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Author Topic:   An Ether-Based Creation Model
AZPaul3
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Posts: 6738
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 2.9


(2)
Message 89 of 586 (885654)
04-21-2021 5:41 PM
Reply to: Message 87 by Michael MD
04-21-2021 2:19 PM


Re: Stop and smell the aether
By referring to "a review" of quantum entanglement, I was referring (possibly confusingly) to the fact that I had already given my ether model for quantum entanglement

So you do not have anything but your description of things, leaving the most important details to our imaginations. No math. No model.

If that is all you can present then you have presented nothing. There is nothing in your prose-based faux-model to comprehend on the level required for physics studies.

Again, Mike, this is crackpot tactics.

You should show your math. Without that you have no model and no aether.


Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 87 by Michael MD, posted 04-21-2021 2:19 PM Michael MD has taken no action

Replies to this message:
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AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 6738
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 2.9


(1)
Message 94 of 586 (885767)
04-25-2021 6:25 PM
Reply to: Message 91 by Son Goku
04-25-2021 3:43 PM


Re: Entanglement
Allo Son Goku.

Michael MD, our OP, cannot seem to understand his own level of thinking. I don't think he can recognize this deeper level. Still it will be interesting to see how he responds.


Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 91 by Son Goku, posted 04-25-2021 3:43 PM Son Goku has taken no action

Replies to this message:
 Message 97 by Michael MD, posted 04-27-2021 7:15 AM AZPaul3 has replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 6738
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 2.9


Message 95 of 586 (885768)
04-25-2021 6:37 PM
Reply to: Message 92 by vimesey
04-25-2021 4:12 PM


Re: Entanglement
If we share rounds can the rest of us come?

Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 92 by vimesey, posted 04-25-2021 4:12 PM vimesey has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 96 by vimesey, posted 04-26-2021 4:35 AM AZPaul3 has seen this message

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 6738
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 2.9


(1)
Message 101 of 586 (885817)
04-27-2021 10:17 AM
Reply to: Message 97 by Michael MD
04-27-2021 7:15 AM


Re: Entanglement
How can I "respond" to counter-arguments from consensus quantists citing the various opinions on quantum entanglement of "authorities" whose fundamental assumption about ether is that it does not exist?

You respond by showing us, fully, completely, with copious amounts of math, how present theory is in error. You do that by showing us, fully, completely, with copious amounts of math, how your musings have viability.

My model of entanglement should get serious consideration.

You don't get to decide that. The discipline does. Just because you mumble doesn't mean we have to listen.

And right now there is no consideration of your mathless non-model of a concept that died over a century past. You have shown us nothing and we have nothing to seriously consider.


Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 97 by Michael MD, posted 04-27-2021 7:15 AM Michael MD has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 102 by Michael MD, posted 04-28-2021 10:12 AM AZPaul3 has replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 6738
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 2.9


(2)
Message 110 of 586 (885916)
04-28-2021 6:53 PM
Reply to: Message 102 by Michael MD
04-28-2021 10:12 AM


Death to MMX
All versions of MMX used measurements of light beams …

Yes, yes, Mike, I most certainly do understand that you are not talking about a Luminiferous aether - Wikipedia.

I understand you’re claiming an aether from a much deeper source.

Re-read my Message 11.

quote:
The first thing you guys need to do is show by some Michelson/Morley-type experiments that an aether exists.

Did I use Mickelson against you? Was this language too subtle for you? Did you not see a call for you aether guys to devise your own experiments to show your own brand of aether exists … or not? Why do you get so hung up on MMX?

No one cares. Get off the MMX stuff. Get to the real stuff.

First, you really need to have a stronger tie into Quantum chromodynamics - Wikipedia under the Standard Model - Wikipedia.

Then show us how this aether squares with General relativity - Wikipedia.

All the above should be equations, math. Show us how this aether field conforms to Quantum field theory - Wikipedia, specifically QCD. You’re playing in their sandbox now and you need to bring you own toys and be willing to share nice.

If you get to a level where I can’t handle it, there are others here who can.

The car ("photon") would not be affected by the individual dust particles ("ether units"), and would pass through without interacting with them at all (no inertial interface; the dust is simply brushed aside.)

And in what EV mass range would this dust particle be proposed? Your model needs to define this in the math.

I still claim physics is in error in dismissing the Ether, and in accepting the MMX as evidence.

