been tested for years. MRNA vaccines were first tested on humans in 2013 vaccine. The Salk Polio vaccine was developed in 1952 and was widely used in 1955. The Sabin Polio vaccine was developed in 1957 and widely used starting in 1957.
There is nothing magic about time. The reason many vaccines take years to be authorized is that there is no pandemic. Study groups are small. THe COVID vaccines are the most tested and studied vaccines in history. Probably the safest too.

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 423 by drlove, posted 01-12-2022 10:17 PM drlove has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 435 by drlove, posted 01-13-2022 4:12 PM Theodoric has not yet responded

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 8331
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 5.9


Message 428 of 480 (890979)
01-13-2022 3:37 AM
Reply to: Message 418 by drlove
01-12-2022 5:49 PM


Re: Forcing My Hand Towards Science
drlove writes:

"The creation of a vaccine involves scientists and medical experts from around the world, and it usually requires 10 to 15 years of research before the vaccine is made available to the general public. The first step of this extensive process involves several years of laboratory research, in which scientists and researchers identify an antigen that can prevent a disease.

The AstraZenica vaccine was the first vaccine to be approved. The reason it was able to be done so quickly is documented in the link below. As you won't read it, here are the main points

1. A critical and general purpose component of the vaccine had already been developed following the Ebola outbreak in 2016 and in anticipation of a pandemic - ChAdOx1 - or Chimpanzee Adenovirus Oxford One. This is the delivery system to which the specific genetic fingerprint of any new virus would be attached.

2. There were no funding delays. The developers did not waste years looking for stage payments and writing funding papers for the next round of testing.

3. Vaccines have three trial phases. All three trial phases were done. The difference is that there were no delays between phases for funding and that because it was a pandemic there were enough people catching the disease to gather the sample size quickly.
(Although not in this article, I believe some parts of the trials were also run in parallel.)

The AZ vaccine is now the most tested vaccine in history.

Oxford vaccine: How did they make it so quickly?


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 418 by drlove, posted 01-12-2022 5:49 PM drlove has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 437 by drlove, posted 01-13-2022 4:24 PM Tangle has responded

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 19388
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 6.1


(2)
Message 429 of 480 (891003)
01-13-2022 11:43 AM
Reply to: Message 423 by drlove
01-12-2022 10:17 PM


Re: making it up as they go along
drlove writes:

So now you believe that you can dismiss usual test times.


Yup.

It's not a rule. "Usual" does not mean "required".

For example, it usually takes a couple of hours to solve the New York Times crossword puzzle. If somebody does it in less time, is that a bad thing? Is the solution invalid because it was done "too fast"?


"I call that bold talk for a one-eyed fat man!"
-- Lucky Ned Pepper

This message is a reply to:
 Message 423 by drlove, posted 01-12-2022 10:17 PM drlove has not yet responded

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 19388
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 6.1


(4)
Message 430 of 480 (891004)
01-13-2022 12:31 PM
Reply to: Message 211 by Phat
01-06-2022 7:40 AM


Re: Peanut Gallery dogpiles Phat
Phat writes:

ringo writes:

There are thousands of gods. Your apologist's claims do nothing to support one over the others.

Thousands, eh? I may reject the book, but you reject Jesus...the central character.


What does that have to do with what you quoted?

And no, I do not reject Jesus any more than I reject Long John Silver or Holden Caulfield. I accept Jesus' message and YOU reject it.

Phat writes:

You claim a "get out of responsibility" card because you don't believe that Jesus is real or can help you.


Have you ever read anything I've posted? I do NOT, by any stretch of the imagination, try to get out of responsibility. I have no more responsibility to Jesus than I have to Long John Silver or Holden Caulfield - but I am responsible to my fellow man. I am my brother's keeper. YOU are the one who tries to get out of that responsibility by claiming that Jesus whispered in your ear that the dusty old book is wrong.

Phat writes:

For all of you here at EvC who trust humans to be our collective higher power, I can only say that you WILL be disappointed.


And yet YOU are the one who is ALREADY disappointed - you readily admit that your made-up Jesus doesn't do anything concrete.

Phat writes:

ringo writes:

you can't show any difference between your made-up god and any other made-up god.


As long as you call ALL of them made-up, I can't convince you of anything.

On the contrary, as I have told you many times, if you could show any difference between your made-up god and any other made-up god I would gladly accept that your made-up god is different. You just can't convince me of something that is false.