Fine, Mike. Claim away. MMX = strawman. You are not claiming the same definition of aether. Got it.

You’re claiming an aether arising like a fine dust from ??? that clumps into life by some unknown abiogenic process.

The key is this aether. Is it really there? Other than the earnest pleas of a seemingly confused internet crackpot, why should we look? You can’t tell us what to look for.

Edited by AZPaul3, : No reason given.

Edited by AZPaul3, : No reason given.


Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 102 by Michael MD, posted 04-28-2021 10:12 AM Michael MD has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 111 by jar, posted 04-28-2021 7:48 PM AZPaul3 has replied
 Message 117 by Michael MD, posted 04-29-2021 1:31 PM AZPaul3 has seen this message

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 6738
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 2.9


Message 112 of 586 (885919)
04-28-2021 9:26 PM
Reply to: Message 111 by jar
04-28-2021 7:48 PM


Re: Death to MMX
A kiss is not enough.

Excellent, Sir.


Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 111 by jar, posted 04-28-2021 7:48 PM jar has taken no action

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 6738
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 2.9


(2)
Message 123 of 586 (885957)
04-29-2021 8:37 PM
Reply to: Message 122 by nwr
04-29-2021 5:57 PM


Re: A summary of the model thus far
Very precise and well put. I do appreciate your brevity while capturing the greater import of the model. Though I do have some questions about that part in the middle.

Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 122 by nwr, posted 04-29-2021 5:57 PM nwr has seen this message

Replies to this message:
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AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 6738
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 2.9


(1)
Message 177 of 586 (887287)
07-29-2021 1:40 PM
Reply to: Message 173 by ICANT
07-29-2021 10:49 AM


Get Real.
Since there is zero data, or experiments, of what existed at T=0 the Big Bang Theory is not a theory as it is based upon an assumption but a hypothesis.

Oh, Reverend, you still shilling that old BS strawman?

You have been here long enough to know the BBT does not include any statements on T=0.

Big Bang - Wikipedia

We can't say ANYTHING about T=0 precisely because we have "zero data, or experiments, of what existed at T=0". And neither can you.

So stop with the lying. Incomplete knowledge of T=0 DOES NOT negate BBT!

The Lambda-CDM model of cosmology (our present BBT) is ALL evidence-based and gives us a very accurate model of what we see out there in the sky. We know, with ever increasing confidence, what this universe is made of and how it operates.

Lambda-CDM model - Wikipedia

It cannot address T=0 because our present knowledge has limits NOT because our present theories are wrong. We have more yet to learn but what we know, we know exceptionally well. Well enough to be beyond challenge by anyone in this forum.

Just like the vaccines. Our knowledge of virology may be forever incomplete but we know, with certainty, vaccines work.

Big bang, in some form or other, consistent with Lambda-CDM, amended by whatever discoveries may come, will be the dominate cosmological model for humanity for the remainder of our existence because it is real and we have the evidence of its reality.

No, it doesn't answer your unanswerable T=0 question but neither does anything else in our knowledge base, yet.

Edited by AZPaul3, : added cite

Edited by AZPaul3, : No reason given.


Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 173 by ICANT, posted 07-29-2021 10:49 AM ICANT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 180 by ICANT, posted 07-29-2021 6:19 PM AZPaul3 has replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 6738
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 2.9


(1)
Message 187 of 586 (887299)
07-30-2021 2:22 AM
Reply to: Message 180 by ICANT
07-29-2021 6:19 PM


Re: Get Real.
It does tell us what the universe has in it.

Yes, BBT tells us a lot. Not only does BBT tell us what's in the universe, but the way it works, the forces that move all the stuff around which means we can see its history, past and future.

We can even see the invisible stuff. BBT Physics rules. Thank you Dr. Einstein and Fr. Lemaître.

We still have some major holes in our knowledge, but, again, the facts and the models we have today are all very well evidenced (real hard-fact science-type evidence) and you cannot challenge any of them.

The BBT is a reality of this universe as evidenced by the universe itself and you have nothing that can dispute this.

AZPaul3 writes:

Incomplete knowledge of T=0 DOES NOT negate BBT!


But it does relegate it to a hypotheses without certain assumptions.

How?

Good lord, we just went through this.

No, it does not relegate anything. Ignorance of T=0 has no effect on the facts we have in evidence for BBT. Our CMB analysis, a major BBT supporting reality, is as independent from T=0 as it is from bigfoot and the phases of the moon.