Phat writes:

ringo writes:

The human mind is the source of all gods.

You do believe in the Dusty Old Book, so allow me to quote that.


No, I do not "believe in" the Book. I believe in one particular message IN the Book. Why is it so hard for you to understand the most basic concepts?

I believe in the message of "love thy neighbor" because it works in reality, not because it's in the Book.

And your quote from Acts doesn't disagree with what I said.

Phat writes:

It's amazing how not much has changed. These days people still worship things made by men.


As I said.

Your quote from Acts might carry some weight if you didn't reject what the Book says about Jesus and make up your own self-serving Jesus. But the book of Acts is talking about YOU.

Phat writes:

God will not overlook such ignorance veiled behind education and "evidence".


Which God is that? The many versions of God in the Book? Or your made-up version?

Phat writes:

The evidence is found in your Dusty Old Book.


The Book that you reject.

Seriously, how many feet can you get into your mouth at one time?

Phat writes:

You escape responsibility for placing yourself under God's authority because you are not a believer.


Liar. See above.

Phat writes:

You then turn around, hold me to giving everything....


Stop it. I don't hold you to anything. I just wonder why you reject the only evidence we have for Jesus, the Bible.

Phat writes:

... essentially *worship* human potential and creativity as the sole hope for mankind....


It is our only hope. Do you understanhd the difference between hope and wishful thinking? You wish Jesus would do it all for you but deep down you know He won't. He told you the same thing that I'm telling you: You have to do it yourself.

You're responsible for your own "salvation". You gotta build your own ark because God ain't gonna do it for you. You gotta feed the hungry because Jesus ain't gonna do it for you. You ARE your own only hope.

Phat writes:

... and scold me for ignoring a dusty old book which you yourselves believe was entirely human-inspired and compiled.


Yes, it is human-inspired. The only things it gets right are what humans get right.

"I call that bold talk for a one-eyed fat man!"
-- Lucky Ned Pepper

This message is a reply to:
 Message 211 by Phat, posted 01-06-2022 7:40 AM Phat has not yet responded

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 6215
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 6.2


Message 431 of 480 (891008)
01-13-2022 12:52 PM
Reply to: Message 423 by drlove
01-12-2022 10:17 PM


Re: making it up as they go along
Whatever protocols are usual in any class of study are not required for all such studies. The protocol design is dependant on study requirements, funding, etc. Each such element varies study to study.

If you want to wait to see what we end up developing after a 10-year development period then feel free to wait. You know this covid thing is going to go on for decades. This is far from over. In the mean time, while you obfuscate, lie and throw bombs, the rest of the real world has a population to save.

Even with all that is available on the subject you have an ignorant and dysfunctional idea of what science is and how it works.

Of course, now that you have that errant view I can see where you lack the intellectual ability to learn the reality and change.


Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 423 by drlove, posted 01-12-2022 10:17 PM drlove has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 433 by dwise1, posted 01-13-2022 2:56 PM AZPaul3 has not yet responded
 Message 436 by drlove, posted 01-13-2022 4:19 PM AZPaul3 has responded

  
dwise1
Member
Posts: 4818
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 7.0


(4)
Message 432 of 480 (891016)
01-13-2022 2:12 PM
Reply to: Message 211 by Phat
01-06-2022 7:40 AM


Re: Peanut Gallery dogpiles Phat
I just saw Ringo's new reply to this, so I'll contribute on one of your claims:

You claim a "get out of responsibility" card because you don't believe that Jesus is real or can help you.

You escape responsibility for placing yourself under God's authority because you are not a believer.

Perhaps the single stupidest and most counterproductive Christian conceits is that atheists are only trying to escape responsibility for their actions, are seeking to be able to sin without guilt. Completely and utterly false in addition to being yet another BizarroWorld reversal of reality: it is the believer who is trying to escape resonsibility for the consequences of his actions by assigning that responsibility to God.

In the development of moral reasoning, we go through different states of development as we do with other abilities (refer to developmental psychology, including classic Piagetian Stages of Development). Basically, we all go through the earlier states of development but then grow out of them as we move on to later stages; eg, conservation which is the ability to watch the same amount of something be transfered to a different container or shape and realize that it's still the same amount (pour liquid into a short fat glass, then pour that into a tall skinny glass -- a young child who hasn't developed conservation yet will say that the tall glass contains more).