This cannot be this difficult to comprehend.

Parametrization is the process of ... (yada, yada, attempted regurgitation of concepts he knows nothing about...)

So what does that explain?

It does tell us what the universe has in it. Not its origin.

That is what everyone has been telling you. Origins we don't have. No one has.

The Big Bang Theory is our best explanation for all the facts and evidence we can presently show and no one on this forum has the standing to challenge that science. None of it involves origins because our knowledge hasn't reached there yet.

And for all our looking and testing and arguing, no one has come up with a better theory, origins or not. No one. Especially not you. But we continue to look.

Just because you believe it does not make it so. Science has changed a lot in my 82 years on this planet.

You have not challenged the science. It stands. And the consensus interpretation of that science also stands.

If you have any challenge to BBT (the real theory, not your origin-centered strawman of the theory) then please present it. Show me how not knowing T=0 affects our gauge of the standard candle. Show me how ANY fact used in BBT is unreasonable or inappropriate or wrong.

Finally, Reverend, you are way old. Congratulations and keep it going.


Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 180 by ICANT, posted 07-29-2021 6:19 PM ICANT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 196 by ICANT, posted 07-31-2021 2:20 AM AZPaul3 has replied
 Message 203 by Phat, posted 07-31-2021 10:45 AM AZPaul3 has replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 6738
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 2.9


Message 197 of 586 (887319)
07-31-2021 2:55 AM
Reply to: Message 196 by ICANT
07-31-2021 2:20 AM


Re: Get Real.
AZPaul3 writes:

No one has.

I do.

Yes, your fantasies are well known.

However, do understand that objective reality is supreme and requires lots of very strong evidence. Evidence which you cannot provide.

Without evidence of efficacy, Reverend, your fantasies are ... well ... your fantasies; your personal dreams which carry no weight in the running of this universe.

And, no, you don't have any viable origin, either.

Edited by AZPaul3, : No reason given.


Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 196 by ICANT, posted 07-31-2021 2:20 AM ICANT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 206 by Phat, posted 07-31-2021 11:00 AM AZPaul3 has replied
 Message 216 by ICANT, posted 07-31-2021 11:47 PM AZPaul3 has replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 6738
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 2.9


Message 209 of 586 (887331)
07-31-2021 11:24 AM
Reply to: Message 203 by Phat
07-31-2021 10:45 AM


Re: Get Real.
All of us have an origin. Don't we?

Read up-thread. You are taking this origin thing off track.

We're talking the moment of creation, how the stuff of the universe came into being. The origin of the universe, Phat, not you individually.


Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 203 by Phat, posted 07-31-2021 10:45 AM Phat has seen this message

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 6738
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 2.9


(1)
Message 211 of 586 (887333)
07-31-2021 11:28 AM
Reply to: Message 206 by Phat
07-31-2021 11:00 AM


Re: Get Real.
Objective reality will in time ...

So you're saying objective reality provides evidence of its existence.

So what else is new?


Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 206 by Phat, posted 07-31-2021 11:00 AM Phat has seen this message

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 6738
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 2.9


Message 214 of 586 (887337)
07-31-2021 3:11 PM
Reply to: Message 193 by ICANT
07-31-2021 1:57 AM


Re: Get Real.
Oh, where to begin. OK, just top to bottom.

The BBT requires a beginning to exist.

Remember BBT is a science thing that began in the human mind.

We're talking universe here. I know you chaff at this but universe includes everything we know, everything we see. No outside. No beyond.

You're saying the universe, all there is, requires a beginning.

Why?

If space is what is expanding between galaxies at the speed of light ...

Bad "if". Our latest measurements indicate the hubble constant (H0) to be in the +- 70 km/s/Mpc range. That is way way slower than c.

Since your "if" is bogus so is your conclusion.

But when talking about expansion this elephant in the room is pushed into a corner and he does not exist.

What force is most prominent within a galactic cluster? What force is most prominent between galactic clusters? They are different.

Within our galactic cluster gravity is the driving force because of proximity. Remember the inverse square law.

Your "space expanding at the speed of light" is a rather silly misconception of the reality (the Hubble constant) so I won't bother with it.

At some point in the distance between galactic clusters the cumulative effects of H0 (multiple times 70 km/s/Mpc) exceeds the gravitational constant (G) in the relativity equations and the galactic groups separate while within each local group (closer together, inverse square, stronger gravity) the galaxies continue to close together.