In the development of moral reasoning, the earlier stage is rules-based morality in which an authority (eg, your parent, your Kindergarten teacher) gives you rules to follow and everybody's responsibility is to follow those rules. Right and wrong is determined solely by whether it agrees with or conflicts with those rules. But an important aspect of rules-based morality is that if any harm comes to someone because of following those rules, then it is the rules-giver who is responsible, not you.

For example, let's say that your teacher, the authority figure, has given you the rule that you do not interrupt the class. You see a classmate, maybe even your friend, start to have a medical emergency (eg, allergic reaction to that snack you just had). What do you do? Any of us (except maybe a Christian) would interrupt the class to bring this emergency to the teacher's attention so that she (almost all my elementary grade teachers were women) could deal with it. But rules-based morality requires that your responsibility is to follow the rules. Let's say that your friend dies because of your inaction (though serious hospitalization is also possible). What is your responsibility for that? As per rules-based morality, none. After all, you did the "right thing" throughout the entire incident. The fault was in the rule itself; it was a bad rule for not taking every possible contingent into account. And since it was the teacher who had made that rule, the teacher was responsible (which just happens to be the case in the real world too, but for entirely different reasons).

A classic example is the infamous Milgram experiments:

quote:
The Milgram experiment(s) on obedience to authority figures was a series of social psychology experiments conducted by Yale University psychologist Stanley Milgram. They measured the willingness of study participants, men in the age range of 20 to 50 from a diverse range of occupations with varying levels of education, to obey an authority figure who instructed them to perform acts conflicting with their personal conscience. Participants were led to believe that they were assisting an unrelated experiment, in which they had to administer electric shocks to a "learner". These fake electric shocks gradually increased to levels that would have been fatal had they been real.

The experiment found, unexpectedly, that a very high proportion of subjects would fully obey the instructions, albeit reluctantly. ...

The experiments began in July 1961, in the basement of Linsly-Chittenden Hall at Yale University, three months after the start of the trial of German Nazi war criminal Adolf Eichmann in Jerusalem. Milgram devised his psychological study to explain the psychology of genocide and answer the popular contemporary question: "Could it be that Eichmann and his million accomplices in the Holocaust were just following orders? Could we call them all accomplices?" The experiment was repeated many times around the globe, with fairly consistent results.


The experimenter wore a lab coat and kept notes on a clipboard. In some instances, when the subject couldn't go any further for fear of the possibly having just killed the "student", when the experimenter responded with "I accept full responsibility. Please continue the experiment." the subject would then continue. Refer to a low-budget film about Milgram, Experimenter: The Stanley Milgram Story (2015), which is no longer on Netflix -- note that nobody ever mentions the elephant in the hallway.

Normal development of moral reasoning progresses on to starting to evaluate motives (classically presented as the Les Misérables scenario of a poor man being hunted his entire life as a criminal because he had stolen a loaf of bread to feed his starving family, though the bread is often substituted with medicine that would cure his dying wife). Further development of moral reasoning leads to consideration of the consequences to ourselves and to others of our actions and shifting the evaluation of right and wrong to how our actions affects others. Hence, our responsibility is no longer to some arbitrary authority, but rather to each other.

Believers who rail about atheists "rejecting God in order to escape responsibility" are trapped by their religious teachings in the rules-based morality stage that most grow out of in their first decade of life. And yet they are the ones seeking to escape personal responsibility for the harm that they do by "being responsible to God". Like the parents whose young child dies because they withheld life-saving medication that God did not want them to use (eg, antibiotics to treatment meningitis, an actual court case). Or shooting abortion doctors and bombing abortion clinics because that's what God wanted them to do. Or discriminating against groups they don't like because God doesn't like them either -- even until killing them because that's what God demanded in the Bible. They aren't responsible for those actions, but rather God is (and everything that God does, no matter how atrocious, is Good; like Nixon's and Alan Dershowitz' (in Trump's first impeachment trial) declaration of "if the President does it, then it's not illegal").

In contrast, atheists have been freed from that stunted growth and have developed moral reasoning which stunted believers have never been allowed to learn (which is a booby trap awaiting them when they do leave the faith -- I have quite literally had believers insist that if not for God they'd be hedonist atheists running naked down the street or else an axe murderer).

It becomes counter-productive when it creates a gaping legalistic loophole for believers who want so desperately to sin without guilt. Indeed, most of those cries of "the only reason you're an atheist is to you can escape responsibility and feel free to sin" is just them projecting their own deepest desires.

A prime example is Bill Morgan, a local YEC activist who claims that he used to be an atheist, and even blames evolution in the schools for having turned him into an atheist in the first place. That despite his own autobiography in which he describes his "bubbling hormones" making him want to sin, so he used evolution as an excuse to pretend to become an atheist (note his unspoken assumption that equates evolution with atheism) so that he could sin away -- I say "pretend" because he admitted to without realizing it that throughout his "atheism" he continued to believe in God and prayed to God every night. I've quoted from his autobiographic account a few times on this forum in the past, so I'll just pull out a short quote:

quote:
Question! Why in 6th grade did I think the drawings [DWise1: the classic Time-Life graphic of a sequence of human evolution which has been reproduced and parodied so many times since c. 1960] were ridiculous, but in 9th grade I believed them?

Was it because I was more intellectual? No. Was it because the Biology teacher explained it so convincingly? Not really. The real reason for my becoming an atheist in 9th grade can be summed up in one word...hormones. In 6th grade I did not have much temptation in my life. Perhaps my biggest sins were a lie here and there, throwing snowballs at the school bus and riding my minibike where I shouldn't.

But in 9th grade a whole new world opened up to me. The temptation of drinking, drugs and premarital sex presented themselves to me at exactly the same time I was being taught evolution. I knew the Bible said that being drunk and having sex outside of marriage was wrong, but here is my science teacher, telling me the origin of man is completely contradictory to what the Bible taught as the origin of man. I felt excited.....and decided the Theory of Evolution was for me, after all the Bible was scientifically wrong on the very first page!! I considered myself to be an atheist. As an atheist I no longer had to abide by any rules but my own. If I wanted to get drunk, no problem, if I wanted to try to have premarital sex no problem, I now belonged to the evolution "religion" (religion meaning a system of beliefs built on faith) that allowed me to sin without guilt.

It was not the data that made me an atheist, it was the conclusion, a belief that made me the judge of right and wrong. Those cartoon drawings of ape men did look sharp, but I wanted to believe them emotionally, more than I really believed them intellectually.


And yet, in any discussion with him of how one had become an atheist (as for me, I started reading the Bible and found I just could not believe it, like many others) he always insisted that the only reason for becoming an atheist is to escape responisiblity. He would claim to know that because "he had been an atheist himself", even though he had never actually been but rather just pretended to be one in order to exploit that legalistic loophole (ie, "if I pretend to be an atheist, then I can avoid responsibility"). It became a brick wall that was impossible to break through.

 
So basically, please stop spouting this stupid nonsense of "you're just trying to avoid responsibility." You are the one trying to avoid your own responsiblity by piling it all onto your own private Jesus.

I mean, what good is any invisibile friend who wouldn't do that for you? Show me someone with an invisible friend who doesn't like him and I'll show you someone with some very serious problems.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 211 by Phat, posted 01-06-2022 7:40 AM Phat has not yet responded

  
dwise1
Member
Posts: 4818
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 7.0


(2)
Message 433 of 480 (891019)
01-13-2022 2:56 PM
Reply to: Message 431 by AZPaul3
01-13-2022 12:52 PM


Re: making it up as they go along
Being a Navy veteran can color my analogies at times.

You have a sudden hull breach due to enemy ordnance (be it torpedo or anti-ship missle or mine). That space was immediately open to the sea, but there's a bulkhead separating that space to the next. That bulkhead also took damage, so it's compromised. As Damage Control, what's your next move?

The military goes beyond Ben Franklin's list of inevitables (death and taxes) by adding plans and protocols, followed by training. Basically, the military's "Job One" is training: we consider all possible scenarios from which we plan, establish protocols, and train in those protocols. Training is key because when the shit hits the fan and our brains' neo-cortexes shut down from the panic, we need to have the training in place in order to do the right things (ie, when Pearl Harbor hits, you don't have any time to stop and think things through -- added to which that part of your brain just shut down completely so it's impossible to think anything through (I've been there in my personal life)), but rather you must rely on your training in how to respond to such a situation. Remember your training! It's not just a movie cliché, but rather the key to combat survival.

So what's the protocol in replacing a compromised bulkhead? The shipyard has its protocols which involve first removing the existing bulkhead. When the space on the other side of that bulkhead is open to the sea, that usual protocol clearly does not apply. Rather, in that emergency situation at sea you need an entirely different protocol geared instead to shoring up that bulkhead to keep it from giving way. Go on a museum ship some time and note the damage control shoring/etc materials stowed in every passageway.