The elephant is still in the room and is stepping on your toes, Reverend.

Space between the Milky Way and Andromeda is not expanding but contracting.

That's right, bunkie. Milky Way, Andromeda, Triangulum and somewhere close to 100 other smaller galaxies (the Local Group) are all gravitationally bound and coming together while this whole local group of galaxies speeds away from every other group of galaxies.

If the fabric of the universe is being stretched in both directions from the halfway point between Andromeda and the Milky Way the space between them would be increasing by 88.234 miles per second.

How would they ever collide?

Easy. Get your math right and your physics right and your question is answered.

All those years, all that learning and you still haven't grasped these simple concepts. ICANT, you cannot continue to misrepresent the reality.

Since your message was not to me and I corrected your factual bs I'll leave your belief bs to others.

Edited by AZPaul3, : No reason given.


Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 193 by ICANT, posted 07-31-2021 1:57 AM ICANT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 217 by ICANT, posted 08-01-2021 12:28 AM AZPaul3 has replied
 Message 224 by Phat, posted 08-01-2021 6:33 AM AZPaul3 has taken no action

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 6738
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 2.9


Message 225 of 586 (887350)
08-01-2021 6:53 AM
Reply to: Message 216 by ICANT
07-31-2021 11:47 PM


Re: Get Real.
I have the same evidence you do.

There was an eternal light period that ended when darkness began to exist.
That light period is what is seen today and called the CMBR.

Wasn't very eternal if it ended.

First, Reverend, any differing interpretations you care to fantasize on the evidence outside the consensus is not accepted because you have no standing to make any such interpretations. Your opinions on physics and cosmology are uneducated, uninformed, religiously-based and hold no explanatory powers.

Second, You can show no evidence that anything eternal ever existed or does exist. Your eternal light period is a crock.

There is a energy force that holds the universe together.

The universe and earth are going to melt in fervent heat sometime in the future.

Actually, there is an energy force that is blowing this universe apart in an accelerating expansion of spacetime and the expected long-term results will be the death of the universe by freezing. Eventually, the last photon will be expanded out of existence. The Heat Death of the universe.

A reasonable speculation based on what we know but still pending more evidence.

The flaming death you cite will indeed happen but on the much smaller scale of this solar system, not the scale of the whole universe. Our sun will become a red giant and will swell up to the point of engulfing earth within its superheated plasma. But the universe will mosey on sans Earth, sans humanity, sans god for uncountable trillions upon trillions of millennia yet to come.

Now if you don't believe it took a unlimited energy source to produce everything in the universe tell me what did produce it.

What does it take to build a universe like ours? Nobody knows, ICANT. Especially not you or any of your religious colleagues.

Whatever that energy source was is what I call God. I have heard it called the God Particle, and Cosmic egg. Neither of those 2 have ever been found.

Oh, good god. What a fuckin' mess.

The "God Particle" is the media-hyped-up stupidity-name for the Higgs boson. The various Higgs fields have to do with the property of particle mass not some fantasy eternal energy field. Of course a god particle does not exist. It's a media created fiction. And you didn't know this? Everyone looking at the history knew this.

The cosmic egg idea is an offshoot from Georges Lemaître and his primeval atom hypothesis and if you understood Lemaître's writing then, yes, we have "found" the primal cosmic egg since we live within it.

You operate on a whole big bunch of misinformation and misconceptions. It's a wonder to me how you can not know sooo much.


Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 216 by ICANT, posted 07-31-2021 11:47 PM ICANT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 227 by Phat, posted 08-01-2021 6:59 AM AZPaul3 has replied
 Message 241 by ICANT, posted 08-02-2021 11:41 PM AZPaul3 has replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 6738
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 2.9


Message 228 of 586 (887353)
08-01-2021 7:08 AM
Reply to: Message 217 by ICANT
08-01-2021 12:28 AM


Re: Get Real.
The reality is that space is contracting between Andromeda and the Milky Way.

No. This is the most stupid thing i've read in many months.

When you drive to the store do you say the space, the road, between your car and the store is contracting?

Our local group is gravitationally bound. That overrides the force of the expansion.

You didn't read or comprehend the explanation I gave in my message, did you!

You can't comprehend this stuff. Why are you arguing? Just to look stupid?


Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 217 by ICANT, posted 08-01-2021 12:28 AM ICANT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 243 by ICANT, posted 08-03-2021 12:20 AM AZPaul3 has replied

  
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