Repairing a ship in a shipyard is a very different situation than keeping a ship afloat in the middle of battle, so of course the protocols in those very different situations would necessarily be different. For anyone to try to argue otherwise would indication extreme ignorance or complete distachment from reality.

In addition, we have circuit breakers on all our electrical equipment in all aspects of modern life. But on shipboard power distribution systems we have a setting called "Battle Short" which overrides all current limiting measures in order to ensure that all combat systems will remain online during battle * Would you deploy battle shorts in your house? No. But in a battle situation where the last thing you could possibly afford is for your combat systems to suddenly power down and have to reboot, oh hell yes!

Do I really need to break out the crayons to draw the pictures?

 


 
* FOOTNOTE:
The first time I encountered the Navy's battle shorts was after having listened to Douglas Adams' Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy (my emphasis added as bold):

quote:
Careless Talk

It is of course well known that careless talk costs lives, but the full scale of the problem is not always appreciated. For instance, a human named Arthur Dent who, because of a Vogon Constructor Fleet, was one of the last two humans in the Universe at the time, once said "I seem to be having tremendous difficulty with my lifestyle." At the very moment that Arthur said this, a freak wormhole opened up in the fabric of the space-time continuum and carried his words far far back in time across almost infinite reaches of space to a distant Galaxy where strange and warlike beings were poised on the brink of frightful interstellar battle.

The two opposing leaders were meeting for the last time.

A dreadful silence fell across the conference table as the commander of the Vl'Hurgs, resplendent in his black jewelled battle shorts, gazed levelly at the G'Gugvuntt leader squatting opposite him in a cloud of green sweet-smelling steam, and, with a million sleek and horribly beweaponed star cruisers poised to unleash electric death at his single word of command, challenged the vile creature to take back what it had said about his mother.

The creature stirred in his sickly broiling vapour, and at that very moment the words I seem to be having tremendous difficulty with my lifestyle drifted across the conference table.

Unfortunately, in the Vl'Hurg tongue this was the most dreadful insult imaginable, and there was nothing for it but to wage terrible war for centuries.

Eventually of course, after their Galaxy had been decimated over a few thousand years, it was realized that the whole thing had been a ghastly mistake, and so the two opposing battle fleets settled their few remaining differences in order to launch a joint attack on our own Galaxy - now positively identified as the source of the offending remark.

For thousands more years the mighty ships tore across the empty wastes of space and finally dived screaming on to the first planet they came across - which happened to be the Earth - where due to a terrible miscalculation of scale the entire battle fleet was accidentally swallowed by a small dog.

Those who study the complex interplay of cause and effect in the history of the Universe say that this sort of thing is going on all the time, but that we are powerless to prevent it.

"It's just life," they say.



This message is a reply to:
 Message 431 by AZPaul3, posted 01-13-2022 12:52 PM AZPaul3 has not yet responded

  
drlove
Member
Posts: 146
Joined: 01-02-2022
Member Rating: 1.2


Message 434 of 480 (891021)
01-13-2022 4:02 PM
Reply to: Message 424 by DrJones*
01-12-2022 11:26 PM


Re: making it up as they go along
Give us the scientific method that says experiment on kids and others with any sort of shortcuts you want to take?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 424 by DrJones*, posted 01-12-2022 11:26 PM DrJones* has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 440 by DrJones*, posted 01-13-2022 7:45 PM drlove has responded

  
drlove
Member
Posts: 146
Joined: 01-02-2022
Member Rating: 1.2


Message 435 of 480 (891022)
01-13-2022 4:12 PM
Reply to: Message 427 by Theodoric
01-13-2022 12:14 AM


Re: making it up as they go along
The drug companies testing them have been in court cases for lying. Is that science? I think we need more than the word of known killers and liars to call something science?

Now if the actions taken were based on good science would they not work?
"TUCSON, Ariz., March 16, 2021 /PRNewswire/ -- The U.S. response to the COVID-19 pandemic has failed at every level, resulting in hundreds of thousands of needless deaths, according to an article in the spring issue of the Journal of American Physicians and Surgeons. "
U.S. Pandemic Response Disastrous, according to the Journal of American Physicians and Surgeons


This message is a reply to:
 Message 427 by Theodoric, posted 01-13-2022 12:14 AM Theodoric has not yet responded

  
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